Lets go racing!

[NRT_Chris]

How many on this board are close to having something could pass all the basic safety requirements?

I was thinking it would be fun to organize a couple races for new racers, Like what the old JS sportsman class was. This would not be affiliated with jeepspeed. It would be just for fun with maybe some side bets and a circulating trophy. No pro Jeepspeed would be eligible so my brother and I's race jeep would be out but prerunners set-ups like Crazyjim would qualify. We could race at a MORE or MDR race.

If this sounds like something you mite be into let me know..

[crazyjim]

This sounds badass, I wanna get my cage done and obviously fix my cracked head issue, but it sounds fun!

[Goatman]

Hmmm, that would be fun. I'd have to actually start my XJ and get it serviced. And get a job so I could afford to go. :)

Are you talking MORE or MDR safety requirements, or just some minimum standards that we all agree to?





Can XJ buggies run, or just street legal rigs? :D

[julio_a]

How many on this board are close to having something could pass all the basic safety requirements?

I was thinking it would be fun to organize a couple races for new racers, Like what the old JS sportsman class was. This would not be affiliated with jeepspeed. It would be just for fun with maybe some side bets and a circulating trophy. No pro Jeepspeed would be eligible so my brother and I's race jeep would be out but prerunners set-ups like Crazyjim would qualify. We could race at a MORE or MDR race.

If this sounds like something you mite be into let me know..

what kind of basic requirements? i have the t&j basic cage, the harnesses and seats. would i need the fuel cell as well? i was looking into jeepspeed about 2 years ago but never came to be. now i have a half in half out rig, but this seems like the perfect middle ground. especially for my newbie behind.

[NRT_Chris]

Hmmm, that would be fun. I'd have to actually start my XJ and get it serviced. And get a job so I could afford to go. :)

Are you talking MORE or MDR safety requirements, or just some minimum standards that we all agree to?





Can XJ buggies run, or just street legal rigs? :D

I'm talking Minimum safety requirements for the sanctioning body.. The idea is to get people racing in what they have. I'm going to have to say your buggy wouldn't qualify.

[alek21]

im down once i get my cage in :D

[Loose_Nuts_Enterprises]

I figured I'd be out as well...hey Richard, wanna race:D

[Loose_Nuts_Enterprises]

On a side note, anyone that meets the minimums can race in the sportsman class in any rig, as far as I know.

-Dan

[NRT_Chris]

Here are the rules:

1) Shocks....No by-pass. 2" and 2.5 smooth body shocks only. Shock mounting location is open. No coil overs.

2) Wheel travel limited to 10" front and 12" rear. Measured metal to metal on your bump stops.

3) Motor all stock except Intake and header. ( open for discussion with potential drivers )

4) Tire and wheels are open to any brand. 33" max tire.

5) Front and rear bumpers are open.

6) All windows must stay on the jeep.

The idea here is to keep this as close to daily driven vehicles as possible.

[NRT_Chris]

On a side note, anyone that meets the minimums can race in the sportsman class in any rig, as far as I know.

-Dan

This is true but its nice to race against like vehicles.

I personally feel Jeepspeed really messed up when they got rid of the Sportsman class. I was around for it and understand why they did but I feel there is a place for it so i have decided to try and organize a real informal version of it.

[IslanderOffRoad]

Here are the rules:

1) Shocks....No by-pass. 2" and 2.5 smooth body shocks only. Shock mounting location is open. No coil overs.

2) Wheel travel limited to 10" front and 12" rear. Measured metal to metal on your bump stops.

3) Motor all stock except Intake and header. ( open for discussion with potential drivers )

4) Tire and wheels are open to any brand. 33" max tire.

5) Front and rear bumpers are open.

6) All windows must stay on the jeep.

The idea here is to keep this as close to daily driven vehicles as possible.

Were it that basic I'd give it a run.

[Loose_Nuts_Enterprises]

I just posted that as useless trivia, for those that don't follow racing as closely as we do.

