Bulletproof AW4?

[SeanP]

On our snow run this weekend my engine and tranny worked hard to get thru 2-3 feet of heavy wet snow. At two points I felt the tranny or torque converter slip when shifting into reverse (yes I got stuck with 38s). I stopped and let everything cool down and this resolved the situation. I don't like the idea of the auto failing in the back country because that's pretty much a deal breaker/gotta have someone drag me out incident.

This got me thinking:

Is there a way to make the AW4 bulletproof for extended snow and sand trips?

Should I just switch to a 5 speed?

Other than hanging a pedal, pluming a master cylinder and swapping the computer, how hard would it be to put a manual into my 97XJ?

[DrMoab]

On our snow run this weekend my engine and tranny worked hard to get thru 2-3 feet of heavy wet snow. At two points I felt the tranny or torque converter slip when shifting into reverse (yes I got stuck with 38s). This got me thinking:

Is there a way to make the AW4 bulletproof for extended snow and sand trips?

Should I just switch to a 5 speed?

Other than hanging a pedal, pluming a master cylinder and swapping the computer, how hard would it be to put a manual into my 97XJ?
Are you running a good cooler? Is your fluid up to the full mark? ANY auto will get very hot in those circumstances which is harder on an auto then just about anything. If you haven't already throw a good cooler on it and bypass the stock one thats in the radiator.

This will help considerably

[CRASH]

Stick with the auto.

Drain that sucker, change the fluid and the filter, refill with a good synthetic fluid. Get a bigger cooler, the biggest one you can find.

CRASH

On our snow run this weekend my engine and tranny worked hard to get thru 2-3 feet of heavy wet snow. At two points I felt the tranny or torque converter slip when shifting into reverse (yes I got stuck with 38s). I stopped and let everything cool down and this resolved the situation. I don't like the idea of the auto failing in the back country because that's pretty much a deal breaker/gotta have someone drag me out incident.

This got me thinking:

Is there a way to make the AW4 bulletproof for extended snow and sand trips?

Should I just switch to a 5 speed?

Other than hanging a pedal, pluming a master cylinder and swapping the computer, how hard would it be to put a manual into my 97XJ?

[Goatman]

Yeah, mine got a little hot bucking deep snow a few months ago......when I realized it I backed off. The hardest thing on an auto (fluid heat up) is continual pushing hard against the torque converter, like what happens in low gear in deep snow. I run a big cooler and my fluid was recently changed, but I should probably still change the fluid again. That scenario is going to heat up the fluid no matter what auto tranny you're running. Like has been said, change the fluid (no filter in an AW4, Andy) and make sure you have a big cooler. Mine also bypasses the radiator. The best way to trash a trans is running on fluid that is bad from being too hot.

Sean, nice to hear you had some trail time........

:D

[CRASH]

(no filter in an AW4, Andy)

:D


Disregard any future AW4 advice you may get from me. I'm dumb when it comes to autos.

CRASH

[xjrugger]

Yeah, mine got a little hot bucking deep snow a few months ago......when I realized it I backed off. The hardest thing on an auto (fluid heat up) is continual pushing hard against the torque converter, like what happens in low gear in deep snow. I run a big cooler and my fluid was recently changed, but I should probably still change the fluid again. That scenario is going to heat up the fluid no matter what auto tranny you're running. Like has been said, change the fluid (no filter in an AW4, Andy) and make sure you have a big cooler. Mine also bypasses the radiator. The best way to trash a trans is running on fluid that is bad from being too hot.

Sean, nice to hear you had some trail time........

:D



My 88 has a filter attatched to the pan. It is an AW4 too.

[armchairkrawler]

A while ago, I read an article about T and J Performance's JeepSpeed rig. It mentioned a Mogi-rebuilt AW4, and then later on, an Art Carr(?) bump shifter attached to it. I haven't ever found a bump shifter or gated shifter for the AW4, due to electronic control of the shift points, as I recall.

It seems that a rebuild of this kind (whatever Mogi did to that AW4) would also boost reliability along with the big cooler. Not to mention the fact that maybe you get control of the 1-2 shift w/o the electrical bypassing mentioned in other threads w/regards to that 1-2 shift.

Mogi doesn't have a website, and I haven't made any calls to them, but they seem to get a lot of business from the desert racing guys, based on their frequent mention on some of those types of boards I've seen.

[JnJ]

My AW4s have filters..........

