ticking noise?

[Jeepster4wd]

im trying to figure out what the hell this ticking noise is i keep hearing? its comming from the motor and clicks faster depending on how much throttle i give it ??? any ideas? nothing is rubbing or anything so it isnt that.

its comming from the bottom of the motor so i dont think its valves any ideas?

this is on a 93 4.0 XJ

:repair: ??


Someone off another jeep forum mentioned mabey a piston skirt? any ideas ?

thanks.

[Georgia Mike]

If it's a 4.0 it's probably good ole piston slap. It happens when the piston skirt slightly touches the cylinder wall. My '94 does it,as well as the wife's 2000 model. It's a very common thing on 4 liter's,and nothing to be concerned with. That is,unless it's a REALLY loud knock,then you got some problems:D

[XJEEPER04]

I would have to agree...my 89 and my 96 do the same darn thing!

[Jeepster4wd]

my jeep has never ticked before and its pretty loud ticking noise you can really hear it pretty loud when you are under the jeep. i dont think it sounds normal. :confused: any ideas?

[Eagle]

Is the noise coming from the front or the back of the engine? Auto or manual transmission? How many miles on the engine, and how many of the vehicle?

If the noise is from the front, it could be a timing chain slapping the front cover. If it's coming from the rear, it could be loose bolts holding the torque converter to the flex plate, or it could be a cracked flex plate.

[Jeepster4wd]

its a automatic with 136k miles on engine and vehical. and its a 1993 4.0HO with police package. the wierd thing is it sometimes it doesnt tick. but when it does tick you can really hear it.and it goes faster as the rpms increase. il try and get a sound clip of it today.

[Kejtar]

depending on how the ticking sounds,..... I'd say don't rule out the belt and pulleys (or rather bearing on the pulleys).... If it's loose (belt) it can give you a bit of a ticking (I had some sort of a tick that went away after I retightened the belt to spec)

Kejtar

[old88xj]

What about the exhaust manifold gasket??? mine ticks when on the gas gets faster.....well this was before the bearing issue

[Townie]

Exhaust manifold leak

[Jeepster4wd]

well il let you know what happens im planning on having some jeep specialist dude look at it and see whats up. cause i cant really pinpoint anything.

[Hobby]

Hey, I just had that same problem I think you are describing. I spent 3 hours trying to find it. Had to take it in and they found a faulty starter was the cause. I had replaced it about a month ago and it seems that the spring that pulls the shaft that engages the flywheel had broke and was loose in the starter. It would hit the flywheel. Luckily it was under warranty but the parts supplier wouldn't pay the diagnostic fee. Good Luck.

[CaptTrev]

what makes a police package a police package?

any performance upgrades/additions?

when my tranny computer (ECU) went bad last fall i had the chance to get the police package ECU but the jeep parts guy didnt know if it would be compatable with a regular 4.0 etc etc, so i got the regular one

CaptTrev

[Jeepster4wd]

yea its supost to have a beter ecu that ugrades shift points and stuff. it feels very quick. iv also got a highflow cat 40 series muffler and a K&N intake i made. the police package also has a column shift which is unique for jeeps. I have a big hole were the shifter would of went. im planning on just putting my light switches thier. it also has a high extended idle buttom which raises the idle speed when you are going to idle for a long time.

[Dann]

Probably an exhaust leak, especially if you have a tubular manifold. Mine cracked at the lower 2 into 1 junction at the edge of a weld. I took it off and rewelded it, seems to be holding up fine, but I have plans to replace with a header made of thicker guage tubing. Apparently cracking is common on the tubular exhaust manifold. But then again, your engine may be about to grenade, so take this for what it is worth, just another step in the process of elimination.

