XJ Dana 44 Swap, gone wrong.

[bluejeepkid]

I also don't see how a ujoint would cause these symptoms. The force/trauma of the rear end locking up at speed probably damaged the gearset/bearings/carrier and that's what's causing the noises.

 

[bluejeepkid]

Jack up the jeep by the diff and spin the driveshaft by hand, what's it feel like??

 

[kray.xj]

I also don't see how a ujoint would cause these symptoms. The force/trauma of the rear end locking up at speed probably damaged the gearset/bearings/carrier and that's what's causing the noises.

But what if it was the rear brakes? Would I still see internal trauma like that? It's definitely apparent that whoever had it before me did an improper rebuilt, not denying that. But do you think i need to completely strip and rebuild with all new parts including gears to rule out everything?

 

[SanDiegoOverland]

But what if it was the rear brakes? Would I still see internal trauma like that? It's definitely apparent that whoever had it before me did an improper rebuilt, not denying that. But do you think i need to completely strip and rebuild with all new parts including gears to rule out everything?

Since my kids ride in my jeep daily, I have a bit different perspective than some, probably, but IMO, completely stripping it and having rebuilt/rebulding it would be the only choice that wouldn't keep me up nights..lol.

As I said, not a popular opinion, for sure. Just the way I roll.

I think kastein has a pretty good theory going. Maybe have someone like jeeperjohn tear into it and take a good look. I'm sure his rates are probably very affordable compared to most.

 

[kray.xj]

Jack up the jeep by the diff and spin the driveshaft by hand, what's it feel like??

Spins very smoothly/freely for a few rotations and then catches. (i'm in neutral on the auto-tranny and the transfer case). I can power through the catch with most muscle though. Repeats this over and over. Appears to catch less often when spinning the other way.

 

[kray.xj]

Since my kids ride in my jeep daily, I have a bit different perspective than some, probably, but IMO, completely stripping it and having rebuilt/rebulding it would be the only choice that wouldn't keep me up nights..lol.

As I said, not a popular opinion, for sure. Just the way I roll.

I think kastein has a pretty good theory going. Maybe have someone like jeeperjohn tear into it and take a good look. I'm sure his rates are probably very affordable compared to most.

Completely valid and I would do the same in that circumstance! But this jeep is a secondary/beater rig for being a weekend warrior and driving in foul weather. It doesn't even have a backseat, ha.

 

[kastein]

The driveshaft is a good idea, but the D44 is only 1" longer than the D35. Add a 4.5" lift and the difference in length is negligable (unless the driveshaft was previously lengthend for the D35). I would check your driveshaft angles though and u-joints.

True... unless the pinion angle is jacked up from the leafs/shackles for the lift, I was surprised to realize how much driveshaft length depends on the pinion angle. Bring it up 4-5 degrees and suddenly your driveshaft needs to be half an inch shorter (not exact numbers, just an example.)

Also, a shackle lift will result in needing a shorter driveshaft since the whole leaf/axle assembly sorta swings forward, and whether lift springs require a longer or shorter driveshaft depends on the arch (if they're arched to bring the pinion up, same issues... pinion coming up = need shorter driveshaft, and vice versa) and whether the leafs are designed to keep the axle centered in the wheel well at ride height, or when the leafs are compressed. It's nowhere near as easy as the math I used when I determined that I was pretty sure a 4-5" lift would make up for d35 to d44/8.25 pinion length - in fact every time I think about the fact that I made that post, I wish I could find it and either correct it or add a "gotchas" section that explains what I just explained.

 

[Vanimal]

i know i couldnt use my stock driveshaft when i went from a d35 to d44 on 3" of lift. just sayin.
also, if it locked up, there's a good chance that it damaged your driveshaft ujoints. i'd check those out carefully.

 

[kray.xj]

True... unless the pinion angle is jacked up from the leafs/shackles for the lift, I was surprised to realize how much driveshaft length depends on the pinion angle. Bring it up 4-5 degrees and suddenly your driveshaft needs to be half an inch shorter (not exact numbers, just an example.)

Also, a shackle lift will result in needing a shorter driveshaft since the whole leaf/axle assembly sorta swings forward, and whether lift springs require a longer or shorter driveshaft depends on the arch (if they're arched to bring the pinion up, same issues... pinion coming up = need shorter driveshaft, and vice versa) and whether the leafs are designed to keep the axle centered in the wheel well at ride height, or when the leafs are compressed. It's nowhere near as easy as the math I used when I determined that I was pretty sure a 4-5" lift would make up for d35 to d44/8.25 pinion length - in fact every time I think about the fact that I made that post, I wish I could find it and either correct it or add a "gotchas" section that explains what I just explained.

Certainly, but with something like that I would think it would be an intermittent issue. This is absolutely constant and definitely rotational. It appears to even sync with my speedo needle jumping.

 

[kray.xj]

i know i couldnt use my stock driveshaft when i went from a d35 to d44 on 3" of lift. just sayin.
also, if it locked up, there's a good chance that it damaged your driveshaft ujoints. i'd check those out carefully.

Good advice! Will do.

