220V outlet in garage

[GottaBeJeep]

Moved into a new house last month, and trying to get my garage in order. I'm no electrician, and need a 220 outlet in the garage for my welders and compressor. The fuse box is in the garage. Anyone with the know how to provide me with info to hook this up? It has to be safe. I don't want to burn the house down, especially with a 3 year old and a 3 month old. I have done some searching, but didn't come up with anything useful. Have read about extension cords to the laundry and the kitchen, but I don't know how I feel about that for safety. The laundry is right next to the garage, so a 15ft extension is more than enough, but the kitchen would need about 30 ft, and would trip everyone walking through the house. I need to get this put together ASAP, so any help would be appreciated.

 

[cmotsvt]

If you dont know what youre doing then pay someone to do it properly. DO NOT use an extension cord, thats just asking for trouble, im not even sure whats avaliable for 230v extension plugs..

 

[Menzenski]

http://www.lowes.com/lowes/lkn?action=howTo&p=Improve/220outlet.html

 

[GottaBeJeep]

If you dont know what youre doing then pay someone to do it properly. DO NOT use an extension cord, thats just asking for trouble, im not even sure whats avaliable for 230v extension plugs..

I plan to have someone do it, I just like to know what is involved to make sure it gets done right and to be able to explain what I need done. I do not want to use an extension cord due to safety and hassle of running a cord into the house, but just wanted to mention that I had read about it and that I didn't feel too safe about it. I don't get along too well with electricity so I have no intentions of doing it myself.

 

[PARROTHEAD007]

How Big Is The Electrical Panel In The House? 100 Or 200 Amp?
Look On The Main Breaker And It Will Tell The Size.
You're Better Off To See If The Electrician Can Set A Sub Panel In The Garage To Feed Both Of Them. If Money Is An Issue, They Could Just Set A 220 Receptacle For You, But You Would Have To Keep Unplugging One Or The Other.
Let Me Know If You Need Anything Else, I'd Do It For You But I'm In Michigan......bye The Way,i Am An Electrician By Trade

 

[GottaBeJeep]

I guess it is a 100 amp.

Here are the pictures

 

[PARROTHEAD007]

The Panel Is A 100 Amp. Looks Pretty Full.
Depending On What Is Running In The House, You May Not Be Able To Use The Range While Using The Recep. In The Garage.
An Amperage Draw Would Need To Be Done To See How Much Everything Is Pulling Current Wise.

 

[thecozmo65]

Im gonna quess and say that you air compressor is most likely 20 amp. Is the welder a stick welder or a wire feed? If its a stick you will need a seperate 50 amp feed. Most wire feed welders i think are 20 amp, but even so I dont think I would want, personaly, them both on the same breaker. You will need to have space in your breaker panel for probably two circuits. Both of those circuits will need to be fed from double pole breakers so you will need four open spaces. They will need to be either four in a row verticaly or two on one side and two on the other. If you have any more questions Ill do my best to help.

 

[thecozmo65]

Honestly If youre serious about adding anything electrical to your house then I would ditch the whole pannel and upgrade your service to atleast 200 amp if not residential 400. Youre pannel is already overstocked. You look to be running 18 circuits in a 12 circuit pannel. You see how each breaker has two handles? Those are whats called piggyback breakers. Bassicaly what they do is take one blade on the bus bar that is ment to feed one circuit and splits it for two. I personaly would not feel too comfortable with that setup.

 

[GottaBeJeep]

The welders are MIG; Lincoln 175 and Miller 210, the compressor is this: http://www.sears.com/sr/javasr/product.do?BV_UseBVCookie=Yes&vertical=TOOL&pid=00918419000

 

[Goatman]

Really, what you want to do is very simple. I've done exactly what you're talking about on my last two houses, to do exactly what you're going to do, run the 220V welder and compressor.