[iroc86]

I looked into modifying the AW4 at one time. I just settled on a decent cooler and a fluid change. I haven't even found anybody that makes shift kits for them.

[ChuckD]

WOW, no one calling SPOBI on the G-man! ;)


What's NAXJA come to? :D

[scoobyxj]

IIRC there was a thread a few weeks ago that had some info on modded AW4's, but the trannys where in a Toyota RWD car, and not called AW4 (supposed to be the same though). It was reported that they where holding up to 500hp engines without much trouble.

[xjjeepthing]

Iam going to add a cooler this spring seems everyone is saying to bypass the stock one in radiator,wouldnt it be better to use both an add on and the stocker? Just wondering

[4ward]

I want photographic and possibly movie proof that this thing runs under its own power. :wave:

[LouisianaZJ]

do NOT run synthetic as suggested above :sunshine:

[ashmanjeepxj]

Should I just switch to a 5 speed?


If you switch to a 5sp you will need lower gearing for most slow stuff. If you get more gearing and keep the AW4 it might help the heating issue?

What kinda gears are you running T-case and axles..?

[CRASH]

I want photographic and possibly movie proof that this thing runs under its own power. :wave:

I saw it.

Well not actually driving, but it did start!

CRASH

P.S. Ashman: 3.8 Atlas, 5.38's, 38" tires.

[CRASH]

do NOT run synthetic as suggested above :sunshine:


Interesting, we've had VERY good luck running synthetic in Supra auto's (A340), which is nearly identical to the AW4. The boys that flog these 500 hp beasts down the dragstrip report very good shift quality and cooler temps.

What is your reasoning?

CRASH

[loop]

do NOT run synthetic as suggested above

:doh: why may i ask...did you personally have something go wrong?

[LouisianaZJ]

http://www.naxja.org/forum/showthread.php?t=24728&highlight=aw4+synthetic

[CartsXJ]

My AW4s have filters..........


So did mine, its about $30 from Autozone.

[CRASH]

http://www.naxja.org/forum/showthread.php?t=24728&highlight=aw4+synthetic


Is it me, or did that thread actually have more positive experiences with synthetic than negative?

CRASH

[BrettM]

I want photographic and possibly movie proof that this thing runs under its own power. :wave:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v636/marnilane/235.jpg
http://www.rps4wd.com/attachments/DSCF0730.JPG

imagine that! :laugh3: pics from their run here, looks like Jes went too: http://www.rps4wd.com/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.pl?board=chat;action=display;num=1111849841




Sean, just run a BIG cooler and don't run it through the radiator, just the aux. cooler. the AW4 is up to the task with the right cooler.

[Ed A. Stevens]

Big cooler.

Deep snow and deep sand kill anything that slips to bias torque, converter based trannys and limited slip diffs. The AW4 needs a larger cooler if you want to flog it in the converter slip rpm range. Even choosing a low gear, low range, to keep the converter fluid flow and rpm high will not always keep the trans fluid cool (because the engine temp increases, but it can help).

The AW4 filter is more a debris screen, than a filter. The magnet(s) in the bottom of the pan collect the metal shavings while the screen sifts out the large clutch pad wear chunks. The screen will get clogged with high mileage soft chunks, starving the trans of fluid volume (and pressure). Change the fluid and wash out the filter/screen, and the grit stuck to the pan magnets.

[Goatman]

Anyone want to post up the part number on the replacement filter on the AW4?

I've had mine serviced numerous times.....never replaced the "filter". We did clean off the screen, however.

:D

[Capt. Nemo]

For those who drain their own fluids, what do you do with the old tranny fluid? Can it be recycled like regular oil? Just mix it in with old oil and recycle it together?


Okay, back to tech... :laugh3:

[LouisianaZJ]

i just have a big 5 gal container that gets everything PS fluid, gear oil, trans, engine oil etc. i drain it at autozone when it gets full

:repair:

i dont think they care too much

[5-90]

Pretty much everything from transmission fluid to grease uses the same base - just different viscosities - so you can recycle it all together. I do, and I have no trouble with it (grease is really little more than a VERY heavy oil - and the same goes for asphalt, actually...)

There is a sump screen in the AW4. It doesn't usually need replacing, I just clean mine out every 100K miles or inspect it if I think something is amiss. Never needed to replace the thing...

