Axles for Rocks

[XJ_ranger]

This is some great info from everybody!!! I am replacing my engine, axles, and other major things on my wagoneer. Now I am able to better my decision on what axles to get. I have access to an 8.8 out of a ranger for $50. I will probably keep my d30 up front for now. I am only running a 2.5 inline four with a couple of mods on it. I really need to get rid of the d35. I have gone through two d35's already with a very heavy foot in the mud. Spider gears always went out. Again thanks for the info everyone.

not to bust your buble - but the 8.8s out of the ranger are 28 spline and about 6" to narrow for an XJ application -

 

[85xjwoody]

This axle is coming from a ranger with the 4.0 and reversed d35 up front and 8.8 in the rear. The person told me that it would be an inch narrower. If he is wrong then what year and what model ford would have what I need to under my 85 woody? I have access to a junkyard for cheep axles but there are more ford explorers and rangers in there than jeeps for the d44 or 8.25. Any info would be great.

 

[NXJ]

Everything we've read gives portals (mogs anyway) a strenght rating somewhere in the D70 neighborhood.

Okay, I want to "clear" this up some: When you guys refer to "Mogs" its usualy about the 404 axles. I *think* its made about 20 (It might be much more) different kind of UMG axles. The earliest kind (We are talking 1950s :guitar of UMG axles is comparable with "the" D35. The later ones you can find under for example 437s is bulletproof. Ill guess theyre rated as a 6 (+) ton axle. But, yes the UMG 404s is in the "D70-neighborhood" (Im guessing they are a tad stronger though). ...So please be a little more precise when refering to Mogs (No offence, folks)

BTW, I really like your MJ !

 

[Whitetail]

You missed two good axles. The AMC 20 frm the FSJ's. And the Chryco 8.25. One comes stock in the XJ's.

 

[scoobyxj]

This axle is coming from a ranger with the 4.0 and reversed d35 up front and 8.8 in the rear. The person told me that it would be an inch narrower. If he is wrong then what year and what model ford would have what I need to under my 85 woody? I have access to a junkyard for cheep axles but there are more ford explorers and rangers in there than jeeps for the d44 or 8.25. Any info would be great.

Try the explodres. A buddy of mine has done some reserch on them. Only 3/4 in narrower. Although I never asked him what year he was reserching if it matters.

 

[BrettM]

You missed two good axles. The AMC 20 frm the FSJ's. And the Chryco 8.25. One comes stock in the XJ's.

the chryco 8.25 was not missed, it's in the initial post.

the AMC 20 with 1 piece shafts from either an older (86 only?) MJ or FSJ is a possible swap and could perhaps be covered in more detail. my understanding is they are limited to 4.56 as the deepest ratio and are about D44 strength.

 

[ashmanjeepxj]

Gearing, Weight and Power determing what you can explode, from my experience in that order.

Light toyota bugges, with little old 22R engines, 4:1 and a sceond t-case (200:1 low range) and small 37in tires can bust 1ton axles if bound up easily.
To resist torque (gearing) you need larger diameter shafts.

If your rig wieghs alot you need a full floating axle, other wise your rig weight side loads the axle shaft in addition to the torque loads. Worst case: if you get hopping on a loose hill climb, your torque load and weight load will cycle at the same time and eventually bust your shaft. This is why a ford 9 with 35 splind shaft is much weaker then a full floater with 35 spline shafts like a d70, d80, 14bolt, 10.24, or modified d60 or d61.
All front axles are full floaters the spindles support the weight not the shafts.

Power really dosent matter, if your bound up it will brake if your motor does not stall. Weight really dosent matter once you have a full floater, more weight makes it easier to get bound up and that DOES MATTER.

If your bound up back off, Is you have a semi float and are bouncing alot backoff, if your spinning GEEET-IT.

 

[Whitetail]

the chryco 8.25 was not missed, it's in the initial post.

the AMC 20 with 1 piece shafts from either an older (86 only?) MJ or FSJ is a possible swap and could perhaps be covered in more detail. my understanding is they are limited to 4.56 as the deepest ratio and are about D44 strength.

Ahh, missed it because it was hiding behind the dana one. But i believe the AMC 20 with one peice is as strong or a bit stronger than the dana 44.

 

[CRASH]

Ahh, missed it because it was hiding behind the dana one. But i believe the AMC 20 with one peice is as strong or a bit stronger than the dana 44.

29 spline axles are not stronger than 30 spline axles of like material, no matter if they are one piece or two piece.

CRASH

 

[ashmanjeepxj]

Toyota 8": 35's with a locker, 36's without a locker. I'm always very impressed by Toyota quality, they are worlds ahead in quality control and tolerances. The Toy 8" uses the same shafts as a Dana 44, 30 spline, but with a bunch more ground clearance.. The case is more rigid, and has a bit more hypoid offset too, which helps in R&P strength. The Toy guys flog this axle pretty hard with 37's, but I have seen enough break with that size tire under 22RE 4 cylinder power to make me keep the limits at D-44 levels for a much torquier 4.0.

Toyota tech?

