Axles for Rocks

[junkxj]

Awsome write up! The big reason the can hold up to 1000+HP in the Viper & Vette is because there IRS and have no wieght on them. Also a Viper wieghs 2,000 lbs. less than a ZJ and larger tires don't help either.

Last time I checked a viper dosnt weigh 2400 lbs. Much closer to 3400 lbs. But I do see what your saying, that the center section in a car sees diffrent types of stress than in a jeep.

 

[explorer]

Awsome write up! The big reason the can hold up to 1000+HP in the Viper & Vette is because there IRS and have no wieght on them. Also a Viper wieghs 2,000 lbs. less than a ZJ and larger tires don't help either.

I've seen my friends ZJ scale under 5000 w/ lots of extra weight being carried. The Viper curb weight is @3500. The fact that the Viper or Vette is IRS has no bearing on the capacity of the gearset. It doesn't carry weight. The hsg. yes. I filled a 12" cube box full of junk brgs. from these every week for about a year straight. They had some brg. problems that were easily remedied. But in quite a few years, I never saw one break or otherwise damage a gearset, or shaft, or hsg for that matter.

 

[mavrick]

thanks bro, ive been debating 33's or 35's locked on a chrysler 8.25. hello 33's

 

[XJ_ranger]

It will not be stronger than a LP9" because anytime you put a HP axle in the rear, the axle will run on the "Coast" side of the ring gear, just like it will if you run a LP as your front axle. It is nice that True Hi9 has come out with this stuff as it gives a nice alternative, gearing, and strength increase to the Currie HP stuff. Now Currie has some competition. :laugh3:

Troy

do you read? they dont use the coast side of the gear - its a special gear for the application...

The TrueHi9 folks have addressed this by having Richmond cut a true 9" reverse spiral gearset for them.

 

[Big Red]

do you read? they dont use the coast side of the gear - its a special gear for the application...

That doesn't make sense. All HP applications will lose strength when used as a rear axle, as will a LP in the front. They are referring to the fact that their gear is a true 9" HP, not the 8.8 gearset that was previously available through places like Currie.

 

[NXJ]

Nice Thread. One question, who makes 46 spline shafts for D60s ?
Ohh, we must add portalaxles. The "guide" wouldnt be unflawed without them :laugh3:

 

[CRASH]

The True Hi9 has no tire limit. I ordered mine last week, & in speaking to them, they're confident that the True Hi9 is stronger than any LP60, HP60, or LP9. Don't know if I believe it or not, a guess time will tell.

Paul

Paul, I'm sure the housing has no limit, but my limit's are based mostly on shaft strength. If you run a 40 spline shaft, you can run whatever mass of rubber you like.

The TrueHi9 still runs on the coast side in the rear, the special-ness of the R&P is that no one has ever made a reverse spiral 9" set. So, it will be stronger running in the front, but with the case improvements adding stiffness to the R&P, it should be better than most RS rear apps. In talking to the TrueHi9 folks, they related that it was impossible to cost-effectivley make a reverse spiral gear set that was mirror cut so it would run on the drive side of the gear. The machines to do it simply don't exist at this point.

CRASH

 

[Capt. Nemo]

From TrueHi9's website:

5. Running on the coast side. Why? Because we have no choice. No gear manufacturers in America have a machine set up to cut them the other way. Can it be done? Possibly, but the cost of building the machine couldn't be offset with enough volume just supplying the offroad community. Can it be done overseas? Probably, but then you have a lesser quality gear set and most of the increased cost.

6. Are all high pinion rears running on the coast side of the gears? Yes. Is running on the coast side weaker? Sure. Can it be overcome? Yes. Why is it weaker, the teeth are the same size? There has been reference to the concave/convex shape of the teeth but when the ring gear is convex the pinion is concave and vice versa plus this curve in most Ford 9" and Dana 60 ring gear teeth is pretty slight. So the answer lies in the fact that the drive sides of the teeth are at close to a 90 degree angle to the direction they're pushing which doesn't create most of the ring and pinion horizontal separation forces associated with running on the coast side. What happens when the ring and pinion separate is the teeth run tip to tip instead of center of tooth to center of tooth. Can we control these separation forces? Sure. Just think of holding the pinion head on both ends of it with a 3rd bearing compared to holding it with just 2 bearings when these separation forces are at work. Now try to control the ring gear forces 3 inches away from where they are occuring instead of with a thrustblock like heavy duty rearends use including the monster trucks you see jumping and landing throttled up. I've had monster truck 3rd members in my shop and believe me they have a thrustbolt. People have called me with busted high pinion rear Dana 60's that have two distinct wear patterns on the teeth, one where they normally run and one where they run when they are under a load which is at the tooth tips where there is less material. The thrustblock in our differential virtually eliminates this ring gear deflection. Add that to the fact that a Dana 60 starts out with either less tooth thickness or less overall tooth contact and which do you think is going to break first?

