Track bar and bracket issue

[RCP Phx]

Not a very good pic but your angles look "close".

 

[Nomad Nate]

Not a very good pic but your angles look "close".

That’s a fair criticism on the photo. It’s pretty close now. The question for me is that will it be an issue if I change it out the IRO or different drop bracket. I definitely need to fix whatever is causing the creaking.


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[Nomad Nate]

First realize that the RE 1600 trackbar is one of the worst. I've had my RE 1660, 1665, and 1670 now for over twenty years!

Are there any other decent ones that don’t require a different bracket set up?


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[Evan03]

It looks like a heim joint bolted into the factory track bar location at frame end. If it is could be creaking be that heim is running at ride height with alot of missalignment.

Angles do look close. Youd have to use some kind of straight edge to measure angle on each to make sure they are close like they look.

Could also make noise at track bar axle end if bolt is moving in a wallowed out bolt hole.


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[Nomad Nate]

It looks like a heim joint bolted into the factory track bar location at frame end. If it is could be creaking be that heim is running at ride height with alot of missalignment.

Angles do look close. Youd have to use some kind of straight edge to measure angle on each to make sure they are close like they look.

Could also make noise at track bar axle end if bolt is moving in a wallowed out bolt hole.


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Thanks. Here’s a better shot of the joint. The noise went away when I lubed the heim but maybe there’s something wallowed like you suggested and it’s just apparent at the joint.

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[Tim_MN]

The question for me is that will it be an issue if I change it out the IRO or different drop bracket. I definitely need to fix whatever is causing the creaking.

At 3.5 inches of lift I installed the RE 1600. It worked, but I was not impressed with the durability of the frame side heim joint, and later discovered that the frame mount hardware and the stock frame bracket suffered from excessive wear and were creaking.

I replaced the RE 1600 with the IRO Double Shear. Many years, and many off-road miles later, and along with 2 additional inches of lift, the IRO set-up continues to work great.

With 5.5 inches of lift I still have the stock pitman arm, and I have driven the 1280 miles to Moab Utah, spent a week on the 4x4 trails, and then driven 1280 miles home again four times. On Monday I drive to work.

 

[Evan03]

That heim is running neither flat thats good. Im not a fan of that set up since its in single shear.
The bend in the bar makes it work well it looks like.
Im getting about 2 years out of track bar heim joints no idea how many miles that is. On my pickup on on nearly 100k on my heim track bar 6 years. The jeep goes through them fast guess its the trails

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[Anak]

For what it is worth, I am running that same track bar, with the same heim joint, but in double shear. I simply added a Core 4x4 frame side track bar bracket, a couple misalignment spacers, a grade 8 bolt and some grade 8 washers to take up the rest of the extra space in the Core 4x4 bracket. It works fine, and has done so for over 5 years.

Another option would be to add a Johnny Joint to go along with the Core 4x4 bracket. I figure that is where I am going when the heim joint gives it up.

 

[maxbraketorque]

Thanks. Here’s a better shot of the joint. The noise went away when I lubed the heim but maybe there’s something wallowed like you suggested and it’s just apparent at the joint.
...

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With that heim joint having such a huge standoff from the mounting bracket, the bolt is not even operating in single shear. Its just straight up bending load. I would change the bracket right away. If you continue to use that particular heim, then a double shear is the way to go.

 

[gearwhine]

Figured I'd throw my trackbar in here...maybe it'll help.... maybe it's just arbitrary information.

I run a fairly low lift, and there were no double sheer track bars that I could find that fit my needs (and weren't extremely expensive) to clear the pumpkin on compression. I decided to try my game at modifying the stock bar....

I did that by welding on an HD (3/4") Rubicon express joint after cutting off the frame side tie-rod end. I didn't need that much mis-alignment, but what I got was a 3/4" bolt for the single sheer application and a rebuildable joint. I angled the joint upwards at ride height as I have more droop than up travel. The large joint just clears the pumpkin about about 3/8" at full compression

I then used some 1" threaded rod and some 1.25" 0.120" wall tubing to to make the adjustments sleeve. I then sleeved those butt joints with 1.5" .120" wall (I don't think it was required, but I felt safer doing that).

In the end, my front shocks are too long and I had to bump stop to save them. It kind of defeats the purpose of this entire endeavor at the moment....but I still like the set-up! It's been about 2k miles on it, with no issues.

 

[Nomad Nate]

Thanks everyone for all the advice. It’s very helpful. I pulled the bracket today and while the bracket looked ok there was some wallowing in the wheel well at the top of the bracket.

I’ve had issues with it wandering as I drive and since those were loose when I first got it. I had a mechanic friend and an alignment shop that specializes in 4x4’s check it out and no one could find the cause. Maybe this is it. So how do I fix that?

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[Anak]

You can drill things out to a larger size and use larger hardware.

You can weld undersized washers (or even just steel strap) over the holes and then drill them out to the size you want them to be.

Or you can weld the track bar bracket in place.

