Making the frame purdy

[Xjin85]

So, I have a wicked big job ahead of me being that I have several different tasks that I need to do consecutively and will likely take at least a week.

First let me ask this question:

I’ll be doing some rust removal and prevention to the differentials, frame, and wheel wells. Bought all the stuff but want to run my process by you guys to make sure I have it down right.

1. Degrease
2. Remove rust with wire wheel/Brillo pads
3. Degrease again (for good measure)
4.Apply Klean Strip Metal prep
5. While everything down with paint thinner
6. Apply POR 15
7. Apply RP-342

Does that sound about right? Really wanted to put in the added percussions for best protection.

I’ll be replacing all my breaks, rotors, calipers, u-axel u- joints, ball joints, and adding a control stem drop bracket, and new tie rod on the front of the Jeep tomorrow. So, figured id do all the rust stuff under there while I’m at it.

Will post some pics soon. Hoping for it to start getting warmer in the next couple days. Hopefully above 60.

is there anything that I’m missing or should do differently with regard to my plan for the rust?

Thanks guys,
-DF

 

[Numbers]

Sounds like a fun project!

Definitely above my pay grade nothing but power washers and spray cans for mine.

 

[waxer]

Thankfully out in Cali we don't have to deal with the rust demon issue at all. Good luck on your project.

 

[Anak]

Why follow the "Metal Prep" with paint thinner?

I am guessing you have done your homework and there may be a very good reason to do things in that order, but in my mind I would think the metal prep would do a better job than the paint thinner, consequently being the product that would leave the best prepped surface.

Has the EPA "fixed " metal prep so well that paint thinner is superior?

 

[Bent]

A wipe down with a high % isopropyl alcohol will leave no residue. If you use denatured alcohol it will leave a residue from the additive they put in the ethol alcohol to keep you from drinking it. Paint thinner, and mineral spirits will leave an oily residue. Acetone will also leave a residue. Depends on how particular you want to be.

 

[75SV1]

POR-15 says not to use a rust solvent. I'd use Spray Nine Grez-Off for heavy gunk. Then card off as much rust as you can. Degrease again. POR-15 has their own degreaser. Use their metal prep. The POR-15 at least twice. Then coat with a paint. There are other stuff. I am trying Agraguard. I think Tractor Supply carries it. I'm look at some other stuff too.

 

[DirtySouthXJ]

Not sure what the "metal prep" product is, but if it etches the surface, that is good. One thing I would keep in mind is the manufacturers recommendation for surface roughness; a wire brush likely won't create a surface rough or toothy enough for the paint to grab onto. I've seen this with bead blasted parts, the surface is too smooth for the paint to grab onto and the paint chips/peels in short order. See what POR-15 recommends and follow it.

 

[RCP Phx]

And save the RP-342 for your guns!

 

[75SV1]

POR-15 Metal Prep Quart

Provides the best adhesion for POR-15® on any metal surface

www.eastwood.com

POR Metal Prep sort of converts the rust. It also puts a coating on the bare metal. POR 15 needs some rust or the metal prep to adher to.

 

[Xjin85]

Why follow the "Metal Prep" with paint thinner?

I am guessing you have done your homework and there may be a very good reason to do things in that order, but in my mind I would think the metal prep would do a better job than the paint thinner, consequently being the product that would leave the best prepped surface.

Has the EPA "fixed " metal prep so well that paint thinner is superior?

It was cheaper than acetone.

Thanks guys for all the input! I’m plugging away at the damn rust. I used the metal prep from strip Klean bc it was a 3rd the price is Por15 metal prep.

Tomorrow I’ll post the pics of my progress.

Question, I removed a lot of Rust/grease down to clean bear metal. Should even bother painting everything with por15 and just do limited painting where rust still remains? And spray all the clean metal with no rust with the Rp-342?

Also, I have also read people having issues with Por15 sticking to metal. I have already removed a lot of the rust with a wire wheel. After I clean it down would that be enough roughage on the metal for the Por15 to stick? What if I sprayed primer then applied the Por15?

 

[Bent]

I didn't have an issue with rust, but when I took my frame down to bare metal prior to plating it, I used a black non-woven abrasive wheel. It cut through the undercoat, paint, and the "anti rust" coating/primer. They are great in a drill. I have an old Milwaukee 3/8" corded drill that I use specifically for drill mounted wire brushes and the like. When it gets too hot to hang on to, on go the gloves. Prefer not to use one of my good drill motors
I had to use a variable speed (4.5") grinder with the same type non-woven pads (Type 27). The pads would melt if I used them in a single speed grinder. Granted there are situations where a flap disc or twisted brush work better, but for the most part the non-woven pads were faster. The flap discs loaded up when used on undercoat and paint, the non-woven did not.