[cherokeekid95]

not to get too far off topic but you said i has the "police package" whats all that involve. once again no to steal the thread.:o

[XJEEPER]

I have an occasional lifter clatter or tick on my 89, usually after startup. Guessing that I have a lifter that leaks down when sitting for a while. I recently developed an exhuast leak that ticks as well, 2nd one for me so the welded up stock manifold fix lasted almost 3 years.......header time.
Good luck........if nothing else helps, try sprinkling some Hartz Tick and Flea killer under the hood...........:D

[Jeepster4wd]

well i took it in should know shortly whats up with it.


il try and get some pictures up off it.

im planning on a clayton longarm setup mabey coil overs or just coils and triple bypasses :-)

[Jeepster4wd]

well it looks like my motor is done. looks like its alot more serious than i thought. im going to need a rebuild or a new motor...
:smsoap:

[old88xj]

must a been a bearing

[Hawaiian Style]

damn... that sucks. Good luck to ya. I thought for sure it was a pully or exhaust leak. Was it one of the main bearings??

[Jeepster4wd]

i dont think the motor is DONE but mabey jsut a rod bearing? hopefully a cheap fix. you think i could get to it with out taking the motor off? im going to try draining the oil than take the pan off and see if i see if i can swap in a bearing.

[old88xj]

you can do it but......its a big pain in the ass and i mean BIG

[Jeepster4wd]

oic. so it is acessible from under neath? is the rod bearing a bearing or just a piece of metal? i was looking at pictures of it and it looked like a flat piece of metal.

[old88xj]

it is a "bearing" but in 2 pieces. it is accessible from underneath but you got to pull your pan off to get to it and that is a PIA to do if you don't have a lifted vehicle or a way to get about 6-8 more inches of room to move under there. I have to replace the rod and main bearings along with the crank shaft. I can't do it and the shop wants $1300 to do it so my heep is really a HEEP now

[Jeepster4wd]

im thinking it could be the last rod bearing it seem to be comming from the back. i was suggested to take the spark plug out for cylinder were the bad bearing is belive to be and start it up and if its quiter you found which bearing it is? could this worK? the theory that since the piston isnt under operating presure it wont tick as much and should be quiter??

[old88xj]

BUT would you not get misfiring and the likes.......the only true way to determine which if any are bad is to pull the pan and look at ALL the rod bearings....according to EAGLE the rod bearings go before the main bearings but since you are under there do everything if you are gonna do it. The longer you wait to fix the problem the worse it becomes and the more damage it can do. That is of course just my opinion and experience.

Daniel

[Jeepster4wd]

yea im suprised my bearings went out so quickly motor isnt that old. my jeep is stock so its going to be fun working under it...

im gonig to jack it up as much ass possiblethough. im just waiting for it to kool down. its like 110 degrees here. :-(

[old88xj]

Well it is a pain to remove the oil pan and i would only suggest you doing a job like this if and only if you don't require this to be a DD bc it will take you SEVERAL days to do this job right. From pulling the pan agian to replacing the ROD and MAIN bearings to buttoning up agian. I am not a mechanic but i watched all this done to my heep and do not envy you. i suggest you get your jeep WAY high bc you are gonna need it.

GOOD LUCK

Daniel

[Jeepster4wd]

it was my DD but i dont need to go anywere so it can be worked on for weeks if need be. the actual parts should be under 50 buck. iv heard the oil pan can be b****. so after i take the pan off i undo the 2 rod bolts and the bearing should come out if its still in thier and slap a new one in right?

[yellowxj]

Have you only had one opinion about whats wrong? Never go with just one, seems that half of diagnostics if Florida seems to be opinion and guesstimation. This is an example I've got to share cause this little shit gave me alot of lip about how I had wronged him, he didnt have to pay, he was going to call his lawyer(I always tell them the public defender doesnt do civil cases), etc. I had a customer wanted me to reposses his 91 saturn because it wouldnt run. He didnt know why it wouldnt run, just stated that it wouldnt run and he "couldnt keep putting money into it" (people usually say this the first time their 10 year old car they bought 6 months ago has a problem). I convinced him that it would be in his best interest to have it checked out by a mechanic. The first one he took it to said it had a blown motor. So he towed it back to his apartment and called me to come pick it up/reposses it. It took about an hour for me to do a compressions test, ignition test, then test the fuel system and find the fuel wasn't pumping. It cost me $80 for a pump and $10 for a filter. I charged him $225. ( $80 cost on the pump installed in the tank,$10 cost on the filter, towed it from his apartment, tightened the cam bearings( some reason the previous mech had loosened all of the cam bearings on both cam's), put on the valve cover, reinstalled all the crap the previous mech had disconnected, etc.) Called the customer and told him to pick up his car. Bottom line of my rant (please forgive me, its fricken stressful) is.....Even if it was diagnosed by an expert go find another expert opinion just to be safe.

