Things to expect in Harlan

[043500]

Beating the dead horse but PLEASE be extra careful and watch EVERYWHERE you step and reach. Snakes are prevalent and last year I got within 5 feet of a rattler before he made me aware he was there. Copperheads don't let you now until it's too late. So if you have kids and/or dogs with you be even more careful...there was a dog bit 3 years ago.

Also bring extra shoes and a good rain jacket. If there's any rain you're likely to get a gullywasher and you'll wet your shoes pretty nicely. And chances are it will rain.

Bring food with you on the trails. It's likely you won't be anywhere that is not accessible by at least some of us...BUT trust me...a 14 hour trail ride can leave you hurt, tired, and starving!

I'm sure others will post up.

 

[Cottontail]

NOTES for the first timers:

The trail leaders will not do anything to put anyone in harms way and if anything should happen on the trail, there will be people there to assist. No one has ever been, nor will ever be, left behind to deal with a situation on their own.

There are several gas stations, 2 grocery stores, and fast food/sit down in Harlan. It is an 11 mile one way drive from the campground to the Walmart - about the farthest point in Harlan that anyone really needs to go.

The campground does have an air tank (free) and a pressure washer (costed) that are available for use. If you need specialty tools for any reason, someone is sure to have one with them. Just ask around

You can buy your park permits on site at the camp store. That is also where you pay for your camping. If you pay cash, the price is what the price is. If you use a credit card at the camp store you will get a small surcharge added on - maybe 3%. The camp store also sells ice.

If anyone is in Harlan on the 4th of July, they do a really nice fireworks show downtown on the main drag.

 

[Lowrange2]

Bring bug spray.

 

[Cottontail]

Bring bug spray.

And poison ivy pre-treatment aloe.

 

[RedHeep]

No one has ever been, nor will ever be, left behind to deal with a situation on their own.

Let's not go there.

 

[Ghost]

Lower Rock Garden always has copperheads between the main trail and the garden. That is the area to be most careful imho. Like posted if you are new and need something come ask. I'm in the white junk with the ghostbuster logo on the door!

 

[PacificEd]

Let's not go there.

Let's tell the whole story:

Nathan's Jeep had been overheating the entire day and we made plenty of provisions that day for repairs and to let it cool down. Towards the end of the day the group still wanted to ride but you guys were done and wanted to head back to camp. As we were at the base of the climb to Lion's Den deciding what the group wanted to do, it was at that point you and Nathan decided you would take your time limping back to camp on your own.

There are others that were there that day that confirm I didn't just "abandon" you guys to fend for yourselves. You had a map and said you were good. I can't help somebody when they tell me they will take it easy and work their way back and have a map. You said you could get back.

I figured an experienced trail rider like you could read a map. I can't help it you made a wrong turn.

If you were worried about getting back to camp you should have said so. We were deciding who could lead you back when you made the decision you did. That is on you.

 

[RedHeep]

Let's tell the whole story:

Nathan's Jeep had been overheating the entire day and we made plenty of provisions that day for repairs and to let it cool down. Towards the end of the day the group still wanted to ride but you guys were done and wanted to head back to camp. As we were at the base of the climb to Lion's Den deciding what the group wanted to do, it was at that point you and Nathan decided you would take your time limping back to camp on your own.

There are others that were there that day that confirm I didn't just "abandon" you guys to fend for yourselves. You had a map and said you were good. I can't help somebody when they tell me they will take it easy and work their way back and have a map. You said you could get back.

I figured an experienced trail rider like you could read a map. I can't help it you made a wrong turn.

If you were worried about getting back to camp you should have said so. We were deciding who could lead you back when you made the decision you did. That is on you.

I hope you have fun Ed. I think maybe your version and my version might be a little different. Let's have a beer sometime and we can talk about the multiple times "no one has been left to fend for themselves" at an event you organized.

 

[Lowrange2]

I hope you have fun Ed. I think maybe your version and my version might be a little different. Let's have a beer sometime and we can talk about the multiple times "no one has been left to fend for themselves" at an event you organized.

No matter what happened, starting crap in a thread intended to inform new members of what to expect at their first event is rather childish, don't you think? Seems sort of ironic coming from a leader of a dying club. Good job showing them exactly what to expect.

Though, it doesn't surprise me one bit. I can't imagine why anyone would have wanted to leave you behind to fend for yourself.

 

[RedHeep]

No matter what happened, starting crap in a thread intended to inform new members of what to expect at their first event is rather childish, don't you think? Seems sort of ironic coming from a leader of a dying club. Good job showing them exactly what to expect.

Though, it doesn't surprise me one bit. I can't imagine why anyone would have wanted to leave you behind to fend for yourself.

Never is a strong word. It's not true. If Dirk had a problem with my comment, he could have told me. I didn't start anything. Ed blew it up when he could have left it to those of us that knew what happened. My leadership in this club does not censor me, as I'm sure it would not censor you.

Regardless of anyone's opinion, I was left by the trail leader after changes were made to the intended trail ride without 100% approval of all the drivers. That shouldn't happen. It's not a camping trip with friends, it's a event. When you accept that responsibility as a trail leader, you do so with the intention that everyone is accounted for and led where everyone agrees to go.

I am very capable of reading a map. I read the map all the way to an unmarked section of a trail closed due to a washout without the ability to turn around and if I wasn't an "experienced" driver, it would have ended much differently than it did. Considering that Ed was leading the "easy" group, he could have sent someone much less experienced down the same trail and gotten someone hurt.

So we can have beers and talk about it someday, or we can keep hashing it out in this thread. Up to you.

