check out my blown engine

[Weasel]

someone did a stroker on here for ~1500 but I guess you would need a new everything? I don't know what else a thrown piston would screw up.

 

[BigDawgz]

It is just frustrating to know that I took it in and they put some sh!t in my car that I probably didn't need and didn't fix the problem and if they knew what they were doing I might have been able to prevent this mess.

I thought you said that they said it needed hoses, belts, thermostat...etc. These things are very easy to determine...and need replaced fairly often. Without a noticeable knock....or without you asking them to check for oil pressure/compression related problems...they would have no reason to check a 89,000 mile motor for all of these things. Then they would of had to of charged you a fee for diagnosis of your engines internals....without asking for this...no garage is going to volunteer to do that. Because in the end...the customer gets mad...and says "they charged me to diagnose all these other things....and I didn't tell them to....so I'm not paying". I think it's hard to blame a shop...unless...some of the parts they installed failed...say..the hoses, thermostat, belts or whatever failed...THEN you would have a claim...I think. If you'd been having overheating problems...prior to taking it to the dealer....that was probably when you actually did the damage to your motor.
Good luck with it though....I hope you find an affordable fix for your problem.

Just my .02 cents worth
Aron

 

[Yucca-Man]

The cheapest course of action would be to find a junkyard motor of the same year. ... Not something you want to do outside this time of year though.

He's at ASU - in Phoenix. "This time of year" is prime time for those bastiges to go wheeling while the rest of us freeze...been there, done that, working on the CJ in shorts and sandals in January.

Location is why I recommended the AZVJC for an engine or assistance, but which 'Joe' opened up a shop down there? Joe West, or another of 'em?

 

[xjcrawlr]

Joe Daro, his XJ is the one in the ad for Rockkawler in the magazines with the coilover rear long-arm. He has a VERY good rep within the local XJ community for knowing his shit when it comes to XJ's.



BTW; Yucca-man, I envy you. But I could never live in Ft. Collins, they'd never get me to leave the New Belgium Brewery! I love there Beer! :cheers:

 

[xjfrancis]

I wasn't trying to say you were low on oil. When the bearing spins out of position, the oil hole doesn't line up with the oil passage, so that specific bearing doesn't get oiled. When this happens, the bearing and journal heat up. The expansion due to heat reduces the clearance, causes excessive drag. The motor has to work harder to overcome the drag; hence the overheating sympton. A good stereo can help cover this up so the driver is less aware of the problem.

Would the oil pressure gauge have shown a sudden hike in pressure that read above 80 when this happens? I had noticed it doing this and had a bad feeling about it, but I was just hoping the gauge had gone bad.

Tell me more about your oil filter mod - what did you do to get it vertical like that?

well i didn't know they were positioned any other way. All I know is I am not the one that moved it.

Another question, what exactly is a stroker? can someone explain?

 

[xjfrancis]

He's at ASU - in Phoenix. "This time of year" is prime time for those bastiges to go wheeling while the rest of us freeze...been there, done that, working on the CJ in shorts and sandals in January.

Location is why I recommended the AZVJC for an engine or assistance, but which 'Joe' opened up a shop down there? Joe West, or another of 'em?

I went to their website and made myself a member, but I can't find where their forums are located on their website.

 

[redyouch]

i threw two rods about a year ago on 180K. for a couple weeks before i could hear rod knock. it suprises me that it blew out of nowhere. mine had two holes in the oil pan, and 2 holes in the side of the block, also the rods chopped the camshaft in half. fun huh?

 

[xjfrancis]

just talked to my guy at the earnhardt chrysler dealership and he told me that I would need a whole new rebuilt engine, and parts and labor that would equal 4 grand plus sales tax. so I'm not going to do that. I just need to know what my best options are for finding a rebuilt engine. I still can't figure out what a stroker is.

BTW mine never made any knocking or banging noises before it blew.

 

[Weasel]

stroker is where you increase the piston stroke I believe. A 4.5 or 4.6 can give you a good power increase over stock. Atleast in torque. I would think you should be able to get a junkyard used engine and stroke it for less then 4k. Install shouldn't be to difficult with the help of the AZ guys.

