JCR Ultimate Sliders Review

[DutchVDub]

Yeah I can. I need to get the Jeep cleaned up and do some welding on it. I'll get pics then. Probably Sunday.

 

[fallacist]

Ugh.. this is the third time I've come back to this thread to get some thoughts off my chest, and I delete them every time I write them out. I don't want to be too harsh on JCR, but something about this whole exchange doesn't sit well with me..

I'll leave it at this:
Ultimately I'm concerned that a well known and respected vendor distributed a product that doesn't fit right in the first place, was notified(on the advertisement thread), no action was apparently taken, and then would publicly suggest that it was something the customer had to do to make it fit right, which caused the compromise of integrity of the product.

It doesn't show well for your company. If you had said something along the lines of "Yeah, they're not supposed to do that; we don't know why, or how, but we'll make it right, and here's how" and left it there, I could give a thumbs up too. Instead you publicly questioned the customer, and then privately told him how you would make it right. From a PR perspective, you've got it backwards. Tell us publicly, as potential customers, what you are prepared to do to make it right in a situation like this, instead of attempting to suggest blame on the customer. Sure they're practical questions, but be the bigger person and publicly take responsibility for your product, and be transparent about how you can rectify the situation; its just good business.

I don't know about anyone else, but I have high expectations for what comes out of JCR's shop. You guys have raised the bar for yourselves, and when something goes wrong, you need to take the extra step to make it right.

 

[in4aride]

Link to other thread? As far as i see it its a new product, there might be a few issues, and as dutch got them and realized.there were fitment issues there should have been some contact between the two.to involved parties to send them back and retry.
i don't know if dutch did not pursue that option or it was not offered by jcr. that would be good info to have.

 

[DutchVDub]

Off my first post:

Daryl at JCR asked those of us who had had issues to email him and he then offered me a gift card as a way of apologizing. I thought that was awesome and asked him to just send me a set of their rain gutter clamps for making your own roof rack as I had them in mind for my HD Offroad roof sliders.

I did not contact JCR immediately upon discovering fitment issues as it was a Saturday and I was determined to get them on in time for my wheeling trip the next day. It wasn't until I was tightening the bottom bolts between the slider and the frame/pinch seam tie-in brackets (what was supposed to be the final step before painting and wheeling) that I discovered the major issue with how these fit. At that point it was getting late, I had been out in the sun all day, I hadn't had any beer yet, there was no beer in my fridge to drink, and I said something along the lines of "F* You sliders, you're going on the God D* Jeep wether you F*ing like it or not!!!"

I then painted them, went wheeling, and tried getting in touch with JCR that Monday to no avail.


JCR did email me as promissed and I asked Daryl to just give me a call so we could talk. He stated he would call me yesterday, but as of yet I haven't heard from him.

I'm really not trying to get anything out of this as thats not who I am. Am I happy with the product? No. Do I feel I wasted my money? Yes. Does that mean JCR should call up the potentially retiring Tracy Jordan and buy the Rock Bug from him for me? No, it doesn't. I'm not really sure what would be "right" and from the emails it seems like Daryl just isn't sure what to do either. In the end minus the dents in the outer tube it was my Jeep that failed, not the sliders. The sliders are still intact and "functioning" while the Jeep is what gave way and allowed things to move all around. That being said it is their product and design that relies soley on the Jeeps existiong rocker to provide that support.

I'm just patiently waiting to hear back from Daryl/JCR and in the mean time I know that for the rest of the wheeling season I have to be extra careful not to hit my rockers because apparently my Jeep is more likely to be damaged than it was w/o the sliders. Then, this winter most likely, I'll cut them off and throw them in the scrap metal bin at work so that I can replace them with boxed tubing that'll be braced back to the "frame" with even more boxed tubing in the form of a quasi boatside.

 

[AJSparko]

Biggest problem I see with the design is...well...the design. It's like a house, it's not going to be any stronger than it's own foundation it's built upon. And the XJ's rocker panel is anything but a solid base to bolt anything to. You could have hit the same obstacle 4 times as hard with a traditional pinch seam/framerail mounted rock slider and did zero damage to anything.

