DD/Trail Tire

[woody431]

I was just reading in a JP magazine and saw a jeep with the Nitto terra grapplers, does anyone know anything about these tires? I know they're more of an AT.

I know two people that run them. Well one is on a Z71 and he doesn't wheel and the other is on a F250 diesel with 20" rims. The F250 runs a....325/60/R20, so like a 36" tire. I do know that they are pretty pricey compared to others, He was running 35" Xterrains and swapped them out for bigger ones and bigger rims for summer tires. I'm sure they are nice tires, but I just thought I'd chime in and say that he has said that they are durable for him, but he doesn't wheel either.

 

[planefixer]

Ditto what Nay said.I'm running 33" trXus and love them Great all around tire.Thet are great in snow especially.When i go up to 35"tires this winter I'll go with the trXus again.
Jeff

 

[Nay]

I know some have already said BFG AT, but I really like mine. They performed very well for me at penn's woods jeep jamboree. I did notice i had a little trouble with mud, where my friend running procomp mt's did not. I just cant see running mud terrains on the road. It just seems like a waste, but i understand not having enough money for two sets of tires.

I think that is the point of this thread: there are tires out there now that perform very well on the road as well as offroad and in variable conditions, and actually live up to the moniker "all terrain". BFG AT ko's are marginal in packed snow, terrible in mud and deep snow, pretty good on dry pavement, ok in the rain, and do quite well on dry, rocky trails (moderate rated trails).

trXus MT's are better than AT ko's on pavement (the sidewalls are much better...BFG's have too much "give"...and the lateral and braking traction is just as good IMO), far superior in packed snow, in a completely different league in deep snow and mud, and are very good in the rocks and do perfectly fine in the rain. Mine are wearing at least as well as the AT ko's did.

So the question really is this: if you deal with all types of terrain, why wouldn't you buy a tire that can actually handle all types of terrain with at least acceptable peformance? There isn't an "all terrain" made that satisfies that requirement unless you are driving a standard SUV and have to deal with mud holes in parking lots.

Back to the tire question - if you don't want to run a 10 ply tire, then you might consider the BFG MT km and sipe the inner lugs. I think the inner sipes make an enormous difference on that tire from what I've seen in the past.

Nay

 

[basalt51]

BFG AT ko's are marginal in packed snow, terrible in mud and deep snow

Every BFG AT I've seen has done great in the Snow. But what do I know. I'm from CA :dunno:

DD+rocks = MT/R

 

[Nay]

Every BFG AT I've seen has done great in the Snow. But what do I know. I'm from CA :dunno:

DD+rocks = MT/R

The downside of most, if not all, AT's is that they aren't optimized for lateral traction in slippery conditions (they are optimized to be smooth and quiet). Mud tires are to varying degrees designed for lateral traction (the Interco tires seem to be known for excellent lateral traction offroad) except that if you don't have sipes on the center lugs the tire needs to be digging, which doesn't happen on packed and icy snow or in the rain (there is no bite or channeling).

If you sipe just the center lugs to increase bite, and specifically design the center lugs for lateral traction and have a compound that doesn't freeze in the snow, then good MT's can begin to outperform the AT in both lateral and braking traction, and they are already far superior in pulling traction due to the large and well spaced outer lugs. I'm not suggesting that Interco Swampers are better than AT's in slick conditions...but the trxus is a different story.

I think the trxus is such an excellent snow tire (comparable in performance to dedicated snow tires for passenger cars) because the center lugs are running parallel to the forward motion of the car, maximizing lateral tread contact (the hourglass design also increases lateral tread contact). With tight center lug spacer and factory siping, the tires hold in the corners and stop very predictably. The TSL outer lugs, which are also siped, provide the forward traction.

If you look closely at the latest snow tire designs, you'll see a similar approach. The center is an arrowhead tread that runs parallel to the forward motion of the car (lots of lateral tread contact), and the lugs increase in spacing to the outside of the tire, all with heavy siping and channeling (and specialized "micro-pore" compound). The interlocking tread of the BFG AT couldn't be much different than these snow tire designs, and in my experience it does not provide predictable lateral traction in slippery conditions.

YMMV, of course.

Nay

 

[xjblue]

Ditto XJEEPER for MTR's, they rock on local terrain and for relatively quiet on road performance, considering they are the first "mud" type tire I've used I am extremely impressed with them.

 

[Big Red]

there is no way to properly answer that question without knowing what type of wheelin. since you're profile says Utah, i'm gonna assume you do mostly dry rock, so just get MTRs. If you have any liking for mud, completely disregard that suggestion, they suck horribly in the mud.

Yeah, mine got pretty stuck with goo in the mud too, but this Cali stuff at Prairie City is more clay than anything and that stuff sticks to anything. MTR's more aggresive and better than BFG mt's on the trail and are very very streetable and quiet. I have had BFG mt's, pro comp mt's, and now 35" mtr's and the MTR'S are the best tire I have ever had on and off the road. Plus you can get them at Sam's/Wal-mart cheaper.
Troy

 

[gmanxj]

For you guys with MTR's, how do they compare on road with..let's say BFG AT's, as far as noise is concerned?

