Pneumatic DISCO Sway bar

[redrider2911]

Alright guys, so I've been losing sleep over this for over a week now. This is the first post I've released about this new product Im hoping to release soon. Its still in the tweaking and design phase.

Background. So I honestly dont run a sway bar in the front of my rig but I know alot of people like to and disconnect them when they get to the trail. I personally started thinking about this for a rear coil conversion Im also hoping to release in the spring. The only reason I havent been running coils yet is because I didnt want the bad highway manners or worry about getting out and disconnecting the rusty sway bar links or running a suck down winch on side hills ect, ect.

So everyone probably know the new JKs and Rubicons come out with electric disco sway bars. You can find them at some online stores but expect to pay 1300 dollars or so. I've seen a couple in person and to me it looks like alot of moving parts just to slide over a collar right? So I decided that since most offroad vehicles have OBA (or hope to) or have a 12V air compressor that air would be the simpler, cleaner, and most importantly, cheaper way to go.

Basic Idea. The sway bar would have a left side and a right side. The 2 sides will be coupled together by a collar when engaged, spring loaded to seat into place locked even if there was some sort of failure (air line leak). When the air line is charged with the proper PSI it will slide the collar over off the splines and allow the 2 piece sway bar to move independently. When the air is released (blow off valve) the spring will push the collar back over the splines coupling to 2 pieces when properly lined up (on level ground). Of course this spring is heavy duty and stiff enough to slide the collar.

This will all be controlled by switches in the dash and would be able to run on an existing OBA system or a single 12V air compressor.

This is all I have time to right now. Let me know if you have questions and thoughts. I might be posting up some designs later for you guys to keep your interest.

Kris Froehlich

 

[jakeWI]

that sounds like a sweet idea. Def. would be something new and different for the XJ market

 

[redrider2911]

Finally somebody said something! lol I was like, man... maybe nobody is interested in this... I thought after 14 views someone would say something. Maybe people didnt want to read through my long winded typing... :compwork:

Thanks man. Im really excited about it. Keep checking for progress updates.

Also thinking of doing adjustable arm lengths on each side of the torsion bar. That way you can adjust for the desired stiffness when engaged. Longer arm = more leverage on the torsion bar which means more body roll. The shorter the arm the less pressure applied to twist the torsion bar and the stiffer it will be around corners. Its nice in race cars and such, not sure if its something desired in the XJ world.
What do you guys think?

 

[jakeWI]

Finally somebody said something! lol I was like, man... maybe nobody is interested in this... I thought after 14 views someone would say something. Maybe people didnt want to read through my long winded typing... :compwork:

Nah! I think people have been skipping over things easily lately haha. ive noticed it with every thread. people will start posting soon im sure! atriot:

 

[Screech]

I would like the adjustable arm lengths would be nice. I work on race cars for a living and i get into my jeep and forget its not a sports car and i like to tinker with things. Or you could make an electric version so its not limited to people with OBA

 

[bigalpha]

I'd like to see a design sketch to see how you plan to do this.

 

[redrider2911]

I'd like to see a design sketch to see how you plan to do this.

Yea, no problem. Originally I didnt want to post this up just yet but you asked for it.

This is the disco section as if it was cut in half.

 

[C85D4x4]

I would just be happy if I could Lock and Unlock it manually with a simple lever with out using my OBA.

As long as I don't have to deal with storage pins and lining everything up on both sides on level ground when its 10 degrees outside.

 

[redrider2911]

I would just be happy if I could Lock and Unlock it manually with a simple lever with out using my OBA.

As long as I don't have to deal with storage pins and lining everything up on both sides on level ground when its 10 degrees outside.

I could put a manual override lever on it too. i just dont like to get out of my jeep period. Lol

 

[C85D4x4]

I could put a manual override lever on it too. i just dont like to get out of my jeep period. Lol

The simpler it is, less chance for things to go wrong. I have to fill up and air down tires anyway.

 

[redrider2911]

The simpler it is, less chance for things to go wrong. I have to fill up and air down tires anyway.

Agreed. Which is why Im going with air vs electronic. Using electricity to engage and disengage would take alot more parts. Air is simpler and convinient. I do like the idea of a manual lever as well.

 

[time2getdirty]

I would just be happy if I could Lock and Unlock it manually with a simple lever with out using my OBA.

As long as I don't have to deal with storage pins and lining everything up on both sides on level ground when its 10 degrees outside.

X2

Any estimate yet of what this would cost?

 

[redrider2911]

X2

Any estimate yet of what this would cost?

Im hoping to be in the range of the teraflex swaybar. I would offer a direct replacement for just the stock torsion bar as well as one with adjustable arm lengths and a full ball joint/rod end complete setup.