-Dan

[whooprunner]

This is true but its nice to race against like vehicles.

I personally feel Jeepspeed really messed up when they got rid of the Sportsman class. I was around for it and understand why they did but I feel there is a place for it so i have decided to try and organize a real informal version of it.

This is a really interesting idea Chris. I was co driving 1777 back in 2003 before the Hunts bought it. I'm a little hazy on the reasons for combining sportsman and pro into one class? Was it for a bigger pot? Just thinking out loud, but it'd be interesting if the sportsman class did officially come back again and did some of the more affordable/ closer to home races like we used to.

(Still thinking out loud) Maybe we could pay cheaper entries with BITD if there was no class prize money, but only JeepSpeed/ contingency awards. We're running out of 17xx numbers from all the built cars out there and I'm wondering if a more affordable sportsman class might bring the other Jeeps not racing out of retirement

Rules would be a can of worms, but it's an interesting idea.

-Randy

[GrimmJeeper]

i love this idea, i would be in once i get my XJ fixed from the last wheeling trip :doh:

[Goatman]

Well, my XJ wouldn't qualify either. :tears:


12+" travel in front, and 37's. I could limit the front and find some 33's. Would you ever check displacement? :)


Could Dan and I run along just for the fun of it? :D

[dakineJ]

This is an excellent idea! :cheers:

[kmanxj5050]

This would be sweet!!!! What if you have a 4.0 that was rebuilt and bored .030 over? and thats all thats done, except exhaust and intake.

[chris_amrein]

This is a really interesting idea Chris. I was co driving 1777 back in 2003 before the Hunts bought it. I'm a little hazy on the reasons for combining sportsman and pro into one class? Was it for a bigger pot? Just thinking out loud, but it'd be interesting if the sportsman class did officially come back again and did some of the more affordable/ closer to home races like we used to.

(Still thinking out loud) Maybe we could pay cheaper entries with BITD if there was no class prize money, but only JeepSpeed/ contingency awards. We're running out of 17xx numbers from all the built cars out there and I'm wondering if a more affordable sportsman class might bring the other Jeeps not racing out of retirement

Rules would be a can of worms, but it's an interesting idea.

-Randy

I am pretty sure the reason for combining the classes was the finish times were so close and the rules were not that different. Personaly I think the Sportsman class should have been more stock (along the lines of what Chris is proposing here) than it was and that would have made it cheaper and perhaps got more people involved.

For the record I always thought Jeepspeed classes should mirror mini-truck classes, with 7 stock, 7S, and 7 open.

Chris

[Jump This]

Can I do the 'thinking out loud' thing too?
;)

How about timed laps on a set up loop?
I always thought it would be cool to lay out a 15 mile course someplace
and run single laps for times. Sort of a braggin' thing. People could run
it anytime they wanted for practice, then a couple of times a year we
head out as a group and run it.

This is wayyyyy off topic and much different than what was proposed by
the original post, but it would allow some of those who have some interest in
going fast to compare times to the others around here.

Heck, it would even let Richard run Old Yeller' and let allow me to take my POS out too.

Just thinkin'.....

[NRT_Chris]

I just posted that as useless trivia, for those that don't follow racing as closely as we do.

-Dan

I figured. Info is always good..

IslanderOffroad: I really feel it can be this simple as long as the drivers remember its all in good fun. That was part of the down fall of the JS Sportsman class. The drivers kept trying to change the class rather then step up to a pro jeep.

[XJ_ranger]

I'd be interested in a bugified class... something like a stock I-6 block required, some of the OEM firewall and floor pan required class. :guitar:

[IslanderOffRoad]

I figured. Info is always good..

IslanderOffroad: I really feel it can be this simple as long as the drivers remember its all in good fun. That was part of the down fall of the JS Sportsman class. The drivers kept trying to change the class rather then step up to a pro jeep.


Yeah, I want something simple. Before I got into Jeeping I did alot of drag racing; most of which was just test and tune nights getting timeslips but every once in a while I'd enter the Friday night brackets at LACR. It was all just good fun, and it was cheap too!

