One ton tapered inserts or ream?

[Ben824]

So my 97 XJ still has its factory steering with 272,000. It really has needed to be replaced for about 4 years now. I have been looking at everything I can do from mild to wild. After looking at options, considering budget, and intended use the UTK Chevy One Ton option is my best bet.

Now I know there is the infamous dead spot that many include the poly spacers to combat against. Ruff stuff has also come out with an product called the cure that is made of delrin.

I have seen some people be all for using the tapered inserts and some fully against it. My real concern is that the inserts have a lip to them. I am thinking by looking at it that the lip of the insert would cause issues with the poly spacers seating against the knuckle to prevent the tie rode roll.

Anyone have some thoughts or insight into this? I have searched and searched but nobody seems to touch on this much.

 

[Devilfrog]

The spacers only go in the knuckles, the drag link connections get reamed so no lip.
IMO reaming is the best method if using all standard ends (GM, Dodge truck TRE's etc). The insert were really more for those wanting to keep the Jeep ends as a reamer isn't readily available.

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[whitexj98]

I run inserts and JCR spacers, seems to work fine.

Here is what mine looked like welded in...

 

[xcm]

If you have a steady hand, or can build a quick 2x4 jig to hold the knuckles in a drill press, go for reaming. If you mess up or have a hard time of it, drill it out and try again with the threaded inserts.

 

[techno1154]

I run inserts and JCR spacers, seems to work fine.

Here is what mine looked like welded in...

Is the welded end of the insert the thicker end or the thinner end? I too am debating whether I should buy inserts or a reamer.

 

[Serious Offroad]

The inserts should not be welded, there's no need and it cannot expand as needed. Welding will cause the insert to deform.

If your drilled hole is slightly larger that .75, simply wrap a .002" feeler cauge around the insert before installing it. This keeps the insert from spreading open too much.

I've sold quite a few sets with the inserts, not nearly as many without. Either way, it's a great upgrade over stock steering.

 

[cal]

One would think the answer would be to build or buy an insert that is the correct size and doesn't have to expand, then.

No way I would trust those inserts not welded.

 

[Serious Offroad]

Why?
They can't simply fall out.

 

[cal]

Why?
They can't simply fall out.

If your drilled hole is slightly larger that .75, simply wrap a .002" feeler cauge around the insert before installing it. This keeps the insert from spreading open too much.

I would call that a sign of a very poorly engineered (or not at all engineered) product.

 

[Serious Offroad]

Not at all Cal.
Not everyone has access to a drill press and better quality drill bits. Sometimes the problem is the operator/installer.

You can't blame the design for installer error.

The TeraFlex inserts hold up extremely well. The knurled O.D. keep them where they are supposed to be.

 

[cal]

It's not that hard to drill a hole, but you're right, some people should not be doing it.

 

[Serious Offroad]

You would think so, but.......

 

[cal]

so... wrap an incomplete part with a feeler gauge, jam it into a hole and bolt it down?


Or buy a solid one that will stay true, and weld it. I guess either way could work.

 

[themauler]

It takes a while but I've seen people ream knuckles with a reamer and tap handle.

I reamed my knuckles with a $70 reamer on Amazon. Did the knuckles and pitman arm. No issues with a dewalt cordless drill. Still very sharp and use it as a step drill when I need to drill large holes.

If they can drill a hole for inserts, why not just team instead and have something that won't fail?


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[cal]

A good question. IMO the only reason to really use inserts is when fixing a knuckle that was reamed poorly, or when flipping steering and staying with the smaller half ton taper.

 

[techno1154]

One would think the answer would be to build or buy an insert that is the correct size and doesn't have to expand, then.

No way I would trust those inserts not welded.

Very interesting pieces. All the pictures I have seen are always the split version. Those are more appealing to me. Who makes those?
My preference is to ream the knuckles instead of using inserts but the price of a reamer and the fact that I may use it just once lead me to explore other options.
Cal, I will look into those on the picture you posted. It will be a week or two before I actually make a purchase. I am doing other repairs and upgrades to the front suspension while I ponder my preferred method of installing the Chevy tre's.

 

[Serious Offroad]

Tapered inserts are an option.
Reaming is an option.
There's no right or wrong involved, it's a simply two different approaches to an end result.

 

[cal]

The non split weld in style were around for years before this new split style showed up. I seem to recall having see Goferit's first, then a few guys who arent around anymore, and then ruff stuff.

Just google 'weld in taper insert' and filter through the results. I have used Ruff Stuff's and GoFerIt's. If I were to buy today, it would probably be TMR's.

http://www.tmrcustoms.com/store/ind...43_209&zenid=4aec65b7b8356907d26f5cd1711910ab

http://www.goferitoffroad.com/products.htm

http://www.ballisticfabrication.com/Tapered-GM-TRE-insert_p_1706.html

http://www.skysoffroaddesign.com/products/dana-gmts

http://www.ruffstuffspecialties.com/catalog/DLINSERT.html

The one thing to watch is the difference between 'tie rod' and 'drag link' tapers. In the 1 ton world they are the same taper, but one of them has a larger minor and major OD to set the taper in deeper (I forget which is the larger, sorry). Be sure you know what you're buying, and test fit the insert on your new tie rod end before you start working. Chevy drag link ends have a double jointed ball and about 15* more movement than their tie rod ends (or a normal sized heim), and really help keep things from binding when you are drooping out.

 

[VAhasnoWAVES]

the high angle drag link TRE at the pitman arm should be the larger taper. part number ES2026R. as CAL said, the taper is actually the same, its just "deeper," with a larger major/minor diameter.

i installed one of the weld in inserts from ruff stuff when i did my 44 swap and used a waggy pitman arm.

 

[paddlernate]

I've done both reaming and the inserts now and prefer the reaming. I was not pleased with the paltry amount of material left around the hole in the knuckle when I drilled out for the insert. Reaming leaves a lot more meat on the bone.