NWHBC Cage Design and Build Thread

[JBweld]

holy bent highlift batman!:scared:

There's a good story behind it. It involves someones(name withheld to protect the guilty) very bad welds breaking, a bumper falling off, me smashing my finger, and that jack getting bent.

Wait....wasn't this a build thread?

 

[Blkxjkrawler]

There's a good story behind it. It involves someones(name withheld to protect the guilty) very bad welds breaking, a bumper falling off, me smashing my finger, and that jack getting bent.

Wait....wasn't this a build thread?

:roflmao:

Oh the memories!

 

[XJourney]

There's a good story behind it. It involves someones(name withheld to protect the guilty) very bad welds breaking, a bumper falling off, me smashing my finger, and that jack getting bent.

Wait....wasn't this a build thread?

Dude just take the credit. We all know that you did a Chuck Norris style round house kick and bent high lift and broke his rear bumper off. And did you say "sorry"? NO ;D

 

[karstic]

Michael

How did you finish of the tubing through the roof?

 

[2xtreme]

Michael

How did you finish of the tubing through the roof?

I just used seam sealer around mine (both top and bottom). Jeremy made some cool plates and welded them and bolted them through the roof. There are good photos above to see Jeremy's plates. As a side note, I did drive the Jeep a few times before I had seam sealed the holes and it was VERY loud. Now that it is all sealed up it is MUCH quieter.

Michael

 

[PornstaR]

the seatbelts and will hold the seat and the person to the cage... in a hard impact, the steatbelts are what hold you in - not the seats...

Cages and halos look great. But just as an added info on the belts and mounting point, I have seen pinches due to cages getting racked one way while floor pan (seat mounting) stayed and the cage (where harnesses were mounted) shifted and literally squeezed the occupant to death. Just a thought not that it happens all the time but could happen. I know its a tough call to make cause adding more bar to the mix to mount seats up on is a pain.

 

[Goatman]

Cages and halos look great. But just as an added info on the belts and mounting point, I have seen pinches due to cages getting racked one way while floor pan (seat mounting) stayed and the cage (where harnesses were mounted) shifted and literally squeezed the occupant to death. Just a thought not that it happens all the time but could happen. I know its a tough call to make cause adding more bar to the mix to mount seats up on is a pain.

I think they are safe from that happening because of the stout rock rails, and that the frame, rock rails, and cage are all tied together. Basically, it would be impossible for the floor to move relative to the other components.


BTW, mega props to you guys for building very well designed cages. Easily strong enough and safe without all the roof tubes on the inside, adds quite a bit of rigidity, and protects the body in a roll so the rig isn't totalled. As an example, Santa rolled his and the rig was still totalled. He has a very good cage, and it did it's job of protecting him, but he had to build another rig. Granted, he did a bunch of endo's so who knows what any rig might have looked like, but with this design you at least have a fighting chance at not totalling the rig. By tying into the rock rails and having the roof halo on the outside, and having the grill hoop, you can roll and the rig can still survive. To me, the best posible design.

 

[JBweld]

BTW, mega props to you guys for building very well designed cages. Easily strong enough and safe without all the roof tubes on the inside, adds quite a bit of rigidity, and protects the body in a roll so the rig isn't totalled. As an example, Santa rolled his and the rig was still totalled. He has a very good cage, and it did it's job of protecting him, but he had to build another rig. Granted, he did a bunch of endo's so who knows what any rig might have looked like, but with this design you at least have a fighting chance at not totalling the rig. By tying into the rock rails and having the roof halo on the outside, and having the grill hoop, you can roll and the rig can still survive. To me, the best posible design.

Wow, thanks! Your rig was an inspiration for us. I still want to tie front-end into the rest of the cage, but I'm happy with it. I built it to protect me in a moderate roll, and still be driveable after a slow roll or a flop. If it gets totalled and I walk away, I'm still happy.

