Suggestions wanted..........on a cage

[cracker]

Another cage thread...........

I had my buddy work this up on Cinema 4D (didn't want Ron to flame me for using MS Paint plus the virtual XJ looks cool ). I wanted to build a solid cage to withstand my horrible driving style. I know I will need to eventually go through the firewall to do it a little better but as far as the beginnings, this is what I have been thinking.

As you can see I plan on removing my front fenders completely and placing a small triangle and tube to support the headlights and the bottom of the bumper. The front Bumper is a Warn with a gtill Guard so those of you who know it can envision it in place of the grey bar in front. The rear wheel wells will be opened up about 4-5" and the rear wheel pushed back a tad to help with the departure angle. Lower quarter panels will be eliminated as well and bumper trimmed. Expecting to have a 103" or so WB.

As you can see here I am going through the roof into the cab at 3 (maybe 4) places. Triangulation is key. I am hoping to make up for the lack of cage in the rear where the hatch is an still optomize cargo space with room for a third passenger.

I know Goatman is not here to answer but how important is this portion here? It seems kind of odd not being tied into the roof at the front but the handle sure looks nice to have..

Any thoughts? Keep in mind that the whole engine will be removed and the front end plated for additional support up there.

 

[Captain Ron]

Ummm Cinema. MS Paint for nerds. Does it generate a cut list, and do the welding too?

There's a conspicuous lack of tie in to the unibody.

Your buddy missed the trim at the rear joints, and the right rear joint is half a tube off.

--ron

 

[cracker]

There's a conspicuous lack of tie in to the unibody.

From what I can gather (which in general is limited) I would have 4 points inside the cabin, 2 at the rear bumper, 4 at the rock slider which will need some serious beefing up or even replacement, and 2 at the front bumper and the unibody and he hood will be welded as well. With my math, that is 12 points (exluding the 3/4 roof points which are not really structural). Goats, for example, has 10 (off the top of my head). How many points of contact would one recommend?

I found this searching around from Crash. The factory roof support brackets make a lot of sense to tie into. I am hoping to do this as well and that should help out.

We went around and around on this and decided to weld it. 3M makes a kiler body sealer that is paintable, and I'm sure it would work fine. Since I wanted to weld to the factory roof support brackets (above the trim, hidden by your headliner), I figured why not weld to the roof as well.

Your buddy missed the trim at the rear joints, and the right rear joint is half a tube off.

--ron

Oops. He was drunk I will have him correct it

 

[tealcherokee]

heres what im in the process of building, its for a chopped 2 door, has some modifications, and more tube now though....

http://tehbaron.com/ryan/images/EXO3.jpg (image is HUGE)

 

[David Taylor]

Why exo ? I have never seen one that doesn't look like it wants to snag on rocks as you go by.

 

[CRASH]

Why exo ? I have never seen one that doesn't look like it wants to snag on rocks as you go by.

Or that doesn't look like ass.

 

[cracker]

Why exo ? I have never seen one that doesn't look like it wants to snag on rocks as you go by.

Good question. Since there are other trails in the world other than JV, I would like to keep a full bodied rig. I assume that someday a buggy may be made for the sole purpose of JV but this rig I would prefer to be an 'all around' XJ. An exo would, to an certain extent, help he protect the rig and more importantly protect my wife and I from mishaps and not take up as much cargo space. Yes I am sure I will rub on rocks but I am hoping to keep the exposed tubes on the sides no more than 2.5" (and preferably less) from the body.

I am willing to take all the crap from you when I do get snagged on rocks out there

Or that doesn't look like ass.

It already looks like ass. This would be the icing on the cake

This being said, any thoughts about the design? Any noticable design flaws that need to be addressed?

 

[CRASH]

Look at where the "X" is behind the B pillar, there is no way that is going to fit right there, it's right where your front seats are. An X behind the front seats has to be about 6 inches behind the B pillar, which means right about the middle of the back door opening. It makes the back opening fairly useless.

 

[cracker]

Look at where the "X" is behind the B pillar, there is no way that is going to fit right there, it's right where your front seats are. An X behind the front seats has to be about 6 inches behind the B pillar, which means right about the middle of the back door opening. It makes the back opening fairly useless.

When we were drawing it out, we had to guess where everything was (i.e the front seats). I know you cannot see it in the pics I have posted but I had placed the B Pillar X at a 18ish degree angle (to follow the angle of the front seats). It would definitly inhibit entry into the already barely accessable rear seats but would give me enough room for a child or even a small adult. I think a detailed evaluation will have to be made during the assembly of that B pillar X.