 

[woody]

Most genericaly: An engine is a pump... It draws combustible a/f mixture in through the intake, compresses it, fires it, and pumps burnt gas out through the exhaust. How hard the air/fuel mixture gets squished in the cyl by the piston when it is near its apex (TDC) is called the compression ratio. The camshaft is driven off the crankshaft and 'tells' the intake & exhaust valves when to open, overlap, & close in relationship to the position of the crank & pistons in the firing cycle. The distributor is in turn driven off the cam, and directs a jolt of electricity to the proper sparkplug.

The 'stroker' engine pulls & pushes the pistons up & down further within the bores, using a crankshaft with the rod journals offset further from it's centerline. and 'longer' rods. Displacement (cubic inches or liters) is increased even if the piston cylinder bore remains stock. If a stroker is built from a used engine block, those bores are customarily machined out to the next common upsize. The increase in bore and piston diameter (expressed in thousanths of an inch... .030, .040 etc) also adds displacement.

Folks making strokers from a 4.0l block, generally rebuild it using a crank from a 258" (AMC Jeep CJ 4.2l) along with 4.0 or aftermarket rods/custom pistons, and a choice of several cam profiles. Other than those key internal engine components, the rest of the engine management can be left pretty much alone. The bigger displacement engine will like a bit more fuel, higher flowing intake & exhaust systems, and having the cylinder head chambers & ports cleaned up.

So much for the lesson and teaser. I'd try to find a similar year XJ or YJ motor (long block) in good running order, a gasket set, oilpan, and get some help swapping it in.

Have Fun!

 

[DaltonXJ]

check out the local junkyards for a good replaceable engine.. call around and find the best prices also see if they will start the engine .. they can even start the engine outside the vehicle(if the engine is on the floor) if they don't know how to do this walk away.. no RUN!!!!

I work for a classic junkyard and we start engines all the time on the ground...
have fun in the search you can find all kinds of stuff in the junkyards...


Dalton

 

[Yucca-Man]

Reason I was asking about that oil filter is that from thie picture it appears to be pointed directly down (threads up). For a '96 it should be on the side along the block though.

If the cylinders aren't damaged in your block, it would be a good starting point for a rebuild stroker - using a crankshaft with longer throw allows more volume in the cylinders, making more horsepower and torque. Somehow though I have a feeling the block is toasted so you'll need to go all-out for a new one.

I thought the AZVJC had a forum, but apparently not. Put a post in the Classifieds and explain what's going on, you should get some answers that way. ... Just remembered...the forum is a Yahoo group http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/az_vjc/

 

[Goatman]

I've got a twin for that engine! Mine blew at 127K, but it was making noise for about 10K before that. Sounded like piston slap up until about 50-100 miles before it went, then got progressively louder until the big bang. I was trying to nurse it along until I had time to rebuild but waited too long. I ended up with low-mile boneyard engine that worked out great.

i threw two rods about a year ago on 180K. for a couple weeks before i could hear rod knock. it suprises me that it blew out of nowhere. mine had two holes in the oil pan, and 2 holes in the side of the block, also the rods chopped the camshaft in half. fun huh?

I feel a sudden drop in IQ around here........

You guys do realize, don't you, that when your engine starts to make a noise that you immediately get it checked out. Damn, even an oil change during that 10k miles would have shown metal in the oil....and then 50-100 miles with a loud noise?

How can you be surprised that it blew out of nowhere when it made noise for a couple of weeks? Not exactly out of nowhere......

 

[Goatman]

so I was just driving down the highway today and POP! the car dies and I pull over to the side of the road. I get out to see what the damage was and it was immediately apparent. The puddle of oil on the gravel is what gave it away. Here’s what happened.

http://www.jeeps-offroad.com/reader-rigs/album67/IMG_1403

http://www.jeeps-offroad.com/reader-rigs/album67/IMG_1405

So I guess I have a blown engine. Funny thing is, is that I just took it into the dealership about a week ago for an overheating problem and 50 miles later my engine blows. When I took it in they said that my hoses were worn out and my thermostat was going bad and since I have no way to do my own maintenance down here at school at asu i had them fix it for about 400.

thanks Craig.