ETA: One advantage of paint thinner/mineral spirits is that it will seep under the coating and lift it off provided there are a sufficient number of edges, or scored areas for it to seep into. Acetone, depending on the coating will soften it enough to make a scraper effective removing the bulk of the coating.

 

[Xjin85]

DOES ANYONE KNOW WHAT SIZE. CASTLE NUTS I NEED FOR:

-THE TIE ROD
-Upper and lower ball joints? (Spicer 706944X)

I’m f so can someone post a link?

I’ve been doing my research but people are saying all kinds of different things.

 

[Anak]

Without going out and taking things apart I am going to say 1/2-20.

Finding the right castle nuts can be tricky. Tacoma Screw got me some that were too shallow for the job.

 

[WGxj]

So, I have a wicked big job ahead of me being that I have several different tasks that I need to do consecutively and will likely take at least a week.

First let me ask this question:

I’ll be doing some rust removal and prevention to the differentials, frame, and wheel wells. Bought all the stuff but want to run my process by you guys to make sure I have it down right.

1. Degrease
2. Remove rust with wire wheel/Brillo pads
3. Degrease again (for good measure)
4.Apply Klean Strip Metal prep
5. While everything down with paint thinner
6. Apply POR 15
7. Apply RP-342

Does that sound about right? Really wanted to put in the added percussions for best protection.

I’ll be replacing all my breaks, rotors, calipers, u-axel u- joints, ball joints, and adding a control stem drop bracket, and new tie rod on the front of the Jeep tomorrow. So, figured id do all the rust stuff under there while I’m at it.

Will post some pics soon. Hoping for it to start getting warmer in the next couple days. Hopefully above 60.

is there anything that I’m missing or should do differently with regard to my plan for the rust?

Thanks guys,
-DF

Funny thing about rust on the surface, as I learned. After removing rear OEM flares discovered how much of the quarter panel was rusted away. Needed to do the Cut-N-Fold featured in the XJ forums here at and elsewhere.

The next year cut out rocker panels both sides all the way to inner rocker, grind any remaining surface rust, had to replace about an 8" section of inner rocker panel just ahead of rear wheel, got that all done, fabricated new rocker panel replacements using 2" x 6" structural steel tubing. Since they were normally sold in 20' lengths, had it cut into 4 pieces. Sized the length, cut an angled profile on the front end. welded them shut, ground them smooth, surface ground, prepped bare steel with Eastwood pre-paint prep, pre taped weld locations, used Master Series Silver for rust proofing - two coats - then used Eastwood extreme black - 2 coats. Plug and stitch welded angle steel to inner rockers, plug welded a 3/4" wide flat steel under door sill, welded 2x6 tube into place.

Each year since have targeted a section for surface rust mitigation and maintenance. From the outside in. First from the underside of where the new rockers meet the pans to the other side of the pans. Next project will be from the Pans to the Frame. And then between the frame rails. Inch by inch everything is a cinch.

 

[WGxj]

Not sure what the "metal prep" product is, but if it etches the surface, that is good. One thing I would keep in mind is the manufacturers recommendation for surface roughness; a wire brush likely won't create a surface rough or toothy enough for the paint to grab onto. I've seen this with bead blasted parts, the surface is too smooth for the paint to grab onto and the paint chips/peels in short order. See what POR-15 recommends and follow it.

Yup, used 2" and 3" grinding wheels for air tool, 60 and 80 grit, cleaned with Eastwood pre-paint prep, tapped all weld surfaces and then rust proofed and finished away...

 

[WGxj]

It was cheaper than acetone.

Thanks guys for all the input! I’m plugging away at the damn rust. I used the metal prep from strip Klean bc it was a 3rd the price is Por15 metal prep.

Tomorrow I’ll post the pics of my progress.

Question, I removed a lot of Rust/grease down to clean bear metal. Should even bother painting everything with por15 and just do limited painting where rust still remains? And spray all the clean metal with no rust with the Rp-342?

Also, I have also read people having issues with Por15 sticking to metal. I have already removed a lot of the rust with a wire wheel. After I clean it down would that be enough roughage on the metal for the Por15 to stick? What if I sprayed primer then applied the Por15?