[NRT_Chris]

Ok, I'm thinking Nov 7 will be the first race to try this. Here are the details..

Name: Stoddard 250
Date: Saturday, November 7, 2009
Drivers Meeting: 7:00 AM
Line Up: 7:30 AM
Race Time: 8:00 AM
Location: Barstow, CA
Start/Finish: Off Hwy 15 at Outlet Center Drive
Course: B
Course Length: 36 Miles
Number of Laps: 6
5 Laps for Classes: 900, 12-Unlimited, 1300, 3700
4 Laps for Classes: 300, 1100, 1200, 1450, 1700, 1900
Time Limit: 8 Hours

This should give enough time to get a few jeeps ready. We will most likely be racing in the 1450 class because the entry would only be 200.00 each. There is no payback from MDR in this class but we can put our own pot together..

[Goatman]

Can I do the 'thinking out loud' thing too?
;)

How about timed laps on a set up loop?
I always thought it would be cool to lay out a 15 mile course someplace
and run single laps for times. Sort of a braggin' thing. People could run
it anytime they wanted for practice, then a couple of times a year we
head out as a group and run it.

This is wayyyyy off topic and much different than what was proposed by
the original post, but it would allow some of those who have some interest in
going fast to compare times to the others around here.

Heck, it would even let Richard run Old Yeller' and let allow me to take my POS out too.

Just thinkin'.....


I think this could be fun. More of us are builing our rigs for speed as well as trails, and it would be fun to have a way to see how successful our builds are and to have some friendly competition. We could have an annual weekend run where we all showed up and ran the same course for time, just for fun. Then guys could practice on the same course for tuning and more friendly competition at other times. Call it the NAXJA loop. :)

Having a non-competitive way to do some friendy racing can help to justify the money we've spent on go fast goodies as well as give an opportunity to use our equipement in a fun way.

I like this idea.

[Jump This]

I think this could be fun. More of us are builing our rigs for speed as well as trails, and it would be fun to have a way to see how successful our builds are and to have some friendly competition. We could have an annual weekend run where we all showed up and ran the same course for time, just for fun. Then guys could practice on the same course for tuning and more friendly competition at other times. Call it the NAXJA loop. :)

Having a non-competitive way to do some friendy racing can help to justify the money we've spent on go fast goodies as well as give an opportunity to use our equipement in a fun way.

I like this idea.

Tell ya' what. We will start a separate thread based on this idea.

[NRT_Chris]

Tell ya' what. We will start a separate thread based on this idea.

This would be a good idea, I don't want the two to get confused. In my opinion this idea is kind of dangerous.. There is no way to secure a loop like what is being suggested with out the proper permits.

[Loose_Nuts_Enterprises]

As long as you don't make it an "Official Event" With entry fees, or any other kind of money involved, you don't need permits. I'm sure Richard has all the low-down on that type of thing.

-Dan

[IslanderOffRoad]

$200 is still alot more than I'd want to pay for a day of racing. Test and tune at the strip was 20 bucks. I'd pay 50 to do this.

[Tom_T&Js_Offroad]

if we were to run with a official race org. we would need to pay the $200. i think this is what my brother is suggesting.

[NRT_Chris]

$200 is still alot more than I'd want to pay for a day of racing. Test and tune at the strip was 20 bucks. I'd pay 50 to do this.

A good portion of your entry fee goes to paying for permits and environmental studies that the race promoter must pay for. Its not just to pay a track to race. 200.00 is a great deal. When we Best In The Desert its cost about 800.00 just to enter. then you have all the other race logistics to pay for as well. Just getting your team to Arizona or Nevada cost a small fortune if you dont have a contributing sponsor.

The idea for my post is to get people involved in desert racing not driving in a circle in some random location in the middle of lucurne. There is more to the desert racing experience then just driving fast in the dirt.

[Jump This]

As long as you don't make it an "Official Event" With entry fees, or any other kind of money involved, you don't need permits. I'm sure Richard has all the low-down on that type of thing.

