Why can't I find the right oil filter??

[CJS]

1990 XJ, 4.0 non-HO

For some reason I can't get any oil filters to thread on, the threads are find but all the filters specified in the books are wrong. I know my 93's purolater number was L14670 but what would be the purolater number for my 90' cherokee??

[Vug]

No

The HO (91&up) and the non-HO (90&dwn) use a different filter. The threads on the non-HO are metric and the threads on th HO are inch. There is a sticker on the HO's firewall above the filer that states the change. You can't use a left over filter from your '93 on your '90.

[CJS]

I thought they were different, I saw the sticker, but then I got out a fram book and they were the same. I guess that's why I was confused.

[juicexj24]

you can convert the threads/fitting to the HO style. Check out madxj.com.

Dealer part, I believe. But if you can't find any to fit that might be the way to go. I use fram, and can always find them in Wal-Mart, or K&N in Advanced auto parts. Juice

[CJS]

What is the fram part #??

[satan]

K&N HP2007
Purolator L14619
Fram PH3985
Mobil Oil M1207
Pennzoil PZ30

[cherokeekid95]

i would advise against using fram oil filters. I have heard/seen reports of frams filter material starting to break apart at the 3000 mile mark. and i know of a guy that has found fram filters on the shelf with surface rust on them.:eek: course that could be anything. anyway i have heard from several places that fram is not the best. some i know have actually taken the time to cut filters open just to see the insides and have been disappointed with fram. They have all agreed to NAPA (wix) to being the best filter. so i have gone that route. Just some info thought was valid here.

[CJS]

Thanks satan (man that seems weird ):D, that was exactly what I was looking for.

i would advise against using fram oil filters. I have heard/seen reports of frams filter material starting to break apart at the 3000 mile mark. and i know of a guy that has found fram filters on the shelf with surface rust on them. course that could be anything. anyway i have heard from several places that fram is not the best. some i know have actually taken the time to cut filters open just to see the insides and have been disappointed with fram. They have all agreed to NAPA (wix) to being the best filter. so i have gone that route. Just some info thought was valid here.

I don't use fram, I was just cross-referencing. Personally I've always used purolater, they're cheap and have great filtering specs. But in reality, most oil filters are probably made at the same place (most, not all) just like everythin else.

[mengleff]

http://minimopar.net/oilfilterstudy.html
there's bunches of that same test by the same guy on bunches of different webpages, but that seems to be the actual testers page... :)

[Matthew Currie]

"But in reality, most oil filters are probably made at the same place (most, not all) just like everythin else." (CJS)

They may be from the same place but it seems they're different inside. I sawed a bunch open a few years ago, and found substantial differences, both in the number of pleats and in the material. I don't remember all the details, but K&N and Bosch filters had more pleats than the generic ones from Napa and Parts Master, etc. The K&N material also was very stiff, and the case really was made of thicker metal. I didn't have a Fram to test. I've been using Wix filters recently, because my local parts store carries them, and I'm just guessing that Dana wouldn't foist off a crappy filter on us. I'll have to open one of them up some day. I found on my 87 that Bosch and K&N filters both gave higher running oil pressure than the others too. It isn't a very scientific study, since I don't know the filtration qualities of the material, but it's interesting anyway. Filters really do vary a good deal.

[LT1XJ]

That article is interesting. Only problem is that it leaves me wondering if I can win. I understand that frams are crap-and I am reluctant that it is what is on my jeep now. But there seems to be problems with all of them, it seems like purolator and wix are the better choices of the bunch, but what the heck, it sounds like they are all crap in a can.
Dustin

[satan]

Yeah - so change em often !

The whole filter concept is a compromise -- filter efficiency /v/ pressure drop in the ideal world, and the price on the shelf /v/ market share in the real world...

... same thing happens in the air filter world...

[Yucca-Man]

Any ideas on where I can find Wix filters in Northern CO --> Denver??

(edit) Nevermind---http://www.wixfilters.com/wheretobuy/index.asp I used to run Wix all the time when working on base in SouthCal, but haven't seen them anywhere. That search told me why...