TIP - drain the fluid over a magnet in the drain pan. The magnets in the transmission sump get "fuzzy" after a while, and they won't pick up as much. The magnet in the drain pan will let you know if this is so, and if you should clean the magnets in the pan. If you drop the pan, clean the filter and the magnets. A regular change should just require you to pull the plug.

If you find it necessary to pull the pan, don't try to take the dipstick elbow out of the pan - just pull the dipstick tube apart a little above the elbow. There's an o-ring join there, but I don't have measurements on the ring handy (although I remember it being fairly common.) Lubricate with a little grease on reassembly.

The issues with synthetic in the AW4 seem to stem from high mileage - most people who do a break-in of 5,000-25,000 miles and switch don't have any trouble, but people who switch after 100,000 miles or so seem to have the failures and silliness we don't like. I ran a thread on transmission fluids recently, search it up and have a look. Simply put, if you have some mileage, you're better off staying with the regular stuff since that's what the box is "used" to.

Treated well and kept cool, you'll find that the AW4 will give you excellent service life.

As far as the RWD Toyota mods - same box. Gotta look into those myself sometime... Got links?

5-90

[xjrugger]

Anyone want to post up the part number on the replacement filter on the AW4?

I've had mine serviced numerous times.....never replaced the "filter". We did clean off the screen, however.

:D


Yeah thats part number 0Ithoughtthescreenwasafilter. When i did mine last on my 88 i bought a new screen. Did i throw money away? Im changing my 99's fluid at the end of this week so should i just wash off the screen and the magnets? Also, i found it better to let the tranny drain overnight b/c it dropped like another half quart overnight. Then i reinstalled and filled. Only this time it's my DD so i dont have time to let it not drive for a day.

-Mike

[Karl]

http://www.partsamerica.com/ProductList.aspx?PartType=1158&PTSet=B&SearchFor=Transmission%20Filter%20Kit
here is a link to the advance auto parts sit with the PN's for filters

[Citat3962]

do NOT run synthetic as suggested above :sunshine:
I was thinking of putting Redline ATF in my AW4... but I Think thats synthetic..

Thanks I tend to put synthetic fluid in everything if I don't have a good reason why not to :)

I guess I'll read the above thread... :)

I'm at 144K miles..

[woody]

Anyone want to post up the part number on the replacement filter on the AW4?

I've had mine serviced numerous times.....never replaced the "filter". We did clean off the screen, however.

:D

Both mine use a spin-on NAPA Gold (Wix) 1068 :laugh3: Motorcraft FL1A and AC PF2 work in a pinch.

Like Ed and others have said, run as big a cooler as you can physically fit. I divorced the fluid from the radiator with no obvious ill effects. YMMV. Factory AC condensers work good since they are fairly big, already have solid mounting provisions, and still allow room for an additional aux cooler (for engine oil or PS fluid.) I added a spin-on filter to the cooler circuit.

Before I went this route, I thought I 'smoked' my AW4 (it was Easter weekend, two yrs ago...) it was a NTL mudfest at Uwharrie - steep clay hills. after a good deal of abuse, my junk developed the "go-no-mo" slippage syndrome. Had to get Bigwoody/Greg to tug me up & over the top of the hill, where I parked to watch the other fools try some "slickrock." After 30-45 min of sitting/cooldown, my junk was unjunky for the rest of the weekend. I did change out that fluid as soon as we made it home, and the tranny has shown no ill effects or ever slipped like that since. All I use is 'house brand' Dex/MercIII in my AW4s.

Maybe the 'no synthetics' in the AW4 really is a wives tale, but I'll probably be sticking with what I've known to work.

[Weasel]

I switched mine over to Redline at 145k and am now at 168k with no problems. Handles the heat way better and shifts just fine, nice and firm.

[BLSXJ]

today I had a long conversation with a guy at a tranny shop here in windsor that does alot of the "big 3" R+D/ audits of they're tranny's.

I went in looking for a shift kit and he confirmed that the tranny is actually a toyota tranny and the thing is tough as nails. and does not need a shift kit to hold up to the power of any jeep I6 (including strokers) w/ up to 35" tires

he did reccomend a cooler placed in line between the tranny (output) and the stock cooler in the rad. the logic being the hot fluid is cooled in the cooler then warmed backup to operating temp by the in rad cooler, thus keeping the fluid right in the proper temp range.

he also said with 4 wheeling and all it would be a good Idea to change the fluid every year and as long as the fluid stays clean there would be no real need to go up to synthetic.

he also said that if you ever do destroy a tranny there are so many XJ's out there that just getting another would be the way to go.

