Engine oil! ZDDP! Rabblerabblerabble... A testimonial.

[ehall]

dupe

 

[Glenn B]

Surprised me as well. I was not expecting that as a result.

I use Rotella 10w30 because the engine runs noticeably better with it. It's really surprising.

 

[Ecomike]

I ran Shell Rotella in my Diesel, until they dropped the ZDDP in their formulas.

 

[Ecomike]

CRAP! Autozone has screwed me now! :hang:

Their private label 20W-50 dyno oil that was still API SL (higher zinc, about 1200 ppm ZDDP) is now showing up as only API SN, SM, SL, multi spec junk, which tells us nothing about what is really in it zinc wise now! Chit!:tears:

I found some Castrol GTX diesel oil 15W-40 in quarts (had never seen it before), Dyno oil with only the API CF-4-plus spec on it (meaning the old very high ZDDP for diesel engine oil spec, about 1800 ppm ZDDP). But it is $5.50 quart at NAPA, and only available in quarts, which is a little pricey. They had some CJ-4/SM Diesel 15W40, Mobil Delvac gallons on sale last week at O'Reileys for $9.99 that was very tempting price wise, but I am still looking for the higher ZDDP CF-4 Plus, old stuff at a decent price, and now for a source API SL 20W-50, ARGH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!:bawl:What a PITA!

 

[Ecomike]

Lol I'm sorry, ZDDP is actually a product of zinc dithiophosphate hence ZDP.

Actually there is ZDDP and ZDP. ZDDP is Zinc dialkyl dithio phosphate, ZDP is zinc dithiophosphate. From what I dug up last month the newest oil spec that came out in November last year, has replaced all ZDDP with ZDP, in some unknown quantity, with some lame excuse that ZDP does not harm Cat converters as much as ZDDP, which I think is BS, I think they got in trouble, and are trying now to plug the mistake.

I think they discovered too many engines failing from a lack of enough ZDDP, but EPA had put limits on ZDDP, so they switched to ZDP (this is my theory for now, it could be wrong, or incomplete). The newest spec oil is API SN, which just replaced API SM in Nov 2010.

 

[Milford Cubicle II]

:banghead:

Why shouldn't engine oil and gasoline have to have an ingredient list just like food does??

 

[kastein]

my jeeps run better with oil than without. So I run oil in them.

just to update with regards to this - it still runs better with oil than without. So I am still running oil in it. I even fixed it so it keeps the oil in by itself instead of needing a transfusion every day or two.

I don't really see what the big deal is... :dunno: hell I have even run used oil in it occasionally when it ran itself dry and I realized I didn't have any spare with me, just used oil I hadn't dropped off for recycling yet.

 

[Ecomike]

just to update with regards to this - it still runs better with oil than without. So I am still running oil in it. I even fixed it so it keeps the oil in by itself instead of needing a transfusion every day or two.

I don't really see what the big deal is... :dunno: hell I have even run used oil in it occasionally when it ran itself dry and I realized I didn't have any spare with me, just used oil I hadn't dropped off for recycling yet.

How do you know? How long have you tried running it with out oil?:roflmao:Was there a problem running it with out oil?

GMAFB!

 

[kastein]

How do you know? How long have you tried running it with out oil?:roflmao:Was there a problem running it with out oil?

GMAFB!

dozens of times. It leaked so much I frequently forgot to fill it back up in time, and either had to toss used oil in it, fill it back up, drive to a gas station and buy oil, or simply baby it while driving it back home with the lifters clacking away every time I went above 3k RPMs, turned a corner, or accelerated/decelerated.

I had it on the rev limiter one time with a little over a quart of oil in it, getting up a slick icy hill with only 2wd, no locker, and bald mismatched street tires. I ran it out of oil at highway speed more times than I can remember. Multiple times it ran out when I had no oil to put in it, and nowhere to buy any, and I just had to keep driving it.

It still had 40PSI hot running oil pressure and ran great when I pulled it out due to death wobble shaking the passenger side motor mount right off the block. I will be solid mounting it on a frame in my basement and attaching my 15kw generator head to it as a whole house backup generator this winter.