[sidriptide]

wix is a big "private label" manufacturer, meaning they put other names on their filter.... alot of OEM's use wix as a source.... correct me if i'm wrong but i am under the impression that mopar filters are Wix... i was shocked to see fram and k&n suggested in the same post.. K&n or mopar for me!
fram = bad ju-ju
mike
http://people.msoe.edu/~yoderw/oilfilterstudy/oilfilters.html
i dont know if thats the same link as before...

[8991XJ]

About how the filter material is made, yes there are big differences. It has been mentioned that the diferences can be seen, and that there are tradeoffs. Here is some info on the filter medium. I worked in the pulp &paper industry a few years ago and our mill was visited by a guy from the cmpany that made the filter paper for a bunch of companies. He said there are different specs from these companies. Additionally, his company bought fiber from many sources (long fiber pine, short fiber hardwood, flat fiber and round fiber) to allow his company to produce the paper to specs. So yes ther is a big difference in the paper inside the can. I'm shouldn't say, but at that time Lee was using the best paper his company made, and Fram some of the worst.

[Boatwrench]

Read the website several times over the past few years, not sure. Used Fram filters on my 1990 Suburban w/454 cuin for over 125K miles, now use K&N (get a discount). Changed oil every 3K miles and the Suburban just keeps on oving down the road.

[MJmk]

I like using the Mopar filter on my '87. With the filter being mounted upside-down, it seems the oil doesn't drain out of the Mopar filter after sitting all night, so oil pressure builds up faster on the first start in the morning. Before I did the gauge cluster swap, it was really obvious with the oil light, first start in the morning with the Mopar, the light would go out about the same time the engine fired off, with other filters I tried, the light would go off after the engine started and ran 1-2 seconds. Anyone else notice this? Or does my engine have some oil pressure issue the Mopar filter is hiding! :D

Mopar filter for non-HO: 5012968AA ( was 33004195 )

[sbxj]

Originally posted by satan
K&N HP2007
Purolator L14619
Fram PH3985
Mobil Oil M1207
Pennzoil PZ30 :eek: damn...from memory no doubt

[Eagle]

I use nothing but Purolator oil filters. The '88 has 239,000+ miles and no problems. I believe the Purolator part number for the non-HO is 41619, but please double check that in an application book.

[wascobi]

it would be great to see a list of who makes what filter. anyone use quaker state filters?

[Eagle]

The Mini-Mopar oil filter study attempts to tell you who makes what filter. I suspect the list changes, however. I'm pretty certain that whoever makes Mopar filters now isn't the same company that was making them a few years ago.

[Sarge]

Fram may have looked poorly in the cut-up study but if any filter is made for a specific vehicle and used on that vehicle and the motor suffers an oil related failure then the filter company is on the line for the results. In other words search all you want you wont find many failures due to bad oil filters correctly fitted to a vehicle. The only real time it would make a difference is most likely if you knew you were someone who knows they should change their oil at 3000, 5000, whatever but always forget and may not change it for 10,000, etc.

Sarge

[Matthew Currie]

Originally posted by Sarge
Fram may have looked poorly in the cut-up study but if any filter is made for a specific vehicle and used on that vehicle and the motor suffers an oil related failure then the filter company is on the line for the results. In other words search all you want you wont find many failures due to bad oil filters correctly fitted to a vehicle. The only real time it would make a difference is most likely if you knew you were someone who knows they should change their oil at 3000, 5000, whatever but always forget and may not change it for 10,000, etc.

Sarge

I'm sure that's true as far as it goes, but that liability doesn't cover the question of long term engine longevity, which seems relevant considering the high mileages that seem routine for XJ's. If you needed new bearings at 175 thousand miles, it would be a bit premature for an XJ, but you'd have a hard time suing a filter manufacturer for it, wouldn't you?

[sidriptide]

what about swapping the filter adapter from an HO to a non-HO? i'm tired of having two diffent filters for my XJ's.. i like the 90 deg turn the newer style makes...
mike

[Yucca-Man]

Just to throw a little mud into the works, with the HO-style fitting you can use a larger filter as well; instead of the PH16-sized critter you can fit a PH8A on there for a much larger filtered area.