In doing rust repair of the rear Quarter Panel arches and doglegs, I learned a good lesson. Always grind off surface rust and if it cannot be ground down to bare metal without compromising the steel integrity, best to cut it out and MIG Weld a repair panel. That is what I am doing right now, just got the new quarter panels, will decide how much of each panel will be needed based on the rust I cut out. The fix will either be to replace the whole quarter panel or some portion of it using plug welds and 3M structural Adhesive. Still pondering. Waiting for reliable temperatures >50 degrees.

 

[75SV1]

It was cheaper than acetone.

Thanks guys for all the input! I’m plugging away at the damn rust. I used the metal prep from strip Klean bc it was a 3rd the price is Por15 metal prep.

Tomorrow I’ll post the pics of my progress.

Question, I removed a lot of Rust/grease down to clean bear metal. Should even bother painting everything with por15 and just do limited painting where rust still remains? And spray all the clean metal with no rust with the Rp-342?

Also, I have also read people having issues with Por15 sticking to metal. I have already removed a lot of the rust with a wire wheel. After I clean it down would that be enough roughage on the metal for the Por15 to stick? What if I sprayed primer then applied the Por15?

First you should clean the frame. Get off the oil, grease and undercoating. Probably then remover any heavy rust. Then use a degreaser. POR 15 does sell a degreaser. I'd use whatever. Then the metal prep. Then the POR 15. I like two coats. Then two coats of whatever paint. You have to apply the 2nd coat of POR 15 before the first gets hard. So, still tacky. In about an hour. Then the same for the first coat of paint or whatever.

 

[DirtySouthXJ]

I have also read people having issues with Por15 sticking to metal. I have already removed a lot of the rust with a wire wheel. After I clean it down would that be enough roughage on the metal for the Por15 to stick?

I don't think so brother. I have used wire wheels to prep for primer/paint and it didn't work well (primer/paint chipped/peeled off), the surface was not rough enough for the primer/paint to grab onto. Generally you would either need to prep with something more aggressive (coarser grit), use an etching primer (acidic, etches into metal to achieve proper surface profile for adhesion) with many different coatings.

But in your case, using POR-15 you should use their recommended prep/primer or you may end up with wasted time and wasted expensive product. It sounds like POR-15 is designed to be applied either over their prep/primer or over light surface/flash (not loose) rust. You could try another brand prep/primer but the compatibility would be unknown.

Not trying to be a downer, but I would hate to see you waste your time and money.

 

[Xjin85]

I don't think so brother. I have used wire wheels to prep for primer/paint and it didn't work well (primer/paint chipped/peeled off), the surface was not rough enough for the primer/paint to grab onto. Generally you would either need to prep with something more aggressive (coarser grit), use an etching primer (acidic, etches into metal to achieve proper surface profile for adhesion) with many different coatings.

But in your case, using POR-15 you should use their recommended prep/primer or you may end up with wasted time and wasted expensive product. It sounds like POR-15 is designed to be applied either over their prep/primer or over light surface/flash (not loose) rust. You could try another brand prep/primer but the compatibility would be unknown.

Not trying to be a downer, but I would hate to

I don't think so brother. I have used wire wheels to prep for primer/paint and it didn't work well (primer/paint chipped/peeled off), the surface was not rough enough for the primer/paint to grab onto. Generally you would either need to prep with something more aggressive (coarser grit), use an etching primer (acidic, etches into metal to achieve proper surface profile for adhesion) with many different coatings.

But in your case, using POR-15 you should use their recommended prep/primer or you may end up with wasted time and wasted expensive product. It sounds like POR-15 is designed to be applied either over their prep/primer or over light surface/flash (not loose) rust. You could try another brand prep/primer but the compatibility would be unknown.

Not trying to be a downer, but I would hate to see you waste your time and money.

Not at all man. Thank for letting me know and saving me the nightmare. I guess I’ll buy the Por 15 metal prep.

Question, will the Por 15 metal prep or the Klean Strip Metal Prep effectively covert rust?

 

[DirtySouthXJ]

It sounds like the POR-15 is designed for that purpose and the prep is designed for clean rust free metal if I understand correctly, because the POR-15 will not adhere properly to clean rust free metal on it's own. How well it achieves that goal? I'm not sure. But POR-15 has been around a long time, so they likely are doing something right.

Personally if I was doing it, I would take it to clean rust free metal and use the POR-15 prep product (scuffed to their surface roughness specs) rather than skip the prep product and go POR-15 over rust. That is just my opinion, but I am super (likely overly) picky about it.

Either way your project likely won't be cheap and will take time to do. I think you should spend the little bit of extra time and money to do it as recommended by the manufacturer, it is the best way to get the results you want/expect from the product.