- Location
- Port Orchard, WA
more info here -
I really dont know anything about it other than what is contained in this thread on POR -
http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?t=531812
quoted here:
I really dont know anything about it other than what is contained in this thread on POR -
http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?t=531812
quoted here:
85runnerAZ said:Basically, we are getting forced with a sticker program to go off road. Currently there is no fee except for some land. I do not support the sticker program but since it is being forced on us there are some things that need to be in the bill. Please email or send this guy a letter.
Email: [email protected]
Address:
OHV Comments
c/o Joe Sacco
Arizona Game and Fish Department
2221 W. Greenway Road
Phoenix, AZ 85023-4399
Here's the cut and paste letter:
Dear Mr. Sacco:
As an outdoorsman and OHV enthusiast I appreciate the preservation of and access to our nation's vast resources. These areas should be preserved so that they can be used and enjoyed by all. The Copper Sticker program is one way to support this goal. If this program is not used to retain open access for all to these areas, then the Copper Sticker program will not receive my support.
However, I am concerned about several aspects of the bill in its current form. I cannot support it unless the following changes are made. The administration should not be changing the details of this bill flying in the face of the wishes of the users supporting this bill. That is not the democratic way.
These are the points required in the Copper Sticker bill for my support of it.
1. The bill must be user driven bill as it was intended. As you are well aware, the support of this bill, at least by the OHV community, has always been predicated on that point. I am sure the public forums bore this out as well.
2. With the sole exception of the two public at large positions, the program advisory group positions need to be filled by representatives of the OHV community. This is a user driven bill. The users are OHV enthusiasts. This is the demographic that must be represented on the advisory board. The public at large positions need to be filled by members who understand and support OHV needs. Without this the Copper Sticker program becomes nothing like what it was intended and cannot be supported by the OHV community.
3. The 60% cap on the individual categories from the 50% OHV dollars must have a time limit. The cap cannot be used in the same disbursement category two or more consecutive years. It has been suggested that certain non-OHV interests have been promised portion of the Copper Sticker program funds indefinitely. This is clearly not in the best interests of the program. We must ensure that funds are properly dispersed for purposes of the Copper Sticker OHV program and not redirected inappropriately. Oversight is mandatory. Other interests already receive funds for their own purposes. These funds must be applied in part for the ongoing maintenance of access to our outdoor resources, and for the expansion or changes to areas as the needs of the OHV community and the shift.
4. All motorized vehicles that travel off a highway or maintained road must require a Copper Sticker. It is unthinkable in my mind to make it any other way. Hunters pay for the right to take game; fishermen to take fish; licenses issued for motor vehicles pays for the State highways. All users of OHV routes should pay for that privilege, or none should. Very simple and quite fair. The Copper Sticker funds are for maintaining these areas. As a taxpayer I do not see this in any way as a double tax. I already pay for access to State Trust land and my vehicle is licensed by the State. I would happily pay the Copper State fee providing that it maintains access to these OHV areas. I also support exceptions for ranchers, miners and other specific official uses such as law enforcement or sanctioned maintenance efforts.
5. The Copper Sticker fee must be set by the advisory board. While the G&F Commission may have some advisory capacity in recommending the fee setting, the users must set the fee.
6. The State Land Department must allow the Copper Sticker program to replace the State Land Permit. This is actually in the best interest of the State Land department as it will afford more funds than are currently collected. Doing so will also reduce what may be perceived as double dipping by the user community.
7. Search and Rescue must be allocated some portion of funds as per the advisory board recommendation. This often under-funded service is critical for the safety of all off-road users, OHV or otherwise.
8. Allow automobile and recreational vehicle dealers to sell permits. It makes sense to put this program front and center to afford optimal and voluntary compliance. Among other benefits, this will heighten awareness, encourage voluntary compliance, reduce burden on law enforcement and reduce the administrative load on the program. There is precedent for other agencies for example, dealerships issuing temporary permits for new vehicles on behalf of the DMV.
Sincerely,
85runnerAZ said:Here is some background on the issue. I am just cut and pasting it from another guy.
I lifted this vernbatim from AzVJC as posted by SAndee McCullen.
I am not trying to be alaramist, but I firmly believe this is really important to us all. We will lose eventually our rights to wheel if we do not follow through. It only takes a few minutes from your busy day.
I am going to post my response in a reply to this thread. You can take whatever you want from these and make them yours or whatever, please just take a few minutes and follow up.
Note that the online submission for used by G&F is freaking brain dead and does not appear to work correctly. I am concerned it will lose rersponses, so I urge the snail mail or emailsubmission.
Thanks,
Barry
URGENT.... Copper Sticker RESPONSES
Copper Sticker proposal
OHV Enthusiasts,
I know this is lengthy but it is the background info regarding the proposed Copper Sticker (OHV Use Permit) proposed for legislation submission on Dec. 8, 2006. The "draft" as posted on the Game & Fish WEB site is NOT what the OHV community or workgroup supports. It's CLOSE but if left "open ended" OHV LOSE and the Enviros WIN. PLEASE take a few minutes and read this and then cut and paste the 5 issues and any of the suggested issues into your personal mail and send to Game & Fish immediately. OUR FUTURE depends on ALL OHV sending in their comments. You can be assured the radical environmentalists are doing just that!!!!!