[BrettM]

today I had a long conversation with a guy at a tranny shop here in windsor that does alot of the "big 3" R+D/ audits of they're tranny's.

I went in looking for a shift kit and he confirmed that the tranny is actually a toyota tranny and the thing is tough as nails. and does not need a shift kit to hold up to the power of any jeep I6 (including strokers) w/ up to 35" tires

he did reccomend a cooler placed in line between the tranny (output) and the stock cooler in the rad. the logic being the hot fluid is cooled in the cooler then warmed backup to operating temp by the in rad cooler, thus keeping the fluid right in the proper temp range.

he also said with 4 wheeling and all it would be a good Idea to change the fluid every year and as long as the fluid stays clean there would be no real need to go up to synthetic.

he also said that if you ever do destroy a tranny there are so many XJ's out there that just getting another would be the way to go.
Actually the AW4 is not a Toyota tranny, it is manufactured by Aisin Warner and used by Jeep, Toyota, Isuzu, Mitsubishi, Nissan, BMW, Volvo... and possibly more. There are 3 Jeep versions (Renix, HO, and 2.5 engines) at least 3 Toyota versions, and likely many others between the other companies using them.

I see no reason why he should make any mention of a tire size limit. The tranny is only affected by the power input to it by the motor. I would have no suspicions of breakage if someone wanted to use an AW4 behind a stroked 4.0 followed by adequate gearing and 53" Michelin tires. The AW4 in stock form is sufficient for up to 400hp, so even a stroked, supercharged 4.0 would likely be fine or a mildly built 304. Further upgrades can be had from Level Ten, but open your wallet wide.

An auxillary cooler is a great idea for any AW4 imo. If you keep the fluid cool and water out, there is no need to change the fluid every year. I also agree that AW4s are not worth rebuilding, 87-90 versions are often free and it isn't hard to find a 91+ with under 100k miles for under $200.

[Goatman]

Both mine use a spin-on NAPA Gold (Wix) 1068 :laugh3: Motorcraft FL1A and AC PF2 work in a pinch.

I added a spin-on filter to the cooler circuit.



:laugh:

Cute, Woody.... :)

Running the fluid through the radiator after the cooler is probably a good idea.....never thought of it that way. I bypassed the radiator to help the engine cooling a little figuring it wouldn't hurt to isolate the small amount of heat from the trans. Luckily, our beloved XJ/MJ's have very durable motors and trannies. Allows for the $$ to be spent on other stuff...... :D

[SeanP]

Thanks for the responses. I am going to order the biggest cooler that I can. I haven't yet inspected the fluid from saturday. The good news in all this is that I am slowly making my XJ a non-trailer queen.

SeanP

[Goatman]

Sean, I just used a medium sized Hayden from Pep Boys.

Once the fluid gets hot (even just once) it looses it's important properties, so it needs to be changed or it will eventually damage the tranny.

[Gil BullyKatz]

Sounds like a good upgrade...

Where's the common spot to place the bigger cooler?

I had a co-worker a few years back that added a tranny cooler to his 'yota and bolted it to the underside of his hood and made a vent right above it...

IIRC he just had enough slack in the line to allow the hood to open/close...

bad idea?

[Goatman]

Just mount it in front of the radiator, in front of the mechanical fan. When you buy the cooler it comes with the necessary pieces to mount it and hook it up.

[JVRacer04]

some awesome upgrades to a aw4 ive seen is a larger oil pan, held 2 more quarts of fluid then a reg

and that combined with a good tranny cooler will save years on any auto tranny

[wescam]

Real quick guys, on a scale of 1 -10

1 being changing a tire
10 being ring and pinion swap

how hard is installing an aftermarket tranny cooler?

(seems like a good idea for just about any XJ owner)

I'm guessing about a 2 or 3 right?

[woody]

Running the fluid through the radiator after the cooler is probably a good idea.....never thought of it that way. I bypassed the radiator to help the engine cooling a little figuring it wouldn't hurt to isolate the small amount of heat from the trans. Luckily, our beloved XJ/MJ's have very durable motors and trannies. Allows for the $$ to be spent on other stuff...... :D

I won't debate it, But I don't think I'll change either of mine back to running through the radiator either.

If the typical 4.0 cooling system were robust, it would be a non issue... OTOH I like how mine is cooling (the engine) now... with the ATF out of the rad...