A person could do some redneck benchmarking to show this. Take one of those sliders and put one end up on a block and drive a diesel truck up it like a ramp. It will flex and I'm betting it will just flat out bend. Do the same with the traditional square tube slider, *yawn* nothing. It's why people can replace their entire rocker with box tubing and slam it all day long, replacing the weak structure with something solid, not just slapping a band aid on it.

Not bashing JCR, it's a cool idea...just not going to hold up like a traditional rock slider.

 

[DutchVDub]

Thats exactly what my conclusion is as well. I was hoping the tie-ins to the frame and pinch seam would be enough additional reinforcement but its obviously not. I think the fact that those tie-in brackets are also made from bent flat plate further deminishes the effectiveness of the setup.

 

[monkeyevil]

Ultimately I'm concerned that a well known and respected vendor distributed a product that doesn't fit right in the first place, was notified(on the advertisement thread), no action was apparently taken, and then would publicly suggest that it was something the customer had to do to make it fit right, which caused the compromise of integrity of the product.

It doesn't show well for your company. If you had said something along the lines of "Yeah, they're not supposed to do that; we don't know why, or how, but we'll make it right, and here's how" and left it there, I could give a thumbs up too. Instead you publicly questioned the customer, and then privately told him how you would make it right. From a PR perspective, you've got it backwards. Tell us publicly, as potential customers, what you are prepared to do to make it right in a situation like this, instead of attempting to suggest blame on the customer. Sure they're practical questions, but be the bigger person and publicly take responsibility for your product, and be transparent about how you can rectify the situation; its just good business.

I don't know about anyone else, but I have high expectations for what comes out of JCR's shop. You guys have raised the bar for yourselves, and when something goes wrong, you need to take the extra step to make it right.

Our typical way to deal with these issues is to either figure out the issue via pictures or ship the products back here and figure out the problem. We then can either repair the product, or send a new one out to the customer. This process is a PITA for everyone involved and expensive for us (we very often lose money because of UPS damage for instance), but we try and compensate a customer for their patience some other way as well if it's our fault.

In the event that we don't know ahead of time about an issue like this one, it's always evaluated on a case by case basis. It would be rediculously silly for us not to make a customer happy because posts like this one turn people off to us and our product. On the other hand, publically going though this customer service process would mean that every time anyone had an issue they would be sure and let us know what we did for X customer and that they want the same, even if the situations are completely different. Not to mention the amount of scamming we get would increase.

As far as my comments toward Dutch in this thead, I was being nothing if 100% transparent. The sliders weren't properly installed (because they could not be, our fault) and there was a failure. We are looking into the issue from a design standpoint, but I can tell you I won't be doing any testing with them welded on an XJ. I still have complete faith in this product, and because of this or other opinions, a customer may or may not; that is the great thing about all the choices we have as consumers. As far as with Dutch, I will be making it right, I just need to sit down with him and figure out what right is.

JCR did email me as promissed and I asked Daryl to just give me a call so we could talk. He stated he would call me yesterday, but as of yet I haven't heard from him.

I still owe you a call, I'm very sorry that I haven't sat down and done it yet. I'll ring you today.

 

[DutchVDub]

Talked to Daryl today, he seemed genuinely interested in what I had to say in regards to ways of re-engineering these to work better. I'm pretty sure we got things worked out on the Cust Serv side as well. :thumbsup: to Daryl and JCR, they might be a bit difficult to get a hold of but they definitely work at making you happy once you do.

 

[fallacist]

Didn't see the part about the gift card; I was going off of what I read in their advertisements. All I saw was that you had emailed them about the sliders, and 5 days JCR posted with an apology and email with more questions, then you said thanks, got it, and that was that.

Daryl, I realize sending them back is not ideal for anyone- I totally understand. I mentioned that I might not be aware of what was going on behind the scenes, which was true. It would have been great right there in your advertisements post to show potential customers how you could have made the situation right.

You didn't have to publicize the whole process, but at least tell us that you did something to make it right. The last post I saw from you was the one where you apologized, and said to email with any further questions. To a random chump like myself, it didn't come across as anything was done. That's the type of transparency I'm talking about

I'm happy to hear you made it right with Dutch. Maybe I'll hit him up to break that gift card in on some replacement JKS disco bushings.

