The best 4.5" leaf pack?......

Im putting together my lift and i need opinions on the best 4.5" leaf pack; ride, flex, lifespan, shackle angle and overall quality are basicly what im looking for. im going for a total of 6" lift and will be using 1.5" shackles. heres an idea of the kit im making:

TNT longarm upgrade kit
TNT track bar and mount
RE 5.5" front coils
1.5" shackles
4.5" leaf pack
any input on brake line length would be great too.

ill be running 35" MTZs with 4.88s. depending where it settles i may add another isolator or a small spacer up front. ill have to measure for shocks

DPG Off-Road's 5" spring or RE 3.5"

Here is little different approach:

1" lift block
1.5" shackle lift
Bastard pack based on either Dakota or Bronco II leaves.

I am at 5" to 6" in the rear depending on load out using Bronco II leaves a 1.5" lift shackle and no lift block. The thing I really like about the bastard pack route is you can tune it for what you want by mixing, cutting and arching leaves to suit your tastes.

Avoid a lot of arch, it limits down travel of the suspension tremendously. From 1-1/2 to 2 inches max at ride height has worked best for me. A shackle lift improves flexibility and a SMALL lift block avoids to much arch without introducing to much axle wrap (gears & hp play into this too).

I am at 2-1/2 inches of arch right now (light load and too high) at ride height with 23 inches from the bottom of the flair to the center of the axle which is 6 inches of lift.

I need to drop about an inch an lighten up the spring rate. When I wheeled for a weekend and carried 2-3 days of food, water, camping gear, spares and my family I needed all that. Now I go alone to private wheeling areas where I can leave all my stuff at the camp site and wheel with a very light load. Since I built a bastard pack I can easily change it to suit my new needs. I will probably pull out a couple leaves and add a 1" block to get down to the 5 inch lift area and increase flexibility even more with a softer rate for a better ride on the road to boot.

John

blocks tend to cause axle wrap, and prematurely wear springs.

Trailgunner by DPG??, Alcan, or RE leafs, they're all good stuff.

Yes a block does increase the torque load on the spring, so do gear changes, taller tires, stickier tires, 4:1 kits........

Search around I think you will find that a lot of folks (some highly respected) here run a small block (3/4 to 1 inch, more with a traction bar) to minimize arch and maximize flex with no negative side effects. I have run up to 3/4 inches of short (6") leaves in the past to add lift and balance the rig out side to side with no ill effects. Do it right (small steel blocks, through bolted, good spring packs) and you wont encounter the horror stories caused by 3" cast aluminum blocks on weak springs with short center pins and loose U bolts.

John

nosigma said:

Search around I think you will find that a lot of folks (some highly respected) here.......

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Who exactly are these highly respected people?

No one with any sense will run bodylifts or blocks on a serious wheeling rig IMHO. If they were equal or better than suspension lifts, companies like Fabtech, TnT, BDS, Full Traction, etc would recommend them-wouldn't they? None of them recommend blocks to my knowledge. The "blocks" that the guy above is talking about (respected people reference) are not blocks, they are degree shims.

TnT recommends ubolt eliminators be welded on to account for the pinion angle instead of degree shims. So you have other easier options than going with shims too. The best leaf pack is the RE IMHO. It last way longer than the Rusty's leaves and it has teflon spacers to prevent squeaks.

The important thing is not to over do it. A one inch block increases the torque load less than changing to 4.88 gears (25% vs 30%). An anti wrap leaf or even a cut down main leaf from an S-10 or Dakota pack reduce the risk of wrap as will not hammering the throttle when you have a bad rear wedge. The softer and flexier the springs the better it will wheel but at the greater the risk of axle wrap. If you build your own spring packs its no big deal.

Here is one of several posts: Note Goatman use to run 2.25" of blocks but always ran a track bar. I wouldnt suggest anything over 1" based on what I have read here. I have never had any trouble with 3/4 inches of short leaves used as a cheap lift block. I would defer to any comment he would care to make on the subject since I have never run a true block (yet), just stacked 6" leaves.

04-27-2004
Goatman
Forum Addict Join Date: May 2002
Location: Bakersfield, CA
Posts: 6,042

Re: 1" lift blocks + axel wrap

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Tomken makes a solid steel 3/4" block that is pinned through, designed just for leveling out lifts. One of those isn't going to hurt anything, they're cheap, and worth a try. Re-arching the springs doesn't last real long, especially in a 4x4 rig where the springs are bent through their full range of travel when wheeling.

The easiest thing to do is to just add another leaf. You get 1/4" just from the thickness of the leaf, plus it adds a little spring rate and a little lift. The springs with an additional leaf (or two) will outlast re-arched springs and add some weight carrying ability. Get a leaf from a stock XJ or YJ pack or from just about anything that has a 2.5" wide leaf.
__________________
Richard G
past President
Rockin' XJ Jamboree, Johnson Valley '06
70 Jeeps in the desert and real good times

Beating the dead horse...

