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Steering Box Brace

I had some real steering issues this weekend so I'm bumping an old thread for some help. First can someone confirm the statement above that most of the force is moved from the box and sector shaft with hydro assist? That would mean the force is moved to the ram mount and the steering knuckle right? So is there a steering knuckle upgrade?

If I don't go hydro assist, how worried should I be about the sector shaft? I have a box brace and im about to plate the frame. Im on 35s with upgraded tie rods. I need to get a new pump and smaller pully...I couldn't turn at all at idle with any friction on my tires yesterday.
 
sunburned said:
Damn, that brace is bling! Time to upgrade that tie rod though. Your box will stay together and on the frame, but the tie rod will be a pretzel in no time.


Yep, fortunately I am in residency so the jeep hasn't seen dirt in about 3 years. Once I finish and start practicing, serious buildup will begin...cage, axles, hydro assist, hydroboost brakes, etc. however with a mild build and upgraded steering, I think my brace would be perfect for saving the box until going to hydro assist.


Good Lord, any bumper plates or anything around the box? Use grade 8 bolts? If you go ram assist, that should take all the force off the box and sector shaft.
Click to expand...
 
PahlMc said:
I had some real steering issues this weekend so I'm bumping an old thread for some help. First can someone confirm the statement above that most of the force is moved from the box and sector shaft with hydro assist? That would mean the force is moved to the ram mount and the steering knuckle right? So is there a steering knuckle upgrade?

If I don't go hydro assist, how worried should I be about the sector shaft? I have a box brace and im about to plate the frame. Im on 35s with upgraded tie rods. I need to get a new pump and smaller pully...I couldn't turn at all at idle with any friction on my tires yesterday.
Click to expand...

It is. And you won't be bending knuckles unless you have a ram that's too long and/or bad steering stops. You should be able to turn 35s on the road no problem without assist, so something is bad... The pump or the box
 
This is what I run, have run it with no problems for almost a year now.
works great
 
Re: Re: Steering Box Brace

XJLI said:
It is. And you won't be bending knuckles unless you have a ram that's too long and/or bad steering stops. You should be able to turn 35s on the road no problem without assist, so something is bad... The pump or the box
Click to expand...

I have no personal experience with ram assist in the rocks but there is more than one thread on this site saying the Dana 30 will bend. Can anyone confirm my spindles can hold up? That would be great.

Even with correct stops and the correct ram travel if you get pinned next to a rock and try to turn that way, all the force of the ram is on the steering arm. Obviously if I have a ram and it still takes muscle to turn im doing it wrong! But broken steering scares me.
 
PahlMc said:
I have no personal experience with ram assist in the rocks but there is more than one thread on this site saying the Dana 30 will bend. Can anyone confirm my spindles can hold up? That would be great.

Even with correct stops and the correct ram travel if you get pinned next to a rock and try to turn that way, all the force of the ram is on the steering arm. Obviously if I have a ram and it still takes muscle to turn im doing it wrong! But broken steering scares me.
Click to expand...

If you run an 8 inch ram, you'll rip shit apart. Run the correct size ram and it's fine. And you don't have spindles.
 
Not sure what you mean about not having spindles...I know solid axle guys call them knuckles.

Either way I'm going to try to have ram assist on the jeep before new years. If I do run into issues I'll figure it out then.
 
I think he was assuming you have a dana 30. Withunit bearing there no spindle for a hub to slide over. Going to a real 44/60 front means you have spindles/hubs etc.
 
sunburned said:
Ill let you guys know how my hydro assist D30 holds up if I ever get it in the rocks again.
Click to expand...

I know a fair number of people running Hydro assist on D30s. they hold up fine.

XJLI said:
Yea.

And like I said, if you run the correct travel ram, you wont bend anything
Click to expand...
not necessarily true. Pahlmc is correct. when your tires are wedged, and you try and force them with the ram, the weakest link will fail. the most common thing to fail is the ram mount, but D30 (and D44 for that matter) knuckles are not that strong and the steering arms like to bend. I've seen that happen to a few rigs.



XJLI said:
I And you don't have spindles.
Click to expand...
My dana 30 has spindles.
 
Last edited:
Building a brace identical to what NCCherokee built. I may try to capture the inside of both frame rails if possible to add some extra stiffness to the front end. Great photos and description. I ordered the PSC nut, I got the last one they had in stock. Parts guy said they did not plan on making any more of them. With the steering box replacement and this brace as part of my DW elimination effort (see DW 18 mo saga thread) I will have eliminated one more possible current/future problem. This will the inside frame rail plating will also stiffen up the front end considerably.

John
 
nosigma said:
Building a brace identical to what NCCherokee built. I may try to capture the inside of both frame rails if possible to add some extra stiffness to the front end. Great photos and description. I ordered the PSC nut, I got the last one they had in stock. Parts guy said they did not plan on making any more of them. With the steering box replacement and this brace as part of my DW elimination effort (see DW 18 mo saga thread) I will have eliminated one more possible current/future problem. This will the inside frame rail plating will also stiffen up the front end considerably.

John
Click to expand...

Cool I'd like to see it when done.
 
Here are some pictures I took this afternoon. Rain finally stopped long enough to tack it together and pull it off the rig. This evening I polished it up, cut the tubing to length and welded it all in except for the gussets that go from the bearing mounting plate back to the 2x2 tubing. I hope to have those welded in tomorrow and then paint it all up. A Christmas present for my XJ.









You will notice a couple of differences between this build and NC Cherokees.

On the plus side I pick up the steering box bolts on the drive side and the use the holes for the RHD steering box bolts on the passenger side. Should be very stout and add to the stiffness of the front end considerably.

On the negative side (more PIA than anything else) I use a bearing mount that requires 4 bolts. While this will be more stable I was very very lucky that it cleared the pitman arm. Notice that I had to weld in and then grind down two of the four bolts. The bolt heads before grinding hit the pitman arm. After grinding I have about 3/16ths clearance. I could have slid the bearing lower on the shaft but I wanted to keep it as close to the box as possible for strength and as high as possible for clearance. The steering box is one thing I dont want to hit a rock with.

A couple of pics tomorrow or Christmas when its all painted.

John
 
Plans to trim the shaft below the bearing? Seems like it hangs down a lot.
Probably want a skid under it too
 
Yes I will be trimming it off. Not sure if I want to skid it or not, probably not. Its a little bit lower than the track bar and the Pitman arm where it attaches to the drag link, neither of which I have ever it. Adding a skid would make it hard to remove the bearing unless it hung well below the studs and the shaft extension. Easy enough to add.

Cant wait to get it finished up today and a new picture up. Looks pretty awful after being out in the rain under the rig mocked up for 3 days before tack welding it. I sure hope the welding didnt warp it and misalign the bearing!!!!!

John
 


 
I installed it tonight. I would change a couple things if I did it again:

#1 Use the two bolt bearing like NCCherokee did. After welding it up the plate distorted and I got contact between the rear two bolts and the Pitman arm. This would never happen with the two bolt bearing.

#2 Use a spherical bearing. The alignment is super critical to make sure the steering shaft is not bound up. I had to pull mine 3 times and beat it with a sledge hammer (its damn strong) to "tweak it" a few hundredths of an inch so everything lined up perfectly. A spherical bearing in a two bolt housing would give just as good lateral support while allowing for slight changes in alignment between the shaft and the bearing.

Following up on #2 above: I am concerned what will happen as the chassis flexes when it up on two diagonal wheels or leaned over way far off camber and the chassis flexes. Will it bind? Probably. Will it make it hard to steer? I doubt it. Will I wear out the steering box faster? Probably. Time will tell.

John
 
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