The V6 Equiped toyota 8in Third member is stronger stronger then the 4 cylinder versions. You can swap a v6 third into the 4 cylinder housing. PRe 86 toyota minitruck axles are narrower then 86+. Only the narrow pre 86 tucks had soilc fronts. The V6 Engine option was only offered 86+. I think the PRE 84 front axles have less axle tube support and easily bend so 84-85 are ideal front housings.Fj80 offers upgrade parts for toyota axles, one of the loacal guys runs his tubo charged propane 4 cylinder with 42s and FJ80 hybred axles. I am really impressed it holds up, I wouldent trust it but he does get it and has not broek yet

Stock toyota mini truck front axle birfiled joints (like U-joints) suck. They will only hold up to like 33s on a yota so like 31s on a heavy XJ. You toss in some after market smirf fields, or Long field joints with stock shafts and they will hold up to 35s. The fronts are solid after adding alloy shaft and after market birfs, could hold up to 37s on an XJ body weight. Putting 86+ ifs hubs and V6 brakes on the narrow front axle will make it as wide as the 86+ rear axles. I run the 89 V6 dual piston calipers and 1980 FJ40 vented rotors on a 85 front and it hooks up!

The rears hold up to 35s or at least 33s on an XJ stock, I would be hesitent to add Chromoly shafts to a rear semi float the side loading of the vehicle weight might brake the saft more easily then the softer factory shafts. IMO.

A Toyota front is easily upgradeable better clearance then a d44 but the closed knuckles make it have a not as good a turning radius as the open knuckle d44. I also like being able to see the axle joint on an open knuckle so you knwo what broke when it goes pop. If a Bif brakes it will bind up the steering and is extremely dangerious to drive home on the street. If a rear shaft brakes the flang my hold the the wheel on but could fall off.

 

[CRASH]

Gearing, Weight and Power determing what you can explode, from my experience in that order.

Light toyota bugges, with little old 22R engines, 4:1 and a sceond t-case (200:1 low range) and small 37in tires can bust 1ton axles if bound up easily.
To resist torque (gearing) you need larger diameter shafts.

If your rig wieghs alot you need a full floating axle, other wise your rig weight side loads the axle shaft in addition to the torque loads. Worst case: if you get hopping on a loose hill climb, your torque load and weight load will cycle at the same time and eventually bust your shaft. This is why a ford 9 with 35 splind shaft is much weaker then a full floater with 35 spline shafts like a d70, d80, 14bolt, 10.24, or modified d60 or d61.
All front axles are full floaters the spindles support the weight not the shafts.

Power really dosent matter, if your bound up it will brake if your motor does not stall. Weight really dosent matter once you have a full floater, more weight makes it easier to get bound up and that DOES MATTER.

If your bound up back off, Is you have a semi float and are bouncing alot backoff, if your spinning GEEET-IT.

I'd like to see some data on this. Torsional loads affect shafts differently than bending loads. I've seen plenty of full float 30 spline Dana 60 shafts break, probably because they are 30 years old, but they break differently than semi-float shafts. Semi float shafts, in my experiece seem to be MORE durable than FF, maybe because they flex more under bouncing loads.

There are about 1 million variables to why shafts break, it's an interesting mental exercise to ponder the causes.

CRASH

BTW, thanks for the hydro steer links, putting my parts together now.....

 

[fizassist]

Great writeup Crash, thanks for taking the time.
B.

Big +1

 

[Paul S]

Speaking of FF's, how 'bout the trusted FF, stock 30 spline, D60 slingshot :laugh3:

Paul

 

[mullet427]

Big +1

and one more. Thanks a ton for taking the time and helpin guys like me out. Looking forward to more.

 

[Beej]

I noticed that portal axles haven't been mentioned too much. High dollar, but I'd love to tool around on something like these:

Unimog 404 with disk conversion.

 

[BIGWOODY]

I noticed that portal axles haven't been mentioned too much. High dollar, but I'd love to tool around on something like these:

Unimog 404 with disk conversion.

Actually about 2 grand buys a set around here...not bad considering I got over 4 grand in my front hp60 and its a "junkyard "axle.

 

[explorer]

How about some comparisons between cv shafts and u-joint shafts in the frt. axle. Toyota uses them, and some of the specialty ones seem to hold up as well as the u-joint shafts. And also, unit brgs compared to lockouts on a spindle. I have my own opinions which seen to be unpopular, but does anyone have any actual data to support the popular opinion?

 

[85xjwoody]

I have an 85 xj wagoneer with the cv shafts instead of the u-joints. I run a 2.5 inline four cylinder and have had no problems. I am pretty heavy on the gas and have not broke a cv shaft yet. I would rather have the cv verses the u-joint for the turning radius. When in four wheel drive turning hard left or right there is no binding like I have noticed on u-joint shafts. On most u-joint shafts that I have seen when turning in four wheel drive the front jumps and the cv does not. So in my opinion if you don't have alot of power and torque the cv is better than u-joint for turning and binding on turns. I have alot of experience with the cv and u-joint setups and in my application would prefer the cv shaft. Just giving my opinion on this matter. Hope it helps out some.

 

[explorer]

Same here, but I've been running the cv shafts in my TJ for two years now. This is with 32 TSL radials, locked frt. axle, and 4.10's. I don't go easy on it in any way, but I'm also not stupid with the throttle. If it isn't moving and starts bouncing, I quit. I will say though that I can spin the tires at a very high rate of speed at full lock with no vibration at all. I've broken one of the OEM cv shafts in two years. Prior to that, I would use up u-joints pretty quickly, and end up distorting the yokes. I never broke one, but I watched the shafts closely, and when the caps would get loose, I would replace them.

 

[bustercat]

Great axle Crash! How's the front axle tech article coming? Good stuff. I know that if the axles can live in the rocks, they can live in mud that is more forgiving.