 

[CRASH]

When we were drawing it out, we had to guess where everything was (i.e the front seats). I know you cannot see it in the pics I have posted but I had placed the B Pillar X at a 18ish degree angle (to follow the angle of the front seats). It would definitly inhibit entry into the already barely accessable rear seats but would give me enough room for a child or even a small adult. I think a detailed evaluation will have to be made during the assembly of that B pillar X.

Not unless you move the rear seat back. The back seat occupants skull will meet that X with extreme prejudice in a frontal impact scenario, unless you put a single seat in the middle, far enough back to prevent contact, and to do that, you'll have to eliminate the "V" that is between the back seat an the cargo area.....

 

[cj7xjmj]

As some one who has allready exo'd his rig, I wish I would have chose a different winch, and a narrower front bumper to help improve my approach angle. MY lack of larger tires and approach angle has denied me a few times on obstacles. Just My 2 cents.



Patrick

 

[cracker]

As some one who has allready exo'd his rig, I wish I would have chose a different winch, and a narrower front bumper to help improve my approach angle. MY lack of larger tires and approach angle has denied me a few times on obstacles. Just My 2 cents.



Patrick

Thank you Patrick, Paul S made the same observation and offered similar advise.

I should have mentioned my tire size. I have 37s on it with about 8 or so inches of lift and the front tire is pushed out about an inch. Yes I do stick out there a little but approach isn't horrible but not great either (the drawing is not perfectly to scale). Until I fab a new bumper, this is going to have to hold me through the summer. Paul recommended that I keep the winch (9.5TI) and remove the grill and push it all the way back to the edge of the radiator and fab a bumper to accomodate that. With my height, it should be 'fair' so I may be working that direction in the long run.

 

[Jes]

When we were drawing it out, we had to guess where everything was (i.e the front seats). I know you cannot see it in the pics I have posted but I had placed the B Pillar X at a 18ish degree angle (to follow the angle of the front seats). It would definitly inhibit entry into the already barely accessable rear seats but would give me enough room for a child or even a small adult. I think a detailed evaluation will have to be made during the assembly of that B pillar X.

Angling it(the B pillar X) is just a band aid and it won't work anyway. If you want an X at the B pillar you're gonna have to give up the back seat.
Look at mine, there's no way it could be any farther forward and there's no way I could have a back seat even if I had a four door.

 

[Matt S.]

Angling it(the B pillar X) is just a band aid and it won't work anyway. If you want an X at the B pillar you're gonna have to give up the back seat.
Look at mine, there's no way it could be any farther forward and there's no way I could have a back seat even if I had a four door.

Agreed. The only way your going to get a back seat, is to do it AZ style like rick and eric. If you want the X, say by by to rear doors and seats. I can honestly say, if I had not done the X in the jeep. It would still have a B pillar and 4doors. But once the rear area became unoccupiable(is that a word? lol) I todl myself to be a man and cut it.

dont go the cracka... keep the doors, and loose the exo.

 

[Roxtar]

I put a bend in my "B" post, angling it back, and added a gusset to replace the strength lost.
Then curved the shoulder harness bar around the seats.
Had the "X" (actually two "V"s) intecept there.
Here are pics of what I mean:
http://www.midwestxj.org/Gallery/cage

Real XJs have four (usable) doors and three seats.

 

[Paul S]

I think that before you know it you're going to become a JV addict, face it, you're already hooked
So, don't do the exo. Build a simple intenal cage that you won't feel bad about cutting out in 3 months when you realize that you want to liberate your sheet metal & start over.

Paul

 

[David Taylor]

I think that before you know it you're going to become a JV addict, face it, you're already hooked
So, don't do the exo. Build a simple intenal cage that you won't feel bad about cutting out in 3 months when you realize that you want to liberate your sheet metal & start over.

Paul

X2

 

[Jeff 98XJ WI]

I would have to say that kids B pillar is pretty much what I was planning. I like it. I don't care for his seats too much though as they are damn tough to get into! Jeff

I put a bend in my "B" post, angling it back, and added a gusset to replace the strength lost.
Then curved the shoulder harness bar around the seats.
Had the "X" (actually two "V"s) intecept there.
Here are pics of what I mean:
http://www.midwestxj.org/Gallery/cage

Real XJs have four (usable) doors and three seats.

 

[Roxtar]

I don't care for his seats too much though as they are damn tough to get into! Jeff

And harder to get out of.

 

[Capt. Nemo]

As a little food for thought, here's the link to my cage:

http://www.naxja.org/forum/showthread.php?t=78911

I think it will end up staying the way it is in the post, simply because I've decided that for the slow rock crawling that I do, it will be just fine to protect the occupants. For some of the guys that go bombing to the trail head down in JV, it would be marginal becasue of the material used and lack of triangulation in the driver's area. The back seat is still useable, however, I'm short and my head hits the tubing in the rear pass area.

E