-Dan

That would be the idea. Just a place where we can head out and do a lap or tow for fun or practice.
Practicing is still legal in the Jeepspeed class isn't it?
;)

[NRT_Chris]

That would be the idea. Just a place where we can head out and do a lap or tow for fun or practice.
Practicing is still legal in the Jeepspeed class isn't it?
;)


Practice is good but it's not desert racing

[whooprunner]

A good portion of your entry fee goes to paying for permits and environmental studies that the race promoter must pay for. Its not just to pay a track to race. 200.00 is a great deal. When we Best In The Desert its cost about 800.00 just to enter. then you have all the other race logistics to pay for as well. Just getting your team to Arizona or Nevada cost a small fortune if you dont have a contributing sponsor.

The idea for my post is to get people involved in desert racing not driving in a circle in some random location in the middle of lucurne. There is more to the desert racing experience then just driving fast in the dirt.

One thing I didn't hear Chris mention is that the money also goes toward insurance and safety provided by the race org. I can't imagine hitting some little kid doing a faimly trail ride because I was doing an unsanctioned race.

[Goatman]

One thing I didn't hear Chris mention is that the money also goes toward insurance and safety provided by the race org. I can't imagine hitting some little kid doing a faimly trail ride because I was doing an unsanctioned race.

Don't you have insurance?

[whooprunner]

Don't you have insurance?

I do for the street, not for the trail and especially not for an offroad race.

[Jump This]

I do for the street, not for the trail and especially not for an offroad race.

If you have insurance for your XJ, you have insurance to drive in anyplace.

But, we are getting off topic here. This thread is about racing a race legal Cherokee, there is another thread for going out and playing.

[Goatman]

I do for the street, not for the trail and especially not for an offroad race.

Yes you do. Does your insurance policy say you can't drive on a dirt road? There are no such exclusions. The collision coverage also protects the bank if you have a loan, and the liability coverage covers the other person for you doing something stupid, like driving too fast offroad. Coverage while in a sanctioned race is another story, as is practicing or driving on a designated race course, like Willow Springs. Some states don't allow race track exclusions, how we are in CA should be checked out. Also, some states allow exclusions for street racing, but might only exclude damage to the vehicle and not liability.

Coverage offroad is certain, coverage while racing is questionable and not likely. Coverage while hauling ass across the desert with your buds isn't sanctioned racing or on a known designated race course and would be covered. Plenty of us have fixed our rigs with insurance money after rolling them on the trail. I'm checking out racing exclusions in CA, good question.

[dirtbagXJ2103]

there has to be more travel but the other rules sound fine,just because i think it would be better to see street drivin jeeps soaking up whoops than paint shakers with people in them aka jeepspeed. just throwing that out there

[Ryno XJ]

Harnesses and a fuel cell, and I'd be pretty close to racing mine.......for fun anyways.

[IslanderOffRoad]

A good portion of your entry fee goes to paying for permits and environmental studies that the race promoter must pay for. Its not just to pay a track to race. 200.00 is a great deal. When we Best In The Desert its cost about 800.00 just to enter. then you have all the other race logistics to pay for as well. Just getting your team to Arizona or Nevada cost a small fortune if you dont have a contributing sponsor.

The idea for my post is to get people involved in desert racing not driving in a circle in some random location in the middle of lucurne. There is more to the desert racing experience then just driving fast in the dirt.

Understood. Would probably keep me out of it for a few more years to be honest.

[NRT_Chris]

there has to be more travel but the other rules sound fine,just because i think it would be better to see street drivin jeeps soaking up whoops than paint shakers with people in them aka jeepspeed. just throwing that out there

The idea with the travel limits is to keep in line with jeepspeed. Its hard to pull much more usable wheel travel out of a stock concept jeep suspension anyway. And also remember we are trying to keep this as cheep as possible.