Please forward this to your club/group, friends, fellow OHV'ers, family, or neighbors. Out of state groups can also be a help.
You can download the draft legislation and get additional information at the department's Web site at azgfd.gov/coppersticker. You can submit your opinion in two simple ways: through that Game and Fish Web site or by U.S. mail to OHV Comments, c/o Joe Sacco, Arizona Game and Fish Department, 2221 W. Greenway Road, Phoenix, AZ 85023-4399. [email protected]
History:
The planning on this started behind closed doors with Game & Fish and Law Enforcement approximately 5-6 years ago. There were rumors Game & Fish were looking at all the dollars being dedicated to Law Enforcement. Two years ago there were “select” persons from the OHV community invited to join this work group. This group met monthly or nearly monthly working through OHV laws and how to fund. Again, the original percentages dedicated the larger portion to Game & Fish. This was an intense process as each time the group, as a whole, agreed on a supporting issue when it came back to the table it had been changed. This went on for months. We were told the draft proposal would go to the public and the legislators prior to submission. Then suddenly a bill appeared within the House that no one knew about. This bill was killed, and revived in the Senate with Senator Flake supporting it. This bill was close to what the workgroup had agreed but it was missing several important issues that had again been deleted or changed. This was never resolved by the time the bill started through the committees. The committees tore the proposal apart. This was from pulling all OHV laws; deleting the Copper Sticker funding; pulling the OHV funding from State Parks and directing to G&F to the OHV laws back in but with no penalties allowed. This was also killed only to be revived again through a Striker Bill. This was left to die a natural death at the end of legislative session. We were always told this was intended to be a User Driven Bill.
Back to the table. Game & Fish requested the OHV partners draft a proposal to present to the group. This was done. The following meeting all issues were agreed to except the seats on the Arizona State Parks OHV Advisory Group. The Arizona Off Highway Vehicle Coalition met and agreed on a compromise to present. This compromise was submitted to Game & Fish at the next meeting of the work group. There was no discussion and no consideration. It was then announced this was not a User Driven Bill, it was now to be presented as a “Cooperative Bill”. Game & Fish had already made plans to go forth to the public WITHOUT a presentation the group had agreed to.
G&F seem to believe this money is THEIRS……………….. To do with as they and/or the G&F Commission wish. IT IS NOT THEIRS. G&F are simply WELL PAID "ADMINISTORS". The recommendations of how and where the 50% OHV dollars go is up to the OHV Advisory Group. It is OUR money. "USER PAY, USER RECEIVE"
At this time G&F have just finished ten public meetings across the state.......... Almost no ASA4WDC clubs were represented at any of them. It may be that many of you don't want a Use Sticker but at this time THERE WILL BE ONE WHETHER WE LIKE IT OR NOT. The problem is:
*** The "draft" as it is right now is NOT what the workgroup or the OHV group agreed to. It is CLOSE. The OHV laws are good and the basic concept is good. But no matter what the workgroup agreed to It was always turned to what G&F and the ENVIROS want. IF OHV do not get the issues listed below into this draft, the dollars WE will be REQUIRED to pay will go to G&F and the ENVIROS.
*** The other side of this issue is if G&F go ahead and submit to legislation the draft as it exists right now without support of the OHV community we can kill the bill like last year BUT if we kill it this year, and I'm certain we can, the counties are now waiting in the sidelines to implement their own permits for each county and ALL these dollars go to the specific county.............. NOTHING to OHV or our issues. OR, the feds will simply implement numerous OHV FEE AREAS that will be much more than $10.00 - $15.00 per year. OHV MUST step up to the plate and help "support their own". If land managers cannot MANAGE the lands as mandated, WE LOSE. They will close trails to meet what they determine they can "manage".
These are a MUST:
1. This "bill" MUST be submitted as a USER DRIVEN BILL.
(this has always been supported as a USER DRIVEN bill………… the first the workgroup heard of anything different was the LAST workgroup meeting prior to the public meetings.)
2. The Advisory Group MUST REMAIN as it is. ALL members must represent an OHV organization and the two public at large must represent casual recreation with knowledge and support of OHV.( This DEMAND from G&F to REQUIRE G&F be allowed THREE automatic appointments to the Advisory Group each year was first brought up at the LAST workgroup meeting before the public meetings. This demand came from the Environmental groups. Sierra Club and CBD are the two leaders. They DEMAND seats on the OHV board, the DEMAND "No dollars from this fund go to "opening new trails", They DEMAND 60% - 75% of the OHV 50% for law enforcement and an additional 20% of the 50% to Environmental rehab. No other Advisory Board in the state have OHV members………. The History; Archaeology; non-motorized trails (remember, we share the RTP dollars from Federal Highways 50/50 with non-motorized now); etc…………. If the environmentals get seats on OHVAG we'll end up like California within 3 years. NOTE #1: Also remember, this Advisory Group already oversees the OHV Gas Tax funds and the RTP funds. The enviros would also have a say in the disbursements of these dollars also!!!!!!!!!!