You haven't said how hot it got or how many times, before you took it in for repairs. These engines are very durable, but no engine can take abuse like overheating. How often did you change the oil?

The dealership might help you out as a courtesy, but they have no liability unless the hoses or thermostat that they installed failed. Did you have them change the oil at the same time? Is there evidence that there was the right amount of oil in the motor? More than likely the damage was mostly done before they even looked at it.

 

[xjfrancis]

You haven't said how hot it got or how many times, before you took it in for repairs. These engines are very durable, but no engine can take abuse like overheating. How often did you change the oil?

The dealership might help you out as a courtesy, but they have no liability unless the hoses or thermostat that they installed failed. Did you have them change the oil at the same time? Is there evidence that there was the right amount of oil in the motor? More than likely the damage was mostly done before they even looked at it.

The overheating was never severe. I drove it form oregon to tahoe and then to phoenix. It started overheating slightly, about 200 miles from phoenix and so I flipped on the head and slowed down to where trucks were passing me. But it only got into the red once. Then I went to the dealership when I got to Arizona. I did drive it for maybe 50 miles before taking it in and it got warm every time I drove it but never into the red. 230 is the red line so I would say that it hung around 218 to 223 when driving before and after i took it in.

 

[Dr. Dyno]

The one time that you got the gauge into the red and the other times that it was close for several miles might have been enough to cook the rod bearings. The terminal event was probably one or more of those bearings being spun. Remove the holed oil pan and you'll see right away what happened.

 

[xjfrancis]

Thanks woody on the info on what a stroker is, that really cleared things up. I will pull off the oil pan when I get it back from the dealership(that will be on monday probably). I'll take some pics of the dammage and post them for everyone to check out.

 

[redsand187]

I thought you said that they said it needed hoses, belts, thermostat...etc. These things are very easy to determine...and need replaced fairly often. Without a noticeable knock....or without you asking them to check for oil pressure/compression related problems...they would have no reason to check a 89,000 mile motor for all of these things. Then they would of had to of charged you a fee for diagnosis of your engines internals....without asking for this...no garage is going to volunteer to do that. Because in the end...the customer gets mad...and says "they charged me to diagnose all these other things....and I didn't tell them to....so I'm not paying". I think it's hard to blame a shop...unless...some of the parts they installed failed...say..the hoses, thermostat, belts or whatever failed...THEN you would have a claim...I think. If you'd been having overheating problems...prior to taking it to the dealer....that was probably when you actually did the damage to your motor.
Good luck with it though....I hope you find an affordable fix for your problem.

Just my .02 cents worth
Aron

Exactly. If you came to my shop with your Jeep, the same thing would have happened. If you came in trying to blame us we would have sent you packing. If you were very persistant we would have you consult an attorney and ultimately our insurance would deny your claim. You would have wasted loads of time, and probably even more money.

Sorry to say it, you're SOL. I wouldn't really say anyone is to blame for this. The shop had no reason to do the check, and you really didn't know what to look for or what to ask about. I'd say chalk this one up to experience, you just learned a 3000 dollar lesson. Sorry man.

 

[Atl XJ]

230 is the red line so I would say that it hung around 218 to 223 when driving before and after i took it in.

On my '95 the redline on the temperature gauge is around 240 or so, maybe it got hotter than you think.

 

[MudDawg]

It will be readily appearant...if the bearings are smeared, they spun..lube failure...If the bearings are not smeared...mechanical failure.

On a mechanical failure..literaly something broke...rod bolt failed..rod cracked, etc...there was mention of very high oil pressure prior to the failure.

There is a failure mode that is rare, but possible in cold climates called "cold seizure"...if you run a cold engine at WOT under load before the engine warms up, the pistons can expand enough in a cold block to sieze, resulting in broken rods...usually the rod bolt will fail...and the piston(s) will be freshly scuffed...the very high appearant oil pressure points towards a revved up cold engine. If the bearings were failing due to previous overheating, the oil pressure would be low instead of high...assuming the gage is working properly.

Anyways the cheapest way out is to buy a used engine in good condition.