 

[87manche]

Thats exactly what my conclusion is as well. I was hoping the tie-ins to the frame and pinch seam would be enough additional reinforcement but its obviously not. I think the fact that those tie-in brackets are also made from bent flat plate further deminishes the effectiveness of the setup.

that's kind of what I was getting at with the request for pictures.

From the unassembled product pictures it just looks like they will transfer any impact to the rocker underneath.

It's the same problem I have with the quarter guards that don't tie in with a bumper or anything else. You're still going to bend the quarter panel in, it's just not going to get dented.

 

[Ice_Man]

Does anyone know if these can be mounted up of I cut away my rusted rocker panels and use these as new panels/sliders?

 

[Chainer]

Does anyone know if these can be mounted up of I cut away my rusted rocker panels and use these as new panels/sliders?

I wouldn't, I believe part of the premise of the structure is the thicker metal distributes load over a structurally sound rocker. With much of one cut out I think the few screws actually usable to hold it on would tear out, or it would bend and dent much easier.

 

[xcm]

You would have to cut the legs/pinch seam mount off completely, then get creative. For the money, might as well just buy a stick of box tubing and do it the right way.

 

[xcm]

Crap, just realized i misread your thread title, sorry. Free bump.

 

[SanDiegoOverland]

First off, I apologize for these initially not fitting. I really wish we could have rectified it right there in our normal way (getting your product back, evaluating the fitting issue, send a new proper one back) because that not only makes sure that any quality control, shipping damage, or other issues that may arise get taken care of, but that in the end you get a product that installs properly, as that is the way we test our products around here.

I know that you and I talked about the welding issue, I said that the structure of our sliders would be fine welded to your Jeep, I also apologized and tried to make things right with you. You've been nothing if not level headed and honest with me and this forum, and that is refreshing and appreciated. I hope I have been the same with you.

So on to what happened, and for that I have no idea. The dent in the tube (1.75 x .120 wall for those curious) is an indicator of the amount of force we are dealing with, but the rockers of an XJ can take a lot of abuse and still be structurally sound (albeit dented to hell,) so why did the damage on your Jeep occur? Without testing and/or being there I can only pose questions.

• Was the bulk of the slider touching your rocker down the whole side? Or was it only affixed at the top with weld? This would put tons of pressure on that weld edge alone until the rest of the slider made contact with the body.
• Was this attachment point (just the weld) in a location that more easily put leverage on that portion of the rocker than being bolted to the side?
• Did the heat from the weld cause an issue with the sheet metal, with a seam, or with some panel glue?
• In what way is this install different than welding box tube into the rocker directly. Leverage on the step? Resistance to twisting of the box tube because it's welded on the bottom too?

I'm sorry I've got more questions that answers. I do know that I've used and tested the ones on our shop XJ as intended (and not as intended, projects around my house get weird...), and we do have others that have used them as protection with no issues. That doesn't mean I think your wrong, I just wonder if this was related to the installation, the sun and the moon aligning that day, or a legit weakness in our product.

I've got another e-mail coming your way today, where we can talk about making it right between us privately.

If anyone has any questions or issues about or with our products, please feel free to contact me daryl at jcroffroad dot com

~Daryl

This response with ensure that JCR will continue to get my hard-earned $$...:yelclap:....And kudo's to the OP for keeping your cool.


Hope everything gets worked out, and that you can figure out any improvements needed.

 

[PocketsEmpty]

I stumbled upon this thread while trying to find more information on the JCR Ultimate Sliders. Unfortunately, all your pictures are dead. OP, if you are still active here, is there any way you could fix the pictures or possibly send them to me? I've been unable to find anyone else's experience. I'm sorry you had to go through all that--also wondering what "right" ended up being to correct the situation. After reading through your experience, I think I've well decided that I just need to go 2x6 route. Thanks!

 

[DutchVDub]

I'd have to see if I even still have the pictures. In the end though I am satisfied with the way JCR handled the situation and even just recently bought a front bumper for my JK from them. I'm very happy with the JK bumper.

I still don't recommend these over their standard sliders. I think the standard sliders will hold up a lot better to heavy use. That's just my simple opinion.

 

[PocketsEmpty]

Good enough for me. My rockers are a little rusty anyways, no sense wasting money and taking a chance with it. Thanks