[RichP]

The most important thing on the 4.0 filter is the drain back valve. I bought a full case of Mopar filters the same day I picked up my 98XJ as well as a FSM. I then tried Purolator and noticed that my oil light came on every morning when starting, never did that with the mopars, tried K&N and they were fine but I noticed they loosened up by themselves so I stopped using them for a while. Then I found that Kmart carried Mobil-1 fiters so I bought a bunch of them and they worked great till kmart started biting the dust and stopped carrying my model number, went back to K&N and Mopars then an advanced auto store on the way to one of my customers started carrying Mobil-1 so thats what I am back to.
I also run mobil-1 bumper to bumper.

[Eagle]

Originally posted by sidriptide
what about swapping the filter adapter from an HO to a non-HO? i'm tired of having two diffent filters for my XJ's.. i like the 90 deg turn the newer style makes...
mike

This can be done, as long as you know that only you will be servicing the vehicle. Even if you go to a dealer and buy the correct filter decal for under the hood, you just know that if you drive it into a quicky lube shop there's a 50% chance they'll try to use the "correct" filter for the year and screw on a metric filter. Won't help to tell the guy at the counter because he'll forget to tell the guys in the bay.

Of course, at the same shop there's also a 50% chance they'd screw on a standard filter even if you still have the metric adapter.

[Eagle]

Originally posted by RichP
The most important thing on the 4.0 filter is the drain back valve. I bought a full case of Mopar filters the same day I picked up my 98XJ as well as a FSM. I then tried Purolator and noticed that my oil light came on every morning when starting, never did that with the mopars, tried K&N and they were fine but I noticed they loosened up by themselves so I stopped using them for a while. Then I found that Kmart carried Mobil-1 fiters so I bought a bunch of them and they worked great till kmart started biting the dust and stopped carrying my model number, went back to K&N and Mopars then an advanced auto store on the way to one of my customers started carrying Mobil-1 so thats what I am back to.
I also run mobil-1 bumper to bumper.

Purolators have the anti-drainback valve. Frams do not.

[Deyman]

What ever happened to AC Delco? I can't find them anywhere anymore! They were pretty good too! Seems like the general consensus is Purolater then? I think the only thing that Fram has going for them is the grippy top :-)

Deyman

[sidriptide]

with fram you have to pay like $6 more to get a fancy one with the drainback valve in it.. and K&N has the super-sexy hex head on the top thats much cooler than the "grippy " stuff
mike

[Hawaiian Style]

I used to use Frams... :doh: At least they were the better quality X2 series and TG series. I guess they really are JUNK. I read that minimopars article and it sent shivers down my spine.

I guess the most important thing is to change the oil and filter often. I am a little neurotic and change mine every 3 months or 3k whichever comes first and I'm running synthetics. I figure those K&N and other high end filters are for those that don't want to change their oil or fliter often. I went with the Wix because I dump my oil and filter so often and it had the best features and the best price for a short term filter.

[MG_43]

Napa gold line filters are made by Wix, the silver line is made by anyones guess.

[TiRod]

Ran Frams for a long time. Cheap, and Walmarts are everywhere here. I spun a rod bearing and launched the rest of it out the side of the block on my F150 - didn't notice the low oil pressure until it was squeaking -
So, after the rebuild, about a year later, I notice LOW OIL PRESSURE again. Stop off at the local auto parts to get pieces to hook up a real guage to test the pump. Counterman asks why, I tell him, he asks "What Brand filter you using?" I say "Fram." He says, "change to ANY better grade filter and see what your oil pressure does."
Instant cure.
I've done the metric to US conversion on my XJ and will never run Fram again.
Not just my .02, about $1,300 more - I work at a chain auto store and we sell 'em, so I just bite my tongue.

[AJ-MJ]

http://minimopar.net/oilfilterstudy.html
there's bunches of that same test by the same guy on bunches of different webpages, but that seems to be the actual testers page... :)


Great link!!!!!