No crank...

Before you assume I didn't do a search in the forums, I did. Its a 1992 XJ freshly re-ringed 4.0, AW4.

So, I was heading to pick up a new shop crane yesterday and I noticed a menacing smell coming from the engine. At first I though it was the 18 wheeler in front of me on the highway, because it was kinda warm out (First rather hot day this year) and I firgured he was running hot. I get to the store and load the crane in the XJ and attempt to start and sure as my luck, no crank.

I took it down to work and put it on a lift. The battery had a full charge, I checked the grounds and all the connections were fine (I didn't just wing it by eyeballing it!), the starter is a new peice and the cam, crank and all the major sensors are new. Its not the NSS, it was the 2nd thing I checked, the first being the battery. I haven't checked the starter yet, becuase I was about to pass out from being way over-tired, and didn't feel like getting busted by my boss sleeping in the shop.

Heres maybe the most telling peice of information: I noticed the volt gauge was at 11 volts 15 minutes BEFORE the smell occurred. I am wondering if anyone has had a starter solenoid stick, making the starter free-spin after it has fully engaged with the ring gear? Should have I checked the starter first?

just a WAG....but maybe the Ballast Resistor got smoked?

JNickel101 said:

just a WAG....but maybe the Ballast Resistor got smoked?

Click to expand...

The ballast resistor? How could that make a no start condition? I am by no means a Jeep expert, so all opinions are welcome!

I dunno, b/c I dont think my jeep has one (distributorless ignition) but I thought I had read before that if that goes out, it won't turn over, or maybe it was just that you'll get no spark...?

I could be 100% wrong though...I'll try searching...

JNickel101 said:

I dunno, b/c I dont think my jeep has one (distributorless ignition) but I thought I had read before that if that goes out, it won't turn over, or maybe it was just that you'll get no spark...?

I could be 100% wrong though...I'll try searching...

Click to expand...

I think if the ballast resistor fails it will only effect the spark. I would much appreciate any help searching.

Did you try lightly tapping on the starter with a rubber mallet?

JNickel101 said:

Did you try lightly tapping on the starter with a rubber mallet?

Click to expand...

Yeah I forgot to mention that. I also tryed to jump the terminals and tapping the solenoid. Nothing came of it.

But I don't know if the starter would keep running, and overheat. Thats what I'm leaning toward, but I haven't got the chance to remove the starter, yet.

Get your handy DVM and measure the voltage to the solenoid. If the voltage is 12 volts, then chances are good your battery is ok. Don't the auto parts places check starters, or am I thinking of alternators. Well if they check starters, have them check it. A fried wire would smell bad too.

BillBraski said:

The ballast resistor? How could that make a no start condition? I am by no means a Jeep expert, so all opinions are welcome!

Click to expand...

Hallo Jeepers. In a 92' the ballast resistor has to do only with the fuelpump.
No cranking is imo a bad startmotor,a failure of the altenator or mayby a dead startrelay. I hope it helps,greetings from holland
p.s. The TPS cabel is it free from the exhaustpipe?

wim hoppenbrouwers said:

Hallo Jeepers. In a 92' the ballast resistor has to do only with the fuelpump.
No cranking is imo a bad startmotor,a failure of the altenator or mayby a dead startrelay. I hope it helps,greetings from holland
p.s. The TPS cabel is it free from the exhaustpipe?

Click to expand...

Ok, it still won't crank at all. What sensors/wires should I check?

Leads to starter, with attention to the starter motor solenoid lead (the small-gage one.)

Starter motor relay. Should be in the PDC - but I don't know exactly where. However, it should be labelled "Starter" or something like that on the diagram.

Was the smell "burning electrics?" Did you have the windows up and aircon on? That could indicate that you managed to smoke the ignition switch (should be atop the column, down by the firewall.)

However, I find it worrisome that you jumped the solenoid post to the large mains post (right?) and didn't get any results. If that happened, the first thing I'd suspect would be the starter and the mains cable going from the battery to the large post on the starter (you should see battery voltage - or just a shade less - at the large wire terminal on the starter motor solenoid all the time. If you don't see battery voltage there, replace the cable.)

5-90 said:

Leads to starter, with attention to the starter motor solenoid lead (the small-gage one.)

Starter motor relay. Should be in the PDC - but I don't know exactly where. However, it should be labelled "Starter" or something like that on the diagram.

Was the smell "burning electrics?" Did you have the windows up and aircon on? That could indicate that you managed to smoke the ignition switch (should be atop the column, down by the firewall.)

However, I find it worrisome that you jumped the solenoid post to the large mains post (right?) and didn't get any results. If that happened, the first thing I'd suspect would be the starter and the mains cable going from the battery to the large post on the starter (you should see battery voltage - or just a shade less - at the large wire terminal on the starter motor solenoid all the time. If you don't see battery voltage there, replace the cable.)

Click to expand...

Thanks 5-90, you always give the details! The smell was really strange, it was similar to burning wire/electronics but kinda sweet smelling. I exchanged the old starter last night for a new one and it didn't help anything. I didn't check the leads at the solenoid yet becuase when I went to grab the DMM for the 2nd time to check the battery 2 nights ago, I dropped the damn thing and it stopped working and my buddys tool box was locked because hes on vacation so I'm waiting for the tool dealer to bring me a new one. But, for the heck of it I'm going to replace the positive cable and see what happens (Its one of the few things I didn't replace when I rebuilt it). Is there any sensor I should check again?

BillBraski said:

Thanks 5-90, you always give the details! The smell was really strange, it was similar to burning wire/electronics but kinda sweet smelling. I exchanged the old starter last night for a new one and it didn't help anything. I didn't check the leads at the solenoid yet becuase when I went to grab the DMM for the 2nd time to check the battery 2 nights ago, I dropped the damn thing and it stopped working and my buddys tool box was locked because hes on vacation so I'm waiting for the tool dealer to bring me a new one. But, for the heck of it I'm going to replace the positive cable and see what happens (Its one of the few things I didn't replace when I rebuilt it). Is there any sensor I should check again?

Click to expand...

That would cause a "No Crank" condition? I can't think of any - on any year. The only thing, sensorwise, that could cause a No Crank would be the NSS - and you said you'd checked that, correct?

BillBraski said:

Ok, it still won't crank at all. What sensors/wires should I check?

Click to expand...

Hallo, In the past I had also trubble with a short in the starterswitch on the steeringcolum. Burning smell too.:wave:

5-90 said:

That would cause a "No Crank" condition? I can't think of any - on any year. The only thing, sensorwise, that could cause a No Crank would be the NSS - and you said you'd checked that, correct?

Click to expand...

Yeah I checked the NSS already. I got my DMM today and I'm going to fix it tomorrow. I hope its just the lead wire or the positive from the battery.

wim hoppenbrouwers said:

Hallo, In the past I had also trubble with a short in the starterswitch on the steeringcolum. Burning smell too.:wave:

Click to expand...

I'll be sure to check that out as well. Thanks!

Its not the relay, the issue is the incoming power to the starter relay. It can be jumped at the PDC with a small wire. (Keep in mind I have no FSM)

What should I do next?

Pretty simple circuit....if your starter has ground through the block and 12 v @ the lead from the battery and at the solenoid it should crank...new junk starters are not unheard of...

Make sure you have power to Pin 30 - should be constantly hot.

I don't recall which way the coil of the relay is wired - check. With the coil out, check continuity between Pin 85 & ground, and Pin 86 & ground. One will have continuity, the other should have +12V with the key in the START position.

If both of those check out, replace the relay. Should be a standard DIN/ISO relay, available anywhere for around ten bucks.