Also, have any of you experienced wear problems with the MTR's?

Thanks,

 

[SeanP]

I will concur with that. I ran JV on AT's and (unbeknownst to me) an open rear diff. Did fine. Not the strongest of sidewalls compared to a bias ply, but those were some sweet tires. They also absolutely rocked in the snow.

For slickrock, the BFG TA/KO's work well between the road and trail They have awesome traction on slickrock to the point where I've snapped axles because of so much traction.

 

[Weasel]

I don't really like the MTR's. They never hook up well on the rocks in the hills, pack up with mud pretty quickly and the sidewalls arn't all that strong.

BFG MT's are about the same boat as the MTR's but with better mud abilties. They howl a lsight bit more but MTR's have a wierd annoying thunk from the lugs. I'd rather have the howl. Bfg's are fine in rain and snow.

Havn't had much expirence with the Trxus. Had some out last weekend and they where slipping off the rocks but the guy only had them down to 20 psi.

I've been running PJ's and will probably keep running them. Tough sidewalls and beads(tire machines usually cannot pop my 31's off my 8" rims with out some extra help), good rock traction(they will squeel just by turning the wheel when sitting on a rock), and awesome snow traction. Best snow tire I have run, better the the BFG a/T's I've ran. They are ok in mud but since I avoid the stuff I could care less. Also the center lugs will loose their sipes after awhile and I had them resiped. Fairly quiet, although they are making more noise(less then BFG with similar wear) that I have quite a few miles on them.

These tire comparos are pretty subjective though, there's alot of tires out there I havn't dealt with.

 

[collegeoffroad]

i'm kind of suprised to see no one has mentioned 'em before...but the Bridgestone Dueler Revo A/T's are a sweet tire! I've had 'em for about 5-8K so far and they've handled everything I've been able to throw at them (including some nice VA clay ). Take a look at www.tirerack.com to see reviews, but they're the top rated A/T tire out there :cheers: If you're looking into ordering them, they only make up to a 31" at a 15" wheel, but if this is a DD, that might not be a big deal for you. Otherwise, if you have/can get a 16" wheel, then you could move up to 32's. If you have a membership, Costco can get 'em for $135, mounted and balanced!

 

[pabloconrad]

BFG ATs.

Drive nice on the road. Great traction off.

And they're not noisy.

 

[gmanxj]

BFG ATs.

Drive nice on the road. Great traction off.

And they're not noisy.

Have you had any trouble in the rain with them?

 

[Yucca-Man]

Have you had any trouble in the rain with them? (BFG ATs)

I never did, with close to 100,000 miles o use on three different sets. They were pretty decent in the snow as well except for my first set - those had decent tread left but were so work-hardened that they wouldn't grip.

 

[Mike L]

What about the bigger tires in say a 37" or so? MT/R vs TSL/SX?

-Mike

 

[raceready]

Firestone Destination MT, they have awesome all around grip, look cool, are quieter than my old BFG AT's. I have had them for a year now, and they still have a BUNCH of tread left, It always amazes me that they are so soft and yet they wear so well. Cheaper than MTR's too. My wife's XJ will be getting them soon and we just have to decide what size.

Joel

 

[gmanxj]

I had not really considered the Destinations. I read an article a few months back that stated that they were a little noisier on the highway than BFG's.

 

[raceready]

I had a set of BFG ATs before my Destinations, and I noticed that the only time the Destinations were louder was when you had the windows down and were running next to a concrete median on the highway. with the windows up, I hardly notice them. You can easily have a conversation with a passenger when driving down the highway. They have been really resistant to cupping and i think this has a lot to do with the road noise. If you do consider them, don't be scared off by the aggressive looks and the soft compund, I probably have 12-15 thousand miles on them, almost all pavement miles, haven't rotated them yet (been real lazy). They are just starting to cup, and still have at leas 85-90 percent tread depth. I will definately be buying another set this year for the second Jeep.

Joel

 

[gmanxj]

Thanks Joel, that's the info I was looking for.

I went down to 4WP yesterday, and most of the guys there were telling me to run the new Trxus STS instead of a BFG AT. According to them, it performs better on slickrock surfaces and is also quieter on-road. I don't get it because they were trying to sell me a cheaper tire.

What does everyone think about the STS's?

 

[lankchevy]

my vote is for the dayton timberline mt's, pretty much the same tire as the destinations, only had mine for a few hundred miles but they are very quiet, my 33x12.50s are alot more quiet than my brothers 30x9.50 pro comp mt's. havent got to wheel it much yet cause i had some other stuff to fix first, but i might be going to disney this weekend then i will report back on how they did.

kolby