[dirtbagXJ2103]

so you guys should call it cheepspeed haha sounds like fun, also there is a new crazy dirtbike park opening in pala california and they also have a corr track or somthing like that maybe we could get them to let us use it. i emailed them but no response

[dirtbagXJ2103]

its palaraceway.com check it out

[Mike1331]

I'm down for this, not sure if i'll have a cage installed by then. I didn't see a cage requiremnt in the rules you posted. Is there some rules that should be a given that you didn't post?

[tbburg]

'Looked at building a go-fast toy to complement Zoomy97acr's race MJ, and gave up. If I understand the concept being tossed around, you either want to run a seperate class inside another sanctioned race(like Jeepspeed in BITD) or put together your own informal event.

1) Shocks....
2) Wheel travel
3) Motor all stock
4) Tire and wheels
5) Front and rear bumpers
6) windows,...
This stuff is only half of it. The safety gear is what hurt. I had close to a grand in CLOTHES before I could even get in Derrick's truck.

I think the problem with this idea is going to be safety. Inside a sanctioned event, everybody has to follow that bodies safety rules. Outside a sanctioned event:
Are there going to be helmet/firesuit requirements? Anybody who doesn't already have one going to buy a $300.00 helmet to do this? How about a couple hundred for a basic fire suit?
How about fuel cells? One thing ALL the sanctioning bodies agree on: Stock gas tank is OUT. Would you require a fuel cell? A $500.00 gas tank for your daily driver?
Seat belts? Again, everyone requires 5 point harnesses, less the 2 years old(yep, they date-code those puppies) Would they be required for your informal event?
How about fire extinguishers? Elect. kill switches? Window nets?

I'm not trying to rain on the parade. I like the idea. But almost nobody is going to have a home build rig that would "pass tec." at any sanctioned event(even for just basic safety) unless it was built to somebody's rule book. Anybody who doesn't race probably won't have the safety gear.

Did I go wrong somewhere, or is any of this valid criticism?

[ert01]

Man, I need to move down south... Anyone know of anyone hiring canadian electricians down there? :)

[NRT_Chris]

'Looked at building a go-fast toy to complement Zoomy97acr's race MJ, and gave up. If I understand the concept being tossed around, you either want to run a seperate class inside another sanctioned race(like Jeepspeed in BITD) or put together your own informal event.

This stuff is only half of it. The safety gear is what hurt. I had close to a grand in CLOTHES before I could even get in Derrick's truck.

I think the problem with this idea is going to be safety. Inside a sanctioned event, everybody has to follow that bodies safety rules. Outside a sanctioned event:
Are there going to be helmet/firesuit requirements? Anybody who doesn't already have one going to buy a $300.00 helmet to do this? How about a couple hundred for a basic fire suit?
How about fuel cells? One thing ALL the sanctioning bodies agree on: Stock gas tank is OUT. Would you require a fuel cell? A $500.00 gas tank for your daily driver?
Seat belts? Again, everyone requires 5 point harnesses, less the 2 years old(yep, they date-code those puppies) Would they be required for your informal event?
How about fire extinguishers? Elect. kill switches? Window nets?

I'm not trying to rain on the parade. I like the idea. But almost nobody is going to have a home build rig that would "pass tec." at any sanctioned event(even for just basic safety) unless it was built to somebody's rule book. Anybody who doesn't race probably won't have the safety gear.

Did I go wrong somewhere, or is any of this valid criticism?

Ya you kind of missed the point. I was trying to organize a group of people that intend on racing jeepspeed in the future but want to start in a class that they can compete in and not get totally smoked. All the safety stuff needed to me was a given..

Almost every JS out there is a home built rig..

[tbburg]

Ya you kind of missed the point,...
...,All the safety stuff needed to me was a given.. OK, it sounds like I missed the point there.
Almost every JS out there is a home built rig..And every one of them was built from the ground up to meet the JS rule book.
What I meant here:
....,But almost nobody is going to have a home build rig that would "pass tec.",... was that most home built roll cages/suspensions/etc. won't fit into a rule book unless they were built for it. (I'm not disparaging the work.)