You'll need a 40-50 amp double pole breaker, the receptacle boxes and receptacles for the type of plugs you have on the compressor and welder, and enough wire to run to where you'll put the receptacles. You can ask one of the guys at Lowe's or Home Depot and they can tell you what wire size you need. In fact, they can probably tell you how to do what you want to do.

This is basic directions. Remove the front panel on the breaker box, knock out one of those remaining square plugs where you want the breaker to go, install the double pole breaker. Run a wire from each pole on the breaker to each of the connectors on the receptacles, then a third wire from the ground plug connector on the receptacle back to the ground bar in the panel....it's the small, long bar with all the wires attached to it. Put it all back together and turn the main power back on. Of course, you have to route the wire, run it through conduit, or whatever else you need to do to get the outlets where you want them, but the actual wiring is simple.

Sure, you'd be better off with a 200 amp panel, but it's not necessary. Sure, you'd be better off with a 200 amp service and a sub panel inside the garage, but again, it's not necessary. Mine is exactly like yours, and I live where it's hot and the A/C runs in the summer, and I've never had a problem when welding and/or running the compressor.

Have fun,

 

[AJPulley]

As a licensed electrician and electrical instructor, I must intervene. First, that panel is filled with tandem breakers, which leads me to believe the reason the bottom two spaces aren't knocked out is there is no buss bar behind them. Some manufacturers use one cover for a few panels. If this is the case, you should not add any additional loads. Second, you may not run a compressor and welder off of one double pole breaker, if that's what you inferring. Those are dedicated circuits. Third, breaker selection is directly related to conductor sizing, which is selected for the current draw of the welder. Forth, a load calculation must be done on the house; there is no way to determine if a larger "service" is necessary as opposed to just a larger "panel" without doing so.


Gottabejeep, if you have any questions, please feel free to ask.

-AJ, MA Lic 10223B

 

[MudDawg]

If you have a buddy in the Air Conditioning or electrical trade, they will have a good clamp on amp meter....pull the cover...turn on all the lights, etc...and check the amperage on both wires going into the 100 amp main breaker...if the load was split properly, the amperage should be about the same.

If the constant load on that 100 amp breaker exceeds about 80 amps for very long it will overheat and trip.

If it turns out that you are out of space, but not capacity...you may be able to get a couple of piggyback breakers and double up two of the lighting circuits....freeing up two spaces for a double pole breaker. But whatever you do...make it meet code...a whole seperate discussion. The worst part will be routing the wire. I hate flush mount panels.

 

[AJPulley]

If you have a buddy in the Air Conditioning or electrical trade, they will have a good clamp on amp meter....pull the cover...turn on all the lights, etc...and check the amperage on both wires going into the 100 amp main breaker...if the load was split properly, the amperage should be about the same.

If the constant load on that 100 amp breaker exceeds about 80 amps for very long it will overheat and trip.

If it turns out that you are out of space, but not capacity...you may be able to get a couple of piggyback breakers and double up two of the lighting circuits....freeing up two spaces for a double pole breaker. But whatever you do...make it meet code...a whole seperate discussion. The worst part will be routing the wire. I hate flush mount panels.

This is incorrect. To correctly determine the load of a service, you must do some arithmetic per Article 220 of the National Electric Code. And, inverse time circuit breakers, which residential services contain as does the above service, do not trip upon reaching 80 percent, or 80 out of 100 amps, of their rated overcurrent protection. On the contrary, the delay between actual overcurrent and the device's prtection operation decreases as overcurrent increases after reaching the rated overcurrent.

Gentleman, unless this is your profession, 120/240 volt currents are not something to play around with. This is how fires start and lives are lost. Wiring is not a hobby.

-AJ, MA Lic 10223B, member International Assosiation of Electrical Inspectors.

 

[RCP Phx]

Your both partially correct,the code requires that no "overcurrent" device exeeds 80 percent of its nameplate rating (unless listed at 100 percent)for a period exeeding 3 hours.
25yrs IBEW,12yrs Elec.Insp.-IAEI

 

[MudDawg]

Refer to "But whatever you do.....make it meet code".