Best route is to first plate the front frame rails then bolt and weld in a double shear track bar bracket. Just know that once you have plated the frame rails you will need to elongate a couple of the holes in order to install the track bar bolts. You want to make sure you do that. The bolts are all important, even with the welding.

 

[Nomad Nate]

You can drill things out to a larger size and use larger hardware.

You can weld undersized washers (or even just steel strap) over the holes and then drill them out to the size you want them to be.

Or you can weld the track bar bracket in place.

Best route is to first plate the front frame rails then bolt and weld in a double shear track bar bracket. Just know that once you have plated the frame rails you will need to elongate a couple of the holes in order to install the track bar bolts. You want to make sure you do that. The bolts are all important, even with the welding.

Thanks. That all makes sense except I don't quite understand elongating the holes. This is all new to me though so I'm sure it will make sense once I start putting it together.

Would welding the nuts inside the engine compartment instead be an option? I don't weld so I'll have to take it somewhere. Just trying to simplify things since I don't have the new bracket yet.

 

[Anak]

The bolts on the side of the frame are horizontal. The bolts that come in from underneath (sort of in the engine bay) are vertical. Once you add 3/16" or more of frame plating on the outside of the frame you then move the bracket that much farther outboard. Now the bolts that need to come from underneath will no longer line up. You will need to slot the holes in the bracket in order to compensate for the thickness of the frame plating.

 

[maxbraketorque]

I'm not sure that the holes in the unibody rail are actually wallowed out. Isn't that factory slotting to aid in installation?

My concern is still the janky single shear bolt holding the heim joint to the track bar bracket. That looks scary. Since you can't weld, I recommend replacing the track bar bracket with a double shear setup. You might be able to continue using the current track bar, perhaps with a new heim. You'll need to measure the mounting width of that heim.

Whether you decide to stick with your current track bar bracket or get a new one, use some new grade 8 (SAE) or grade 10.9 (metric) bolts to hold the bracket to the unibody rail.

 

[Tim_MN]

Start with fresh non Chinese bolts and nuts, with proper torque. The holes are just barely worn out of round, I wouldn't get too concerned, and certainly would not start welding stuff.

I would very strongly recommend a double shear track bar and new heavy duty frame bracket. The one from IRO works great for me. You should do some research and see if a track bar mount reinforcement to the opposite side frame rail would fit, or would be beneficial.

I do not think plating the frame rails is necessary for 3 inch lift, unless you are doing some really radical off-roading.




Here is recent picture of my IRO double shear track bar with 5.5 inches of lift and non plated frame rails.

.

 

[Nomad Nate]

The bolts on the side of the frame are horizontal. The bolts that come in from underneath (sort of in the engine bay) are vertical. Once you add 3/16" or more of frame plating on the outside of the frame you then move the bracket that much farther outboard. Now the bolts that need to come from underneath will no longer line up. You will need to slot the holes in the bracket in order to compensate for the thickness of the frame plating.

That makes sense. It's probably not clear from my photos but the problem area on mine are the horizontal bolts that go through the wheel well into nuts below the air box. My plan was to have someone weld the plate or washers in the engine compartment so the bracket would still set flush.

Is that less solid or would that be a fine solution to avoid having to compensate the vertical holes.

 

[Nomad Nate]

I'm not sure that the holes in the unibody rail are actually wallowed out. Isn't that factory slotting to aid in installation?

My concern is still the janky single shear bolt holding the heim joint to the track bar bracket. That looks scary. Since you can't weld, I recommend replacing the track bar bracket with a double shear setup. You might be able to continue using the current track bar, perhaps with a new heim. You'll need to measure the mounting width of that heim.

Whether you decide to stick with your current track bar bracket or get a new one, use some new grade 8 (SAE) or grade 10.9 (metric) bolts to hold the bracket to the unibody rail.

Thanks. That's reassuring. I'm definitely replacing the bar and bracket with IRO one. The PO was pretty creative/sloppy so I'm changing hardware on everything I replace.

 

[Nomad Nate]

Start with fresh non Chinese bolts and nuts, with proper torque. The holes are just barely worn out of round, I wouldn't get too concerned, and certainly would not start welding stuff.

I would very strongly recommend a double shear track bar and new heavy duty frame bracket. The one from IRO works great for me. You should do some research and see if a track bar mount reinforcement to the opposite side frame rail would fit, or would be beneficial.

I do not think plating the frame rails is necessary for 3 inch lift, unless you are doing some really radical off-roading.




Here is recent picture of my IRO double shear track bar with 5.5 inches of lift and non plated frame rails.

.

Sounds good. I've been looking around for decent hardware but I can't find the right sized flanged nuts and bolts in 10.9 anywhere locally so I think I'll order from Fastenal unless someone has a better suggestion. They look to be 12m 1.75x40. I'd like to keep it correct as much as possible and avoid switching to SAE.

Also do you know the proper torque for these? My Haynes manual just list the bar to axel nut torque at 74 but I don't see anything for the bracket.

 

[maxbraketorque]

...
Here is recent picture of my IRO double shear track bar with 5.5 inches of lift and non plated frame rails.

Sorry, I have to go OT for a second - 31" tires?