[Jeepster4wd]

you have a very good point. My dad knows quite abit about motors and said the same thing what the jeep specailist said so its more than likly that. thats were the noise is comming from. so it narrows down were it could be. but i think il call up some shops and see what they have to say. im trying to find a good shop because i hear alot of shops around here arnt very good.

[old88xj]

by all means, get a second opinion. I thought you had been checking around. i ain't a mechanic....just tellin you by experience....BUT shops can't diagnose a problem with out inspecting a vehicle or actually hearing the sound so go find one that will check it out for free and let you stay around for the trouble shooting process. I deal with two shops and they both let me in the garage area (i don't hold em liable for injuries) and i am right there next to the mechanic. Let us know what they say.

Daniel

[Jeepster4wd]

aight well iv taken the oil pan off and everything looks pretty good. cylinder walls and such look brand new still. but the rod bearings have side to side play is this normal? also who designed that oil pan? it had like 3 differnt bolt sizes and depths lol. but it did come off after i took the start off and oil pump. i thought it would of been alot worst but it looks pretty good overall from visual inspection so FAR. is thier any special way to get off the parts to the rod bearings? i un did the 2 bolts holding it on but it is difficult to remove u have any tips???


thanks for the help.



Robert.

[Bill-93XJ]

The rod bearing cap is split in two and should break apart fairly easily. Use a small hammer and LIGHTLY tap from several side angles. Should pull apart easy after it breaks. I don't think that side to side slop is necessarily a bad thing. It is the radial slop that kills ya. Study up and get some plastigage strips. Take your time and do the job as right as you can and make that Jeep humm for another 130 K. GOOD LUCK !!

[Jeepster4wd]

yea im glad i did this all my self iv learned alot abotu the motor. what is a plastigage strip?

[old88xj]

it tells you how much wear there is so on the rod (i believe) so that you can get the proper fitting bearing. I am not quite sure though..some one will set me straight if i am wrong

[old88xj]

this is what was told to me......
A package of precise plastic 'wires' of fine diameter. About $8 at any autoparts store.

Insert one into the space between bearing and journal and tighten the bearing cap to spec.
Do this for each bearing.
Tightening the bearing bolts will flatten the plastigauge. How much it is flattened identifies the space between journal and bearing.
Remove cap and compare the width of the flattened pastigauge to the chart on the package

[Jeepster4wd]

oh ic. your trying to found out how much the crank has warn and you measure the distance what what ever the distance space is that how much bigger of a bearing you get right?

[old88xj]

You got it....so how are you doing so far??

[Jeepster4wd]

ok... how much bearing clearance is aloud?

[Jeepster4wd]

i kind of messed up the order of which bearing went where. so i was thinking of buying one STD size one and try it on each crank part to see the clearance? what do u think? what do you suggest?

[old88xj]

Jeepster....i would PM eagle and ask him....i trust what he says and he ain't steered me wrong yet. I don't want to give you the wrong info....

[Jeepster4wd]

thanks old88xj. i got the awnsers i was looking for. i should be done tommorrow. im debating on changing the rear main seal though....

i found some great information here! i recomend you check it out

http://www.engineparts.com/products/bearingtech_files/frame.htm

[Eagle]

Originally posted by Jeepster4wd
im thinking it could be the last rod bearing it seem to be comming from the back. i was suggested to take the spark plug out for cylinder were the bad bearing is belive to be and start it up and if its quiter you found which bearing it is? could this worK? the theory that since the piston isnt under operating presure it wont tick as much and should be quiter??

I thought you took it to some Jeep specialist dude who was going to tell you what was wrong. Now he wants you to do the diagnosis?

I think you need a second opinion.

[Eagle]

Originally posted by Jeepster4wd
the actual parts should be under 50 buck.

The oil pan gasket alone is about $50.

I think you said you have looked at some photos or illustrations of how a rod bearing works? Yes, once you get the oil pan off, you unfasten the two bolts holding the rod cap in place and tap the bearing cap loose. If you don't own a brass or plastic hammer, this is the time to buy one. Do NOT go banging around in there with a steel hammer.

The old bearing will be in there. If it's making noise, you may see that it's worn through the bearing material to the copper backing metal, and/or you may find scratches. If the bearing is scored, examine the surface of the crank carefully. If ther are scratches or burrs, to do it right you would remove the crank and have it polished. For a real shade tree job, get some fine crocus cloth and polish it yourself, then be sure you wipe off ALL traces of dirt, dust, lint, etc.

I suppose you can just slap the new bearing in place, but to do it right you should plastigage it to verify the clearance.

[Jeepster4wd]

iv already got all the bearings out and have plastigage :-)

the bearings are warn but the crank is in good condition and so are the pistons,rods overall the engine looks very good. i was exspecting some serious damage when i first took the oil pan out. because it was making a pretty loud noise.

sorry if I didnt make it clear. All the jeep specailist did was look at it. I didnt want them to do anywork because i would rather do it my self then spend like 600-3k on a rebuild which i didnt think it needed only being at 130k miles. So i decided id do my own work . Kragen has the oil pan gasket for 19 bucks. and i orded some new bearing which will arive tomorrow. i will plastiqage them tommorrow and see what the distance is. Yea i never used any metal hammer. i used a rubber mallet but didnt work so good so I just used my hands and pryed it open. most opened pretty easy. The very back bearing is warn the most which were the noise was comming from. if this doesnt fix it i dont know what it could be. mabey that flex plate you were talking about... but im pretty sure this will fix it.

[old88xj]

Good luck......i hope it works

[Jeepster4wd]

ok well all the gaps are under .003 so i jsut went with .001 bearings. that much gap shouldn't cause this loud noise should it? im getting worried that this isnt the problem and it something else ????? i took of my rear main bearing. and have no idea how u swap the top bearing? thiers quite large scratch into the bearing not sure if its supost to go thier or not. i havn't found anything that could of made that horrible noise. how much gap does it require to create that loud ticking/clacking noise i kept hearing. from the bottom of the motor.

[KarmirXJ]

Whats that noise???:confused:











Keep wheeling, youll find out!:D

[Jeepster4wd]

a pretty loud ticking/clanking noise. Eagle what do u recomend i check? I read somewere abotu a flex plate or something?? how do I check that?

[old88xj]

look the bearing where it fits to the crank is supposed to be smooth....if you got a large scratch on the crank side of the bearing then that is what is likely the cause of your problem. The flex plate could also be the problem BUT you are already into this job so it wont hurt. Did you check the rod bearings by chance?? I might be wrong but i believe the bearings need to be ALMOST a close fit. After all they help build oil pressure so you don't want large gaps. Did you notice loss of oil pressure??

[Jeepster4wd]

yeah. all of them are in the tollerable range. I went with .001's for all of them so they will be between .001-.002. The crank looks very good no scratches or anything. im going to put all this back together today and start it up and if it still does the ticking clacking noise its gotta be that flexplate?

[old88xj]

the flexplate/fly wheel would be the next guess. Either that or if it gets worse then the bearings were done wrong...good luck

Daniel

[Jeepster4wd]

So how much are the rods bearings supost to torqued to? was it like 30lbs? and the rear main seal is like 80 right?

[old88xj]

my haynes manual says "Main bearing cap bolts torqued to 80 and connecting rod cap nuts 33 ftLBS." Rear main seal i can't find in my book...guess the book got the best of me.

[Jeepster4wd]

awesome thanks dude. jsut got to wait for the gasket sealer to dry.

[Jeepster4wd]

well iv got everything back on. i cant find 1 damn oil pan bolt. but other than that iv got everything back on including the starter. worse comes to worse il just go pick up a bolt that fits from ace hardware.

[Jeepster4wd]

ok everythings back together... but the ignition is all fuc*** up. I started it up and it ran like shit im trying to figure out which plug wire goes where! i think i have the ignition in wrong spots or something like that since i wasnt sure were they went and the chilton diagram was made by someone on crack.