 

[Lowrange2]

C'mon, Josh. You know good and well your remark was going to start something. They always do. Perhaps maybe your leadership role should censor you while in a public forum for potential new members to see the maturity level of our BOD.

I have no idea what happened in the situation you're referring to. Therefore, I obviously can't comment on it. All I know is that any ride of Ed's that I've been on has been thoroughly planned and no one has been left behind. Hell, the Thursday ride a couple years ago was painfully slow due to not leaving anyone behind.

Last time I attempted to have a beer with you, you spoke to me once while camping beside me over the course of a weekend. I can't imagine you'd make an effort to spend any quality time drinking beer with me in the future.

 

[PacificEd]

I hope you have fun Ed. I think maybe your version and my version might be a little different. Let's have a beer sometime and we can talk about the multiple times "no one has been left to fend for themselves" at an event you organized.

LOL, I think I will pass as I don't drink. Oh, and I will have fun. I have no desire to be around a person who is Mr. Critical about everything all the while never assisting or stepping up to help.

The event was very successful under my tenure with consistent growth due to my awesome team on the SEC board and the great members of the SEC, MWC and other chapters that attended. I guess we will both have our version of what transpired.

Step up sometime and see what it's really like to plan and run an event.

I will apologize to the members for airing this. Those that know me can decide the truth.

 

[Cottontail]

OK, it seems everyone has said our piece. It's apparent that consensus will not be achieved, but I think that the repartee served its purpose.

I will leave this thread up for the remainder of the work day, and then at COB, I will edit the thread to make it once again relevant to the topic at hand, which is educating the first timers on what to expect at a Cherokee Crawl event.

Air laundry now, or hold your peace.

 

[87manche]

so what about the time the group left my wife by herself with a jeep she couldn't drive after brian and I had told the group we were going to go run upper damnation.

When we got back she was crying because she thought that she had been abandoned and didn't have any way back down off the mountain because she couldn't drive a 5 speed.
Someone could have hopped in it and driven it with the rest of the group until we got back, or since the group knew where we were could have called us or sent someone to find out what was taking so long.

but I guess that never happened.

I'm sure that makes me the asshole for bringing it up, but to claim that no one has ever been left is untrue.

I like the SEC guys, but if we're being completely honest, you run the event likes it's a camping trip among buddies.

trail groups rarely leave at the specified time.
no one knows what frequencies anyone else is on.
there's hardly ever a plan about where and when.
Registration is disorganized and usually consists of "find ***** at the campground"



I'm sure you'll all just dismiss this as me jumping to my brother's aid, but anyone that knows us knows that he's a big boy and doesn't need me to jump in, and I'm more that happy to let him hang himself when he's wrong.

you want my honest opinion, there it be.

don't bother responding, I rarely leave the MWC forum for reasons, and I'll not be coming back to have a discussion about the facts, and what I posted above is fact, if you want I'll have Jennie come and type out her version of the event.

no hard feelings, but you wanted airing out laundry.

 

[Lowrange2]

When we got back she was crying because she thought that she had been abandoned and didn't have any way back down off the mountain because she couldn't drive a 5 speed.
Someone could have hopped in it and driven it with the rest of the group until we got back, or since the group knew where we were could have called us or sent someone to find out what was taking so long.

You left your wife alone with a rig that she can't drive?

You left the group and took off alone and expected the group to come find you?

 

[87manche]

You left your wife alone with a rig that she can't drive?

You left the group and took off alone and expected the group to come find you?

I stated facts up above, so don't try and twist this shit. When Brian and I left the trail leaders and group were completely aware of the situation, they then decided to leave her alone on the side of the trail before we returned.
That's facts.


Were you there?
quite frankly you can go **** yourself.
I don't care.

 

[87manche]

for the record, this is wy I don't venture outside of the MWC forums anymore.
because I'm an anti social dickhead that will tell you to go **** yourself.

would you like to continue the conversation, or are we done here?

 

[Lowrange2]

No need. I've proved my point.

There's an obvious trend that plenty people are aware of.

There's always something to moan and complain about for some people.

 

[87manche]

so because you rolled up into a conversation that you knew nothing about and started making stupid statements and I told you to go **** yourself you can't handle it?

go be a bitch somewhere else.

and while you're at it, go ahead and censor up this thread.

this whole ****ing club has gone to shit anyhow.
and it will die.

and I won't give a ****.

but when you ask for opinions and then ignore them and then can't figure out why your event isn't the biggest event for the whole group even though you have the best wheeling on the east coast, don't ask for opinions anymore, because you're obviously not listening.

 

[Lowrange2]

Then please leave. Please.

It's quite entertaining how you post in a thread about an event that you have no intention of attending and start calling people bitches when you're the one that can't keep up with your own wife then come cry about it here. No, I wasn't there but my past experience with you tells me that I should trust what you say about as far as I can throw you. Just like I trusted that you'd pay me for the pile of MJ parts that I brought to the Crawl for you that you never made any attempt to get from me or pay for.

Trail leaders are not baby sitters. If you have an issue and need help then someone will be there to help you. If you say "I got it" then we're going to assume you're an adult and have shit under control.

The two of you who can never do wrong and are wronged by everyone you cross paths with have worn out your welcome with me. It's high-school drama that I've grown out of. The same group of people complain about something every year. We know it's going to happen. The only difference is this year you decided to start something before the event even happened.

We all get along just fine and enjoy our "camping trip with friends" without you. Coming home and not having to deal with whining from someone who didn't even attend would also be enjoyable.