This is why I do not consider oil type or ZDDP content to be important. Oil is oil, it keeps the motor quiet and happy, but they seem to run just fine without it also :anon:

 

[Ecomike]

Then why waste money putting oil in it?

FWIW, the old ZDDP film in the engine is probably what kept the engine from a final total DEATH experience!

If you had oil pressure, you still had oil!!!!!

dozens of times. It leaked so much I frequently forgot to fill it back up in time, and either had to toss used oil in it, fill it back up, drive to a gas station and buy oil, or simply baby it while driving it back home with the lifters clacking away every time I went above 3k RPMs, turned a corner, or accelerated/decelerated.

I had it on the rev limiter one time with a little over a quart of oil in it, getting up a slick icy hill with only 2wd, no locker, and bald mismatched street tires. I ran it out of oil at highway speed more times than I can remember. Multiple times it ran out when I had no oil to put in it, and nowhere to buy any, and I just had to keep driving it.

It still had 40PSI hot running oil pressure and ran great when I pulled it out due to death wobble shaking the passenger side motor mount right off the block. I will be solid mounting it on a frame in my basement and attaching my 15kw generator head to it as a whole house backup generator this winter.

This is why I do not consider oil type or ZDDP content to be important. Oil is oil, it keeps the motor quiet and happy, but they seem to run just fine without it also :anon:

 

[Ecomike]

FWIW, I have friend who tried no oil. His threw a rod through the block. We had to replace that engine.

 

[kastein]

Well, it keeps the darn thing quieter if you put oil in it. And my stereo wasn't very loud... and oil was cheaper than an amp.

 

[Ecomike]

http://www.classiccarmotoroil.com/articles.html

http://www.aa1car.com/library/api_motor_oil_classifications.htm

 

[iwannadie]

:banghead:

Why shouldn't engine oil and gasoline have to have an ingredient list just like food does??

They do, it's called the MSDS.

 

[Ecomike]

http://corvaircenter.com/phorum/read.php?1,383609,383617

 

[Ecomike]

They do, it's called the MSDS.

MSDS does not list exact concentrations and does not list all the ingredients. They are often a pack of lies too, if for no other reason than a lack of info on them. I should know, I inspect them, have caught them lying, and I also write them. But they can sometimes reveal some info of use.

 

[Ecomike]

This looks real interesting!

http://www.widman.biz/uploads/Corvair_oil.pdf

 

[outlander]

Eastwoods has their zddp additive on sale for $10......i think ill buy whatever oil is cheap and conveniant and add that to it...would prob be cheaper than diesel oil i have been running

 

[tbburg]

This looks real interesting!

http://www.widman.biz/uploads/Corvair_oil.pdf

Interesting in what he has to say about Mobil-1 products:

ExxonMobil http://eolcs.api.org/DisplayLicenseInfo.asp?LicenseNo=0020
• Mobil 1: I’m sure Mobil 1 is an excellent oil for the average car. They have a lot of technology and blend for the high end masses. Unfortunately all of the normal Mobil 1 products have been reduced to SM/CF or SL/CF. This severely limits the sliding protection we are looking for in an oil for flat tappet engines.
• Mobil 1 High Mileage is the same. It might have a little more seal swell or other additives, but it is still registered as an SL.
• Mobil 1 Diesel Truck & SUV is the same. SM/CF in its offering as a 5W-30
• Mobil 1 Turbo Diesel Truck, however looks very recommendable with a registration of CI-4/SL. It is only offered as a SAE 5W-40, but that covers a wide enough range of temperatures that it should not be a problem in most areas. This appears to be a traditional synthetic formulation, so it would be on my list for synthetics, but note its thickening at low temperatures in the graph below.
• Mobil Delvac 1 5W-40 appears to be the same or very similar to Mobil 1 Turbo Diesel Truck, so would also make a on the list for synthetic, but note its thickening at low temperatures in the graph below.
• Exxon XD-3 Extra Range Oil appears to be the only ExxonMobil 10W-30 product that meets the CI-4/SL criteria. The MSDS shows that the base oil is “severely refined” implying a group II oil. I would therefore classify this oil as one of the top choices for a Non-Synthetic.

 

[Ecomike]

That is interesting.