renix starting issues

[cumorglas]

I have an 89 xj with a 4.0. it has of late been doing something wierd. it will start just fine, but the moment i release the key from starting position it cuts off. My thinking on this was that it was the ignition switch(it was the original with 196k miles or so on it.) replacing the switch did not fix my problem.

it will run as long as a hold the key in start position, but i generally feel that is a bad idea as a solution ;-)

about six months and 3000 miles ago i replaced the icm and the cps to cure a problem where it would run for exactly ten minutes perfectly and then die and not run at all for a day or so. at the same time i also cleaned, or replaced just about all the sensor connectors, replaced cap, rotor, plugs wires, replaced some of the battery cabling, got myself the fancy renix manual(don't ask where) as well as a nice mitchells manual for the whole thing.

the renix manual leads me to feel that the problem is with the sync sensor in the distributor but the testing procedure that i can do without the fancy drbii tester is not very helpful. ie I have five volts where i should and the thing fluctuates while i crank.

i am kind of stumped here and not sure where to go next. I really can't afford another vehicle to be my daily driver and need this thing to just start like it used to.


any pointers would be v appreciated

 

[RWKHausSupply]

I have an 89 xj with a 4.0. it has of late been doing something wierd. it will start just fine, but the moment i release the key from starting position it cuts off. My thinking on this was that it was the ignition switch(it was the original with 196k miles or so on it.) replacing the switch did not fix my problem.

it will run as long as a hold the key in start position, but i generally feel that is a bad idea as a solution ;-)

about six months and 3000 miles ago i replaced the icm and the cps to cure a problem where it would run for exactly ten minutes perfectly and then die and not run at all for a day or so. at the same time i also cleaned, or replaced just about all the sensor connectors, replaced cap, rotor, plugs wires, replaced some of the battery cabling, got myself the fancy renix manual(don't ask where) as well as a nice mitchells manual for the whole thing.

the renix manual leads me to feel that the problem is with the sync sensor in the distributor but the testing procedure that i can do without the fancy drbii tester is not very helpful. ie I have five volts where i should and the thing fluctuates while i crank.

i am kind of stumped here and not sure where to go next. I really can't afford another vehicle to be my daily driver and need this thing to just start like it used to.


any pointers would be v appreciated

I would first check the ballast resistor in the drivers side inner fender. It is White and has a wire with plug, pluged in to either side, Both plugs face out towards the air cleaner. If that is unpluged it will do Exactly as you discribe!

 

[Matthew Currie]

Look for the fuel pump ballast resistor. It is usually on the driver's side inner fender (not all 4.0's have one, but I'm almost positive the 89 does). It is a rectangular ceramic resistor with a wire connected at each end. Check first that both wires are properly connected. If they are not, do so. If they are and it still doesn't stay running, bypass the resistor by connecting the two wires together.

If it goes then, you have two options: you can either replace the ballast or leave it bypassed (just make sure the splice is neat and doesn't short). The only purpose of the ballast is to make the fuel pump run more quietly. It does not seem to lengthen its life, and this part is not present on all years. My 87 did not have it, and neither does my 95. Both ran (the 95 still running) well past 200K miles on the original pump. My stepson's 93 had one and its pump wore out at something around the 180K mark.

 

[cumorglas]

excellent idea, not something i had tried, but unfortunately not it. I did like the idea of dtching it and happily bypassed i.
it doesn't seem o be a fuel related problem. fuel is there and the pressure is fine. it fires while in the star position and will continue running so as log as i am willing to hold it there. spark goes away the instant is is not in start. the really wird bit is that every once in a while it rus just fine and will do so till i shut it off. that's robably less that one try in fifty times.

this particular xj doesn't have one of the centralized connectors so i have tried tracking down all the connections to see if they are clean and appear to be so. It is of course possible i have missed one.

any other ideas?

 

[dizzymac]

Can you turn the key just far enough to keep it running but not engage the starter? Mine did this, I replaced the ignition switch but did not solve prob. I had to replace the key (tumbler) switch too, may have been so worn it was causing improper connection ? No probs. since then.

 

[cumorglas]

also good idea also not it. I popped the switch right out of its mount. am operating it right with a rod. even a tiny hair off off start it kills spark.

still looking for it and willing to try nearly anything.

 

[torfinn]

I had this problem once on my 89. It turned out to be a loose wire at the starter relay. Check all the fusible links around the starter relay. Under hood passenger side. It is the metal relay with lots of wires going to it. This relay also works as a power distribution point. All the sub circuits in the car comes from this point.

regards
Torfinn

 

[TiRod]

Whe you replaced the ignition switch - the electric one at the bottom of the column - did you preload the switch by pressing on it the direction the FSM states to put into in sync? Tilt/non-tilt columns are different directions.

A tiny hair off operating with the rod sounds like its just not making contact.

 

[cumorglas]

i have the tilt and yes i did preload in the right direction, both the first time i re installed it and the second time after taking the switch out to test. the issue reall doesn't seem to be a switch issue. a misalgned switch still wouldn't cut the ignition in between starting and the run position that should be a continous make point for the ignition. as soon as i take the switch off start it kills ignition. while on start runs fine.

other than the relay(which i replaced about a year ago and have, based on torfinn's advice, just checked the connections) what else is different between those two states. is there some signal or sensor that the renix ignores while starting but pays attenton to while running?

 

[cumorglas]

i have the tilt and yes i did preload in the right direction, both the first time i re installed it and the second time after taking the switch out to test. the issue reall doesn't seem to be a switch issue. a misalgned switch still wouldn't cut the ignition in between starting and the run position that should be a continous make point for the ignition. as soon as i take the switch off start it kills ignition. while on start runs fine.

other than the relay(which i replaced about a year ago and have, based on torfinn's advice, just checked the connections) what else is different between those two states. is there some signal or sensor that the renix ignores while starting but pays attenton to while running?

oddly enough, it turned out to be the relay. I checked it's connections and it was fine when i tested it for continuity with the 9v batt trick. so i went on to other things. I ditched all the fusible links and replace them with waterproof, sparkproof. (coast guard approved for engine compartment) breakers. still same behavior. then totally by accident a hooked the fuel pump wire from the starter relay(orange wblack stripe) to an always hot terminal on my spiffy new breaker setup. guess what? it stayed running!!
I yanked out the fuel relay again and retested it worked about twenty percent of the time when the 9v was applied. I had only tested it the once. Stoooopid me. anyway i replaced the thirteen month old fuel relay with the 17 year old one from the egr stuff for now.

does anyone have a diagram for how to ditch that egr stuff entirely? I live in Western New York and this 89 is never going to have to be smogged and it just seems like unnecessary bits and pieces to me.