NOTE #2: The Coalition Resolution had originally offered a "compromise" regarding the "mandatory 3 seats for G&F on the Advisory Board". It was 2 seats with some parameters to keep the "die hard environmentalists at bay". G&F has refused to even consider this compromise so the OHV Coalition has pulled this offer and are supporting "Leave the OHVAG as is".)
3. The 60% cap on the individual catagories from the 50% OHV dollars MUST have a time limit. "The cap cannot be used in the same disbursement category two or more consecutive years".
(if no guidelines G&F will direct 60% of the OHV grants portion (50%) to law enforcement each year. G&F are already telling the enviros they can receive 60% of the 50% for law enforcement and/or enviromental rehab under a "Long term agreement". G&F have announced in the public meetings they plan on using this 50% of OHV funds to fund "long term funding". Remember, G&F already receive 7% for administering the fund; 15% for JUST G&F law enforcement; and an additional 15% for OHV education!!! They receive 30% of the Gas Tax dollars now ($800,000.00) for OHV law enforcement and education…….. When's the last time anyone within OHV see any of these funds used for them? The OHV Education trailer is now sitting at the Ben Avery Shooting Range being used as an office!!!!!
4. ALL motorized vehicles that travel off a highway or maintained road must require a Copper Sticker.
(The "workgroup" proposed EVERYONE be required a sticker but G&F have time and time again changed it back to THEIR WAY. They claim the legislators will "not approve a double tax on licensed vehicles". Duh!! The proposal as is written by G&F is: ALL licensed and unlicensed ATV's; ALL licensed and unlicensed dirt bikes & dual sport bikes; but ONLY UNLICENSED UTV's (rhinos, golf carts) and full sized vehicles. WHY would it not be a double tax on ATV's and bikes if this was the reason. The real reason is IF it affects ALL it means the Sierra Clubbers; CBD; mountain bikers; bird watchers; and equestrian that actually DRIVE OFF the maintained roads that their LICENSE PAYS TO MAINTAIN will have to have a Copper Sticker. It doesn't matter if their 1st choice of sport is 'motorized recreation', they need to help pay for the maintenance of the trails and the management and education of ethical use just the same. There are exemption allowances for ranchers, miners, and county/state maintenance)
5. The "fee" MUST BE SET BY THE ADVISORY BOARD, NOT the G&F Commission.
(there is no reason G&F Commission should have any say in this fund other than the mandated "yea or nay" approval/disapproval. The Advisory Group should make the recommendations. This issue was discussed at length in the workgroup. It was always agreed the fee would "NOT exceed $20.00". The recommended fee was $15.00. Not sure when G&F slipped this new "commission rules" phrase in but remember the enviros definitely are in bed with G&F. This fee was agreed to because it fits with the surrounding states and also allows for reciprocity.
NOTE: The workgroup also recommended there be a "family discount of 1/2 fee" for all vehicles titled to the same person. G&F have ignored this.
These are issues that are important but won't make or break the bill or specifically hurt OHV:
In view that G&F have refused to even look at the compromise from the OHV Coalition re the "seats on the OHV Advisory Board" the Coalition has pulled it's support of a compromise. We ask the Advisory group remain as is. (Remember, if G&F or the enviros have 3 of 7 seats their involvement (which you all know is not OHV positive) will also affect the OHV Gas Tax dollars and the RTP (Federal Hwy's Recreational Trails Program). We'd end up like California in 3 years where 9/10 of the OHV dollars go to the enviros.
A. To allow any event or action under a Special Permit or hunting fishing license, while actively hunting or fishing, shall be exempt from the CS requirement.
(this was an agreed on issue but we are hearing from the meetings many simply want the permit to be for EVERYONE. No exceptions. )
B. State Land Dept. MUST allow the Copper Sticker to replace the State Land Permit.
(as it is now is we can "cross" but not park, camp, stop, unload etc under the CS. The 10% of $4,000,000.00 would amount to $400,000.00 to use for law enforcement OR land mitigation or improvements. The State Trust Land permit at it's highest (9/10 OHV holders) brought in $125,000.00. I would think $400,000.00 should allow us some compensations)
C. Require 1% of the 18% to G&F Education OR the 15% G&F Law Enforcement, to be directed to Search & Rescue.
(this has been asked for and approved numerous times in the past by the workgroup but G&F say it cannot be done. SAR say YES it can)
D. Ask the dealers be allowed to sell permits.
(last week was the FIRST time they agreed to this. Don't let them back down)
E. Ask the permits be "Year to date" rather than a calendar year.
(a calendar year simply makes for a backlog at the beginning of the year and does not allow for pro-rated permits purchased later in the year)
Add any/all issues you believe need to be in the bill to "cover and safeguard against loop holes for OHV".