Here's the direct link: http://www.truehi9.com/gears2.html

It is possible to search for information OUTSIDE of ...

 

[Root Moose]

Now that the ARB is available for the Corp 14B I'm quite jazzed about that axle.

Cheap locally: ~$500CDN.

For that you get a full float axle with a huge ring and pinion. It's massive but nothing that a shave and retrofitting disks can't fix.

For the price of a D60 out of the junk yard now you can get a C14B and an air locker (more or less).

Pretty exciting stuff to me.

But of course, all the "cool kids" run 60s.

r@m

 

[Paul S]

It will not be stronger than a LP9" because anytime you put a HP axle in the rear, the axle will run on the "Coast" side of the ring gear, just like it will if you run a LP as your front axle. It is nice that True Hi9 has come out with this stuff as it gives a nice alternative, gearing, and strength increase to the Currie HP stuff. Now Currie has some competition. :laugh3:

Troy

The coast side of the R&P isn't inherently weaker than the drive side, what makes driving on the coast side weaker is the increased deflection. With True Hi9's case design, added pinion support & thrust block there's no deflection. For someone like yourself that really plans to play hard, there's a option for a second thrust block.
In truth I don't know anyone that could break an LP or HP 9 R&P, but since the yoke is part of the 3 member, & an LP 9 yoke is a huge liability, the HP 9 is stronger :wave:

Paul

 

[BIGWOODY]

Great post...I'll offer only this , My buddy runs a 5000lb tube buggy (yes, it's heavy) with mogs and 47 goodyears with a injected 350/203/205doubler and beats it pretty hard. Everything we've read gives portals (mogs anyway) a strenght rating somewhere in the D70 neighborhood. That being said, If the portals are narrowed we are told they become weaker (several friends that have run portals in both fashions in comp.) As to why they get weaker when narrowed, I can't offer an answer, just quoting from experince.Again nice job on the post I'm sure it'll help many.
P.S. I can't break my LP9" with 31 spline shafts/nodular case/detriot/5.14/ stroker/ 38.5 sx and a big ass foot.

 

[ROBZ95Xj]

It's realy all comes down to how you drive it. The guy that owns the local 4x4 shop gots a YJ with DANA 44's front and rear, 37" boggers, 5spd. and a iroc 350 with tuned port injection. I've never seen it with broken axles and I know he dos'nt take it easy on it.

 

[TORX]

Ok what about those cool new Hyrbrid 9"/D60 and Hybrid 9"/14B what advantages or disadvantages do you get from running these over basic 9". You can get 40 spline in both so ring and pinion strength and ground clearance?

TORX

 

[wigeon]

Quick questions:

1) Are you saying tire size is limited to your front (assuming its smallest) axel?
So my stock axels on my 98 XJ should only go to 31's since I have a D35 front and DC 8.25 29 rear. or would I be clear for 33's

2) What gearing assumtions are you making when you recomend tire size? I thought that it was the higher gearing that determines the limitation. ie as you go from 3.x to 4.56 your gears get weaker and can't handle the larger tire, and stress that goes along with it.

 

[ROBZ95Xj]

Hey Wigeon, you got a Dana 30 up front but with the 29 spline 8.25 rear you will be fine with 33's and maybe 35's depending on your driving style.

 

[BrettM]

The True Hi9 has no tire limit. I ordered mine last week,
Paul

:drool:

35 spline w/ Detroit?

so when are you gonna get that HP8"/D44 hybrid? :laugh3:

 

[BrettM]

Ok what about those cool new Hyrbrid 9"/D60 and Hybrid 9"/14B what advantages or disadvantages do you get from running these over basic 9". You can get 40 spline in both so ring and pinion strength and ground clearance?

TORX

SeanP has a 9"/14b, you get full-floater and 8 lug with the 14b hubs and good ground-clearance and lightweight with the 9" center.

 

[Paul S]

:drool:

35 spline w/ Detroit?

so when are you gonna get that HP8"/D44 hybrid? :laugh3:

I decided to put my rear Currie HP9 up front (44 outers). I couldn't bring myself to spend $1500 for an HP Toy 3rd when I already have an HP9 that I can use. It's still costing way too much...

Paul

 

[CRASH]

I decided to put my rear Currie HP9 up front (44 outers). I couldn't bring myself to spend $1500 for an HP Toy 3rd when I already have an HP9 that I can use. It's still costing way too much...

Paul

What's a few grand? It's only money.

Luckily, you're not sending it to URF for suspension work. The bill for that comes in a BIG envelope.

CRASH

 

[85xjwoody]

This is some great info from everybody!!! I am replacing my engine, axles, and other major things on my wagoneer. Now I am able to better my decision on what axles to get. I have access to an 8.8 out of a ranger for $50. I will probably keep my d30 up front for now. I am only running a 2.5 inline four with a couple of mods on it. I really need to get rid of the d35. I have gone through two d35's already with a very heavy foot in the mud. Spider gears always went out. Again thanks for the info everyone.