 

[kastein]

I don't like seals, either. The guys who play in mud will agree with that :gee:

I have been trying to think of a way to do this myself, since I also don't like spending 1300 dollars on a sway bar. One thing you're going to have to do is different length links for the connection to the axle since the ends of the swaybar will rub on the springs (or just not be as effective) if you try to go one-size-fits-all. Also when the suspension is flexing more than stock, the bushing setup on the swaybar ends won't work very well so it'll probably need heim joints (small ones.)

A cable driven setup like the OX locker actuator would probably work pretty well.

I likely won't buy one if you do build one though, I came up with a design for swaybar links that I think will work well for me, already bought all the materials. I just have to weld it up when I get home and see how it works. Spent too much time thinking about a disco swaybar design and decided I didn't have the tools to build it. Good luck :cheers:

 

[redrider2911]

I don't like seals, either. The guys who play in mud will agree with that :gee:

I have been trying to think of a way to do this myself, since I also don't like spending 1300 dollars on a sway bar. One thing you're going to have to do is different length links for the connection to the axle since the ends of the swaybar will rub on the springs (or just not be as effective) if you try to go one-size-fits-all. Also when the suspension is flexing more than stock, the bushing setup on the swaybar ends won't work very well so it'll probably need heim joints (small ones.)

A cable driven setup like the OX locker actuator would probably work pretty well.

I likely won't buy one if you do build one though, I came up with a design for swaybar links that I think will work well for me, already bought all the materials. I just have to weld it up when I get home and see how it works. Spent too much time thinking about a disco swaybar design and decided I didn't have the tools to build it. Good luck :cheers:

Thanks for the support. Cable could be a good idea too! I love the brain storming. I dont THINK the seals we be such a problem with mud and such since all the seals will actually be contained in the housing with no open ends. Maybe... a little dirty water could possibly seap past the snap rings and into the outer seals. Of course, there is going to be a good coat of grease on everything and maybe even a grease zert.

 

[Muddy Beast]

Personally, I would start simpler first. I like you're unique idea, and how you also already know how you want to approach it. However, I think there are a lot of little things and details that you need to know from a similar type product before making an air actuated one.

That is to say, you might make a proto-type of the basic construction (arm lengths, bend locations, joints used, etc.) as a mechanically actuated sway bar disconnect first. This way you can also start selling that version and see how things with the market go without having as much money at stake, and use what you've learned from it's design to improve upon it and make an air actuated one.

My only last thought is, how do you plan to have the two sway-bar pieces reconnect as one piece with both sides being level, when the Jeep is on un-even ground. Do you have a way to force the re-centering of the two sections?

 

[stewie]

reconnecting is a pain. my jeep never wants to sit back into the same possition after wheeling. then i ether have to somehow grow a third arm to reconnect or have a friend sit on one corner of the hood. how sensitive would your product be to this agrivation?

 

[kastein]

With an air actuated locking system and properly shaped splines on the two halves of the sway bar, I imagine you could hit the button, then get in the jeep and rock back and forth a bit and it would engage as you rocked the jeep to exactly the right spot.

Another thing... since the sway bar is under torsion where you intend to put the disconnect, and the mounting bushings are a significant distance away, there's a decent possibility that you may need to add further mounting brackets and bushings closer to the disconnect unit to keep it from being bent sideways. Not sure I'm describing this very clearly.

 

[redrider2911]

With an air actuated locking system and properly shaped splines on the two halves of the sway bar, I imagine you could hit the button, then get in the jeep and rock back and forth a bit and it would engage as you rocked the jeep to exactly the right spot.

Exactly. I was actually thinking just as you drive down the road, once you hit that level spot it will slide back in. The spring should actually do most of the work. The only problem is I might have to out source the splines which can be pricey. I have been thinking about doing a tapered keyway, which I think if done right and to tight enough toleranced would prove to be plenty strong enough.

Another thing... since the sway bar is under torsion where you intend to put the disconnect, and the mounting bushings are a significant distance away, there's a decent possibility that you may need to add further mounting brackets and bushings closer to the disconnect unit to keep it from being bent sideways. Not sure I'm describing this very clearly.

Great thinking kastein, I can tell you have spent some time thinking on the subject. I know exactly what you are picturing since it is actually a torsion bar that is supposed to allow twisting of the material. Something I have been thinking about as well. I added the nipple on one side of the sway bar and a bore on the other side to help with keeping the 2 peices centered and not "walking". I also am planning on making the disco housing bolt to the front main crossmember.(or wherever you plan on mounting it.) Since the housing bore is only 5 thousands over size of the sway bar and stationary it should take care of the problem. If there seems to be a problem with continuous wear on the housing I can easily add a bronze or UHMW bushing at each end.

 

[kastein]

Yeah... spent quite a while thinking about how to set it up before deciding I don't have the tools to do a good job building my own yet. So I'm just making much easier to use discos instead. Hope this works out well for you :thumbup: