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"Lawerence Welk" area--Legal to offroad?

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mako, lurch, manimal --

You made me laugh! I'm not a cop! When no one answered my posts from early May I just spent a few Friday afternoons making my own map. Now I'm even doing some trail work so one of the cooler routes can become passable (El Farra). It was more fun to explore and figure it out anyway than just read someone else's map. PM me and I'll give you my blog address with trip reports.

Guess I was too direct. But it seems kinda ludicrous to think that a cop has the time to worry about Welk so bad that he trolls the forums.

Everytime I go up, though, I wonder when the other shoe will fall and they start enforcing the signs again. I plan on completing my tour of all the best trails and before they put up gates.
Please do not make any trails out there easier. It sucks having a decently fun line made into a freeway because someone didn't have the talent or rig to clear it. Nothing more annoying than having to unstack rocks....
Not implying that's what you're doing, but figured it was worth saying.
 
It's not a designated OHV area. However, nobody has a problem with people being out there, as long as there is no shenanigans. They reserve the right to kick us out. This is from an officer who used to wheel out there a lot till he sold his Scout.
However, i do believe it's a bad idea to make/publish maps, or make the place more well known than it is. If there are hundreds of people out there a day, the residents will complain.
 
If you are going to go into a questionable area, the least I can say is to leave the place better than you found it. Pack it in, pack it out... and pack out any obvious garbage and trash that others have left behind.

There is a local road here in my town that is a well known illegal wheeling location. The land off one side is completely illegal, being a wildlife management area, yet local troublemakers constantly rip it up. The land off the other side, my club has written permission for as long as we pay the daily use fee (which is reasonable.) Troublemakers still rip it up. I've found unattended bonfires surrounded by dozens of scattered beer bottles and cans a few times. The road down the middle is legally a public town road and is even on the map, it is a common area where many shady locals do their illegal dumping. I often run up and down that road for fun (we don't have any wide open desert type areas to do go-fast in...) and I used to get the evil eye from residents a LOT. Then they started noticing that I always went in with an empty bed and came out with a few junk tires, or a couch, or a bed heaped with trash, and I haven't been glared at since then. A few even wave now.

I would still recommend either getting written permission or staying on any public rights of way within the property, really. But being viewed as part of the solution instead of part of the problem (visibly carrying more debris out than was brought in) can go a long way toward a positive public opinion and IMO that can lead to more access as opposed to less.

Hell, maybe you guys could get a deal with the owners, they put dumpsters in some secured nearby location and you're allowed to run the trails as long as you hold a monthly cleanup day or something.
 
That area could use a lot of cleanup. If you could run point to contact the landowners and organize a large cleanup to get rid of garbage and abandoned vehicles a lot of good could be done to goodwill toward us.

Getting rid of the graffiti would also be nice but a bit more difficult.
 
If you are going to go into a questionable area, the least I can say is to leave the place better than you found it. Pack it in, pack it out... and pack out any obvious garbage and trash that others have left behind.

There is a local road here in my town that is a well known illegal wheeling location. The land off one side is completely illegal, being a wildlife management area, yet local troublemakers constantly rip it up. The land off the other side, my club has written permission for as long as we pay the daily use fee (which is reasonable.) Troublemakers still rip it up. I've found unattended bonfires surrounded by dozens of scattered beer bottles and cans a few times. The road down the middle is legally a public town road and is even on the map, it is a common area where many shady locals do their illegal dumping. I often run up and down that road for fun (we don't have any wide open desert type areas to do go-fast in...) and I used to get the evil eye from residents a LOT. Then they started noticing that I always went in with an empty bed and came out with a few junk tires, or a couch, or a bed heaped with trash, and I haven't been glared at since then. A few even wave now.

I would still recommend either getting written permission or staying on any public rights of way within the property, really. But being viewed as part of the solution instead of part of the problem (visibly carrying more debris out than was brought in) can go a long way toward a positive public opinion and IMO that can lead to more access as opposed to less.

Hell, maybe you guys could get a deal with the owners, they put dumpsters in some secured nearby location and you're allowed to run the trails as long as you hold a monthly cleanup day or something.

That won't ever happen.

The land is owned by a developer, who has tried to bulldoze it and build a housing tract. They have been blocked by local interests many times.

They aren't interested in the liability of having a sanctioned 4wd event/cleanup out there. It's been attempted by some local clubs.

It gets used a a trash dump and a stolen vehicle dump pretty regularly. In fact, there was a recently stolen rig in there last weekend, which was reported by our group.
 
The developer may not care about unauthorized access to the property. If he's trying to procure development rights from the local government, it doesn't really make sense to keep the area pristine. The promise of cleaning up a blighted/abused property is often used as a talking point when development projects receive public opposition.

Pristine open land also attracts anti-development eco-warriors. You know... "Save the Blue Bellied Gnat Catcher!" etc. That's not good if you're in the development business.

Even if this was the case, the owner wouldn't give tacit approval of access to the property. He'd just make little to no effort to restrict access.

I don't know anything about this particular property...just offering up a theory based on my experience in land use issues.
 
That won't ever happen.

The land is owned by a developer, who has tried to bulldoze it and build a housing tract. They have been blocked by local interests many times.

They aren't interested in the liability of having a sanctioned 4wd event/cleanup out there. It's been attempted by some local clubs.

It gets used a a trash dump and a stolen vehicle dump pretty regularly. In fact, there was a recently stolen rig in there last weekend, which was reported by our group.
where do you get this info from?
It's water district property for the most part. And i got that straight from an employee who was out there grading the roads.
 
That won't ever happen.

The land is owned by a developer, who has tried to bulldoze it and build a housing tract. They have been blocked by local interests many times.

They aren't interested in the liability of having a sanctioned 4wd event/cleanup out there. It's been attempted by some local clubs.

It gets used a a trash dump and a stolen vehicle dump pretty regularly. In fact, there was a recently stolen rig in there last weekend, which was reported by our group.

Was the stolen rig that relatively new Ford truck, north of the east end of the runway?
 
Please do not make any trails out there easier. It sucks having a decently fun line made into a freeway because someone didn't have the talent or rig to clear it. Nothing more annoying than having to unstack rocks....
Not implying that's what you're doing, but figured it was worth saying.

Umm ... the route I'm talking about is washed out. It's currently impassable. Feel free to figure out another way to get through.
 
I'll direct you to that spot, watch you roll your jeep off the side of the washout, and take pictures to post on naxja.

Do you always open your mouth without thinking?

you got a picture?
 
you got a picture?

No pics. The road is heavily eroded, which is fine and challenging, and it clearly had not seen a vehicle in years.

As it bends in the bottom of a high, angled drainage spot it was narrowed to about a 4-ft width with a dropoff of 6-8 feet on the downhill side and 3-5 feet on the uphill side. There is shrubbery on the uphill side.
 
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