02-11-2004
Goatman
Forum Addict Join Date: May 2002
Location: Bakersfield, CA
Posts: 6,042

I have 2.25" of blocks.......and I stack three blocks. Damn, I do all the wrong things.

The advice here on blocks is good. They should not be stacked unless you really know what your doing. I have three 3/4" solid steel Tomken blocks that are pinned all the way through, and I eventually welded them together. I also run 9/16", rather than 1/2", U-bolts. I also run a traction bar to eliminate spring wrap, which will be increased with more than a very small block.

The advantage of blocks is that you can easily level out your rig, and they let you run a flatter spring that will generally flex better, but will also wear out faster since it will flex backwards. To me, the small 1/2" and 3/4" blocks that are designed to make small suspension adjustments can be stacked (only a couple of them), but the U-bolts should be tightened regularly. Larger 1" to 2" (or even 3") blocks should never be stacked, and aluminum blocks should NEVER be used.
__________________
Richard G
past President
Rockin' XJ Jamboree, Johnson Valley '06
70 Jeeps in the desert and real good times

TNT 1.5" ubolt eliminators, 3.5" Deaver leaf pack, and 1.5" TNT Boom Shackles. Bar far superior to a block and RE leaf setup!

Dont count out some other manufactures. Like Full Traction! Thier leaf packs are FAR superior to RE's, in every way! But a 5" pack.

Alcan also makes good leaves. I like RE because they are in stock at my local shop year round (cause no one buys anything but RoughCountry down here it seems).

I've been thru 2 RE 4.5 packs, so I don't really recommend them. Next its either Bigoffroad, or DPG.

ROBERTK said:

TNT 1.5" ubolt eliminators, 3.5" Deaver leaf pack, and 1.5" TNT Boom Shackles. Bar far superior to a block and RE leaf setup!

Dont count out some other manufactures. Like Full Traction! Thier leaf packs are FAR superior to RE's, in every way! But a 5" pack.

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2x on that. My 6" full traction leaf make my 3.5"RE look like a POS.

krawler said:

2x on that. My 6" full traction leaf make my 3.5"RE look like a POS.

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Well thats a 5" leaf pack, but you get 6" with thier shackles they give you also in the kit. :thumbup:

i snapped my main leaf off on my RE 4.5 pack..

they sent me a brand new one right quick though.

alcans were stiff from what ive heard. not a fan of the riding the stiff myself.


ive never used full traction, the arch on them looked a little odd though. like what was mentioned above no down travel could come.

not all of us have the $$$ for deavers........well i did come up on some but ya thats a whole nother story........



as far as brakeline RE ones suck....mine snapped.

i made mine about 22" long.

ROBERTK said:

TNT 1.5" ubolt eliminators, 3.5" Deaver leaf pack, and 1.5" TNT Boom Shackles. Bar far superior to a block and RE leaf setup!

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Careful with this set up...and I do love my Deaver springs...but with my Deaver springs, and JKS boomerang shackle, I'm sitting right at 3 inches with all the weight I've got in the rear end- gas tank skid and Bulletproof rear bumper with tire carrier holding a 31" spare.....I was expecting 4 inches, but only got 3....I hate missing an inch :viking:

xDUMPTRUCKx said:

ive never used full traction, the arch on them looked a little odd though. like what was mentioned above no down travel could come.

not all of us have the $$$ for deavers........well i did come up on some but ya thats a whole nother story........

.

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My full tractions have 4.5" down travel and I limit the up to 7".

Deavers (550-600) are the same price as FT(599) unless you have deaver build some custom pack. Only issue with deavers are that they will go flat some day, the others you have a chance and never really needing to replace them, well some others. Deavers are Very nice riding and progressive, if you will, due to the high leaf count and how thin each is. Very nice leafs.

ChuckstrPT said:

Careful with this set up...and I do love my Deaver springs...but with my Deaver springs, and JKS boomerang shackle, I'm sitting right at 3 inches with all the weight I've got in the rear end- gas tank skid and Bulletproof rear bumper with tire carrier holding a 31" spare.....I was expecting 4 inches, but only got 3....I hate missing an inch :viking:

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well thats about right. Those springs are 3" then adding a 1" shackle and then a few hundred behind the axle and your looking at what I would expect 3.25-3.5 total.

With the TNT stuff I mentioned you would have been up 2" higher.

Does Full Traction sell just their leaves.

Matt98XJ said:

Does Full Traction sell just their leaves.

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yes but not cheap. But I do feel you get what you pay for in them. Just DONT expect friendly service or to ever get a call back if you have an issue with any of thier parts. Well you will but it will take a week. lol