What would be your ideas on safe parameters of AW4 transmission operating temperature vs coolant/engine operating temperature? I can take some (fairly accurate) readings in the morning... My DD seems 'overcool' and the remote tranny filter only barely gets hand-hot. OTOH no condensate evidence on the dipstick indicates the tranny isn't a dew-pit either.

[BigDawgz]

I read through this post and I never did see what gear ratio you were running with that big of a tire? I know that the snows that we get here around me....occasional 3'-5' drifts in the county next to mine. They don't really plow the outer reaches of the county and they only have one grader to work with for a very large, less-populated part of the county. We have to gear pretty low for a 38" tire, at least I would anyways. I'd think 4:88's at least. I think the lack of proper gearing is the number one cause of tranny problems with lifted, off-road rigs. I'm not assuming anything about your rig .... you could have 5:13's for all I know...but I was just wondering what you were running in yours. I'm just going on my own experience here.

Without the lower gears....snow, mud and/or sand can really kill the tranny. It bogs everything down so badly and causes the convertor to lock/unlock excessively ... and it causes alot of excess heat. I've seen lots of tranny's so hot that they boiled over and out the dipstick tubes. That can't be good on them....I always run a better cooler....but I've yet to have to do one on a AW4. My present lifted rig is a 5-speed, I have another stock one with an auto...but it doesn't apply to this. But I did have another XJ on 34" tires for a couple of years and it had an AW4 in it and I never had any problems with it either. It had 4:10's in it.
Just my thoughts on it,
Aron

[BrettM]

I read through this post and I never did see what gear ratio you were running with that big of a tire? I know that the snows that we get here around me....occasional 3'-5' drifts in the county next to mine. They don't really plow the outer reaches of the county and they only have one grader to work with for a very large, less-populated part of the county. We have to gear pretty low for a 38" tire, at least I would anyways. I'd think 4:88's at least. I think the lack of proper gearing is the number one cause of tranny problems with lifted, off-road rigs. I'm not assuming anything about your rig .... you could have 5:13's for all I know...but I was just wondering what you were running in yours. I'm just going on my own experience here.

Without the lower gears....snow, mud and/or sand can really kill the tranny. It bogs everything down so badly and causes the convertor to lock/unlock excessively ... and it causes alot of excess heat. I've seen lots of tranny's so hot that they boiled over and out the dipstick tubes. That can't be good on them....I always run a better cooler....but I've yet to have to do one on a AW4. My present lifted rig is a 5-speed, I have another stock one with an auto...but it doesn't apply to this. But I did have another XJ on 34" tires for a couple of years and it had an AW4 in it and I never had any problems with it either. It had 4:10's in it.
Just my thoughts on it,
Aron
he's got plenty of gearing, 5.38/5.43 and an Atlas if I remember right.

[SeanP]

he's got plenty of gearing, 5.38/5.43 and an Atlas if I remember right.

Dude, do you have a database on everybody? eStalker!!! :flipoff:

(thanks for posting proof of my running rig. Can you see my big shiat eating grin in that motion pic???)

I think that finding an old AW4 tranny pan and splicing two together would make a nice pan. Might have to incorporate that.

SeanP

[BrettM]

hey, I couldn't remember if you have the 4.3 or 3.8 Atlas! And remember, I've been under that XJ before and done some grinding, so it doesn't count as eStalking :D

splicing 2 pans together is a great idea, you've probably already seen GoJeep's writeup: http://go.jeep-xj.info/HowtoAutoDeepPan.htm

[BigDawgz]

he's got plenty of gearing, 5.38/5.43 and an Atlas if I remember right.

I'd say that gearing definitely isn't a problem for this XJ then. I'd just go with the cooler like everyone's saying. I think I'd rather give up the A/C condenser and the A/C....and be able to put any size cooler I wanted up front. If I ever switch over to an automatic....I'll probably run a BIG cooler and I've been thinking about doing the onboard air with the stock A/C compressor. If you do this mod....I wonder if you still need the A/C condenser?