 

[Goatman]

Since I've seen cracks at the firewall, A pillar, at the cowl, cracks all around the track bar and steering gear, and cracks where the front crossmember connects to the frame, I think adding those forward bars could be pretty important. The frame still needs some plating, but tying the A pillar and front crossmember together should definitely help.

 

[Ronbo]

Quick question on the preferred 'A' pillar design seen in the two pics below:
One style (like Megawatt) has the halo with attached 'A' pillar tubing dropping down to the rock rails.

The other style has one piece of tube run along the drip rails and down to the rock rails, with a spreader running over the top of the windshield. Something like this if there was a little sheetmetal left, lol:

Is there any preference of the two styles for a full bodied rig? It's not that I see one being stronger than the other, but perhaps easier to fab. Any input? Thanks.

-Ron

 

[2xtreme]

Richard,
Like Jeremy said, your yellow rig has been an inspiration to many of us and your comments and design ideas (as well as a handfull of others) had a lot to do with the final designs that we came up with. With every design there are compromises but I think both Jeremy and I are very happy with what we ended up with. Your compliments are really appreciated.

Ronbo,
I am not sure I understand what you are asking with your option 2? Here is my take on the subject. Typically with a traditional internal cage your "A" pillars are inside the vehicle and there is a spreader at the top and the middle (dashboard bar) these are both to support the "A" pillar. Some external "A" pillars will run a spreader across the front of the windshield. Jeremy and I have attached our "A" pillars all the way down the firewall useing the firewall as the spreader. If we had not attached the "A" pillar to the firewall we would have run an external spreader.

Does that help?
Michael

 

[JBweld]

I think Ronbo is talking about the spreader over the windshield. We made are "halos" in 1 piece, but I don't see any reason why you couldn't have the "A" pillar and the gutter rail bent from the same piece, and then use a spreader across the top of the windshield. It might look a little different, but it's probably the same amout of fabrication/welding.

-Jeremy

 

[Goatman]

I understand what Ronbo is asking, and I don't think it makes much difference. I think in pure design carrying the tubing rearward from the A pillar is a little stronger at the A pillar joint, tube is always stronger then weld, but if your welds are good and it's gusseted well the other design is also strong enough.

 

[2xtreme]

Ah, I think I understand the question now. I actually considered doing it that way as an option but decided to do it the way we did it only because the bends were going to be a little less complicated. Our "A" pillars were difficult enough as it was to get them as tight as possible without adding the complication of extending them down the gutter also.

Michael

 

[mattyj]

I think Ronbo is talking about the spreader over the windshield. We made are "halos" in 1 piece, but I don't see any reason why you couldn't have the "A" pillar and the gutter rail bent from the same piece, and then use a spreader across the top of the windshield. It might look a little different, but it's probably the same amout of fabrication/welding.

-Jeremy

Something like this....

Then used spreaders

 

[JBweld]

Exactly. Looks great! Any internal support?

-Jeremy

 

[mattyj]

Exactly. Looks great! Any internal support?

-Jeremy

Yes it ties into an internal cage at the B and C pillars with diagonal supports.

More info here..... http://www.naxja.org/forum/showthread.php?t=932208

 

[Matt_West]

Michael / Jeremy and those who helped, great job! Those are some nice looking cages. I think they are very well designed for your stated goals and intended usage.

I have recently been studying cage designs for track usage. While the usage scenarios are different I think some of the design considerations may be relevant. Of particular concern is the range of movement of the body and seat in front and rear impact scenarios. I was astounded to hear the review of some highspeed test footage talking about seat backs flexing 18 inches.

FIA mandates fixed buckets and while some other sanctioning bodies mandate seat back braces tying into the cage. You might also consider the addition of some highdensity foam if you haven't already added it.

Again great job, I think you are well prepared for a roll or flop. Please do consider what the scenario is for an incident with high engergy loads longitudenly through the vehichle and occupants.