[Jeepster4wd]

ok well i think iv got everything on right now. the motor is running rougher i think mabey one of the spark plug wires are messed up and it isnt firing right or something and im still getting the noise...
so i think it mgiht be the flexplate????

[Jeepster4wd]

ok iv bought all new spark plug wires and it still runs like crap damn getting frustrated!!!!! what could it be! PLEASE HELP!

[Kejtar]

define runs like crap..... any chance you knocked off a vacum line someplace????

[Jeepster4wd]

runs very rough. like a cylinder isnt firing type rough. not sure on the vacuum but im pretty sure all vacuum lines are good. but i can double check.

[old88xj]

did you retighten the motor mounts??? Very well could be the flex plate OR you could have a blown exhaust manifold gasket. As far as running like crap....are you sure you got the firing order correct??

[Jeepster4wd]

i never loosened the motor mounts. Im pretty sure the order is right on the plugs. I thought mabey a sensor or something came loose. When I first started it up it was noiser than a mofo. but has quited down some but still running rough which i cant figure out. i even bought all new spark wires so i dont know..... what else could it be?

[Jeepster4wd]

well its going to shop i have no idea what it is and im about to beat it with A pry bar. just doesnt make any sence why it isnt running normal.

[Jeepster4wd]

ok well it looks like acouple of bolts were loose on the flexplate and thats what was making the noise. and i think mabey one of my spark plugs were fouled or something or damage. so one cylinder wasnt firing Id like to thank everyone for thier help! and thanks for bieing pacient.

[old88xj]

hey at least you got new bearings that should last another 100k and a new rear main and the such......Now you got a smooth running heep

[Jeepster4wd]

well on yesterday i decided to drive my jeep. It started up and ran fine. but when i went to get onto the freeway via the freeway onramp i gassed it to acellerate and kaboom the motor goes!!! smoke everywhere and oil everywere. pull over quickly and look underneath... several large holes and one with a large metal peice sticking out!!! WTF?? i had to walk like 10 miles back to my house it sucked! iv got some photos of the oil pan so you can get an idea of how much damage occured. i have no idea what happened or if mabey one of bearings failed or what any ideas?????

[Kejtar]

I believe that you threw a rod..... :( Sorry to hear that man....

[alldz]

:eek:

Holy cow! This is my first post but I feel bad for this guy after going through all that and then this happening to him! I'm anxiously awaiting some pics or a reply from him!

I just had to register and sign on to add that! :angel:

Aldo

[Jeepster4wd]

heres one of the photos. il have some more up later

http://www.villagephotos.com/image.asp?id_=4759887&sessionkey=PQHPNCFVYOZOBSIGVYHS

if that didnt work check out

http://www.villagephotos.com/pubgallery.asp?id_=319524

[Fletchs90xj]

Holy crap dude I'm realy sorry to hear that sity news:eek:

[tugboat]

in 92 jeep came out with a package" jeep cherokee ahb police package"... description as follows..larger sway bar,suspension package: gas shocks steel wheels,70 series tires,upgraded wiring,h.d. alternater,and a high cca battery..in the "mis road course" the cherokee police 4x4 out ran the lumina b4c,caprice 9c1 305 and the caprice wagon 350. cherokee was 0.16 sec. behind the sohc crown vic. 55h.. 0.68 sec behind the taurus 55a......pretty darn impressive!!!

[Jeepster4wd]

One of the main bearings went half way thru the oil pan! it was so mangled up! iim afraid to take the oil pan off. il have some more photos up today.

[old88xj]

OUCH........i don't think the main bearin went thru the pan...what happend was like Kejtar said...you threw a rod(connecting rod) thru the pan. I am at a lost for words Jeepster...i am sorry

[Jeepster4wd]

i mean rod bearing not main bearing. Yea its crazy i cant belive it. i mean I thought i did everything right and it goes and blows up! well im going to pull the whole motor out. il get some pixs of this rod bearing. it is just wickedly destroyed! Do you think i will need a total rebuild? also why the hell did it come apart!!! i torqued everything down to specs.