I've commented on these AW4's before...I've got several buddies who work at a Jeep dealer about 30 miles from my house...and my best friend has been their #1 tranny man for quite a few years. He's always said that out of all the Jeep/Chrysler tranny's he's done.....the AW4 is the one that he's rarely/if ever had to rebuild. He's addressed some electronic issues with these...but hardly any mechanical problems. Could just be a coincidence...but I'd think that after 3, 4, 5....even 6 years....he surely would've had to do quite a few of these by now.....if they were problematic.
Aron

[houlster]

splicing 2 pans together is a great idea, you've probably already seen GoJeep's writeup: http://go.jeep-xj.info/HowtoAutoDeepPan.htm


I found his writeup when I was working on my driveline swap and ended up doing the same thing. Only thing I would like to add to it is lowering the oil pickup a little bit as well, but haven't taken the time to figure it out.

http://www.houlster.com/amigo/drivetrain/images/114_1487_small.jpg

--Dan

[woody]

I'd say that gearing definitely isn't a problem for this XJ then. I'd just go with the cooler like everyone's saying. I think I'd rather give up the A/C condenser and the A/C....and be able to put any size cooler I wanted up front. If I ever switch over to an automatic....I'll probably run a BIG cooler and I've been thinking about doing the onboard air with the stock A/C compressor. If you do this mod....I wonder if you still need the A/C condenser?

I've commented on these AW4's before...I've got several buddies who work at a Jeep dealer about 30 miles from my house...and my best friend has been their #1 tranny man for quite a few years. He's always said that out of all the Jeep/Chrysler tranny's he's done.....the AW4 is the one that he's rarely/if ever had to rebuild. He's addressed some electronic issues with these...but hardly any mechanical problems. Could just be a coincidence...but I'd think that after 3, 4, 5....even 6 years....he surely would've had to do quite a few of these by now.....if they were problematic.
Aron


If you dedicate the A/C pump to on board air, then the condenser is just out there in the breeze. It has the capacity to be a great trans fluid cooler... if it's mud/bug-free and the cores not kinked up or leaking. :dunno:

AW4s are tough... the several beatings I put on mine maybe not as bad as the beatings you put on yours, :dunno: doesn't matter to me , mine are cool. :laugh3: Take the advice here and run with it... no one would fault you for trying to improve on it, but try to shy away from it and have it burn ya and it's on :) Hope it isn't me that pulls ya out of the woods as I will :laugh3: :wave: while I call ya funny names for doubting experience...BUT I'd expect if my junk tranny's up in the next while I'll eat crow too. Fair's Fair. But the AW4 IS tough.
.

[Goatman]

If you did that you'd just have a better likelyhood of putting a rock through the tranny pan. Put on a big cooler, change the fluid every few years, and don't worry about it. Worry about wheeling it more often........ :D

For the other guy, I'm running 5:13's and I got my tranny hot pushing through deep snow with 37's.

[JJacobs]

Filter appears to be a Champ TF209 from AutoZone. $19.99. I've fixed a few odd AW4 problems by swapping them out. Screen, filter, whatever, for the price it's not worth trying to clean it.

[woody]

I bet Goat had oil cavitation in the diffs too.... I've heard snow does that to people who still run differentials.

[Goatman]

Filter appears to be a Champ TF209 from AutoZone. $19.99. I've fixed a few odd AW4 problems by swapping them out. Screen, filter, whatever, for the price it's not worth trying to clean it.

Mine's done every two years.....drop the pan and clean the screen and magnet, so it never gets that dirty. :)

[woody]

What would be your ideas on safe parameters of AW4 transmission operating temperature vs coolant/engine operating temperature? I can take some (fairly accurate) readings in the morning... My DD seems 'overcool' and the remote tranny filter only barely gets hand-hot. OTOH no condensate evidence on the dipstick indicates the tranny isn't a dew-pit either.

As promised... some temp readings (taken idling in the shade, 75*f outside temp, using a Raytek IR laser thermometer) after 20 min. or so of "stop & go" urban driving...

Tranny pan: 143-145*f
Tranny filter housing/hose fittings: 100-105*f
Tranny cooler: 95*f

Head @ thermostat housing: 195*f
Head in back @ temp sensor: 225*f
Factory temp gauge reading: 190*f apprx.

Front exhaust pipe: 500+-*f :dunno: if our laser gizzy likes higher temps like that, the 538*C kiln we use freaks it out :D

Engine oil filter: 155*f

Notes: 88 4.0/AW4, has a 8 month old 2 core radiator, using 50/50 mix + 16oz WaterWetter & 'recent' NAPA water pump, Mopar 195* T-stat; Large (24kGVW) tranny cooler, Summit remote filter kit, fresh Advance Auto "house-brand" Dex-Merc III ATF

HTH, YMMV and all that.