 

[bluejeepkid]

Again, pull the cover and find out!
It clearly binds when its rotated. I don't see what the problem is here.
Either its fine inside and your on to the next theory, or its clearly mangled inside and then you know what to fix

 

[kray.xj]

Again, pull the cover and find out!
It clearly binds when its rotated. I don't see what the problem is here.
Either its fine inside and your on to the next theory, or its clearly mangled inside and then you know what to fix

Problem is gear oil and additive is expensive to throw away if not needed. (stupid LSD). But you're right, I'll check it out as soon as possible!

 

[kastein]

If you're careful, you can drain it into a pan and reuse it... it's only like 10-15 bucks worth of lube so I usually don't sweat it.

 

[WAZZUXJ]

Found odd huge rubber seals smashed in between the axle tubes and the carrier bearings. They were both mutilated.

Seals were definitely for-real seals with structure. RTV wouldn't be that fancy/nice looking. They were both mutilated around 1/2 the circumference however. Maybe heat?

This is what has me questioning any work previously done to the axle.

The Dana 44 is sealed with outer shaft seals not inner like the Dana 30. If the PO jammed some 'inner seals' between the axle tubes and carrier bearings he most definitly jacked up the carrier shim stack.

If you removed the seals, but only returned the original carrier shims, then your gear pattern is likely way off.

How easy was it to slide the carrier back into the housing?

 

[Vanimal]

This is what has me questioning any work previously done to the axle.

The Dana 44 is sealed with outer shaft seals not inner like the Dana 30. If the PO jammed some 'inner seals' between the axle tubes and carrier bearings he most definitly jacked up the carrier shim stack.

If you removed the seals, but only returned the original carrier shims, then your gear pattern is likely way off.

How easy was it to slide the carrier back into the housing?

the tubes aren't THAT close to the carrier bearings, i doubt even if they were actually seals instead of the standard rtv that the mfg puts in there that they would come close to interfering.

 

[WAZZUXJ]

Someone already mentioned the Mfg RTV though which is why I quoted his response that they looked like actual seals.

 

[2stix]

sounds like you may have a warped carrier or ring gear, or a ring gear that was not seated properly. when you say you can spin the pinion a couple turns before it binds makes me think the ring gear has a high spot and putting more force on the pinion gear at that point. since you say all the gears (pinion, ring, and spiders) and bearings (pinion, carrier, outside axle shaft) all look good, then it is time to check clearances. open it back up and get some tracking grease on the gears. see if there is a spot where the grease gets removed more so than the rest of the rotation. if so you know where to attack. check the ring gear and carrier for warpage or improperly seated ring gear. i am not sure why you did not replace ALL the bearings since you found debris in the fluid. once that debris got in the fluid, it made its way to all the bearings. even the outside axle shaft bearings. so they all should have been replaced. anyhow. do the carrier check and if you want remove the axle shaft first. once you determined the carrier is working properly, then install the axles. i have had bad warped drums act like what you are describing. though i doubt that it is your issue since you have all ready had damage to the inside carrier bearings and such.

 

[Peteyg]

When I made it home that was the first thing I did. Found two large twisted metal bits. Appeared to be from the driver-side carrier bearing and passengar-side LSD retaining spacer. (both had large chunks missing). Also had a lot of fine metal particles in the fluid that I drained. Fluid appeared to be some-what low too. I smacked myself in the head for not triple checking this before really driving around on the new axle. I had stuck my pinky in there right after finishing the swap but that was at 2AM and I didn't think about it being up in the air and the axle hanging.

THIS is your problem. You have a wasted carrier bearing, and your Trac-Loc cam apart. That will cause all of the symptoms you are describing.

 

[kray.xj]

This is what has me questioning any work previously done to the axle.

The Dana 44 is sealed with outer shaft seals not inner like the Dana 30. If the PO jammed some 'inner seals' between the axle tubes and carrier bearings he most definitly jacked up the carrier shim stack.

If you removed the seals, but only returned the original carrier shims, then your gear pattern is likely way off.

How easy was it to slide the carrier back into the housing?

Not at all. Had to use a 10lb deadblow hammer. Took a few good whacks. Torqued down to 70ft-lbs

 

[kray.xj]

sounds like you may have a warped carrier or ring gear, or a ring gear that was not seated properly. when you say you can spin the pinion a couple turns before it binds makes me think the ring gear has a high spot and putting more force on the pinion gear at that point. since you say all the gears (pinion, ring, and spiders) and bearings (pinion, carrier, outside axle shaft) all look good, then it is time to check clearances. open it back up and get some tracking grease on the gears. see if there is a spot where the grease gets removed more so than the rest of the rotation. if so you know where to attack. check the ring gear and carrier for warpage or improperly seated ring gear. i am not sure why you did not replace ALL the bearings since you found debris in the fluid. once that debris got in the fluid, it made its way to all the bearings. even the outside axle shaft bearings. so they all should have been replaced. anyhow. do the carrier check and if you want remove the axle shaft first. once you determined the carrier is working properly, then install the axles. i have had bad warped drums act like what you are describing. though i doubt that it is your issue since you have all ready had damage to the inside carrier bearings and such.

Just checked tonight when I got home. I disconnected the driveshaft from the axle and it still "catches" every few rotations. Assuming that issue is from the tranny/t-case. I can spin the pinion and/or tires and they roll smoothly but do give off the growling/grinding sound. I didn't have time to take the tires and drums off though. I'll test that tomorrow night.