Best source vehicle for HP44

Due to some recent financial issues, my FW project has been scrapped. so now its back to the drawing board...heres my scenario:
98 XJ, 4.0/aw4/242, hp30 (4.88, lockrite), 8.8 (4.88, lockrite), 33s (soon to be 35s) on about 6-7" of lift (longarms). moderate wheeling, mostly trails (not much mud or sand, few hill climbs).
the 8.8 is pretty new, and ive had no trouble with it at all. its a little narrow, sure, but i like that it tracks just inside the front wheels. the 30 has been less pleasant. ive gone through 4 sets of hubs/bearing in it in the last year, and the steering on it is getting really obnoxious (upgraded tierod, but bad angles with drag link) so i wanted to put in a hp44 front...
since i dont have the time or money to go FW, its going to have to be narrow-track (i guess in the 57-59" wms-wms range?). so whats the best route i should take? get a late 70s F100/150 or EB and shorten it? other vehicles any better? no chebby, i dont wanna go d300 or anything...should i just go ahead and convert all corners to 5 on 5.5 so i dont need to mess with hubs? for the 8.8, id just get dutchman shafts i guess, and have them drill my rotors, good plan? RE bracket kit seems to be the norm, i dont think i want to try and fab those up (thatd be my first real fab project outside of minor alterations and stuff), any alternatives though? im stuck with the 1/2 ton 1-piston calipers now i guess, right? will i still need a new MC to push the system?
sorry for all the newb questions, i searched some, but most people already had their minds made up, im starting from square one now!
thanks for any help
-Bennett

Don't quote me;
EB= right width, low pinion.
70s 1/2 ton Ford= HP, but full width.

If you want a 44 that's close in size, go with a Wagoneer front 44. It'll be low pinion though.

I'm sure others with more knowledge than me will chime in.
HTH
Dan.

correct me if im wrong, but arent waggy 44s low pinion AND pass drop?
i thought about it too, but dismissed the idea on that basis...if im wrong, then hmmmm....

BennettXJ said:

correct me if im wrong, but arent waggy 44s low pinion AND pass drop?
i thought about it too, but dismissed the idea on that basis...if im wrong, then hmmmm....

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Low pinion, but some were drivers side drop, and some were passenger side drop.

the waggy will NOT be 5 on 4.5 bolt pattern though...
it will be 5 on 5.5 IIRC

it will be 5 on 5.5 IIRC

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Waggy axles are 6 lug. 6 on 5.5

use the 78-79 ford HP D44 and shorten it the fit the waggy axles....

then you have HP and stock (easy to find) axles.

i think a waggy 44 is your best bet. it will be low pinion and about 2.5" wider than your rear, but unless you want to shorten a ford hp 44 down, you can't have it all. at least with the waggy 44 your get 297 joints. the EB have 260's. you could replace the short side with a f150 shaft with 297's but there is no such stock shaft for the EB long side.

but then you're stuck converting the rear to 6x5.5. good luck. you can have your dutchman shafts made to 6x5.5, but the roter will pose another problem. i guess you could adapt the front 44 to old dodge 44 5x4.5 hubs. or use ford 5x5.5 hubs and then just buy some spacer/adapters for the rear to correct the width and bolt pattern.

good luck.

Problems, problems. I'm looking to do a dana 44 in the near future as well. The waggy axle was pass side till 79' and drive than on till 91'. The idea to cut the long side of the hp dana 44 to waggy size is a good idea and common. Easy to find spare axles at the pnp. The reg dana 44 isn't bad either so a waggy dana 44 80'+ isn't a bad axle and about the right width, easy to find parts. People with 40'+ tires still ride on these dana 44's up front so a xj on 37-38's should be fine. I know there is a spacer/adapter to convert 5 on 4.5 to 5 on 5.5, maybe there will be/is to convert to 6 on 5.5 as well?
Troy

its pretty hard to find someone to make a 5x4.5 to 6x5.5 adapter because of the overlap of the patterns.

Big Red said:

... People with 40'+ tires still ride on these dana 44's up front so a xj on 37-38's should be fine. I know there is a spacer/adapter to convert 5 on 4.5 to 5 on 5.5, maybe there will be/is to convert to 6 on 5.5 as well?
Troy

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Dont forget to incorporate what type of tire youll be running. 37-38's can usually survive just fine on a 44, but throw a set of boggers into the mix and they will WREAK HAVOK on the front axle. The TSL's have crazy traction as well. If theyre spinning, and find a ledge, root or rock to grab they will put one hell of a strain on the axle. If it were say, an MTR (37") you'd be pretty well within reason. Driving style will dictate the life of that front too, especially if it's locked.

early broncos have 58" 44's but dont know if any are HP. mines from a 78 f100 or f150, but its 67" WMS.

I really would like to build this as best as possible, which, TO ME, requires HP for better ring gear strength and driveshaft angles.
SO - my plan of attack now is to find a 78-79 HP44 from some sort of ford and shorten the long side to waggy width.
NOW - new question: should i just use waggy shafts for their ease of acquisition? or should i try and get an f-150 short side with the 297 and custom long side? or custom both sides? any advangtages to going to 6-lug? it looks like im going to have to change it all anyhow, so is 5 on 5.5, or 6 on 5.5 more desirable?
-Bennett


-EDIT: also, any ideas as to why im running through bearings so damn quick? ive had maybe 3 trail rides in the past 6 months (i know, i know), and they still seem to destroy themselves...lockrite on the pavement? doesnt make sense. maybe the wheel spacers putting extra leverage on the hub? bad camber/caster or even toe? its aligned pretty well...any ideas?

I picked up a 1978 F-250 HP D44 from the wrecker a few weeks ago. I'm planning on using it on a YJ based project with Jeep Q-link (short arm) front end.

I was going to use Scout inner shafts...but now I'm not sure...I am worried about building the bracket over the diff for the driver side UCA and the original SOA spring pad making it "funky". I may use a different pair of shafts to try to move the diff under the center line more...

Just my data point.

r@m

BennettXJ said:

I really would like to build this as best as possible, which, TO ME, requires HP for better ring gear strength and driveshaft angles.
SO - my plan of attack now is to find a 78-79 HP44 from some sort of ford and shorten the long side to waggy width.
NOW - new question: should i just use waggy shafts for their ease of acquisition? or should i try and get an f-150 short side with the 297 and custom long side? or custom both sides? any advangtages to going to 6-lug? it looks like im going to have to change it all anyhow, so is 5 on 5.5, or 6 on 5.5 more desirable?
-Bennett


-EDIT: also, any ideas as to why im running through bearings so damn quick? ive had maybe 3 trail rides in the past 6 months (i know, i know), and they still seem to destroy themselves...lockrite on the pavement? doesnt make sense. maybe the wheel spacers putting extra leverage on the hub? bad camber/caster or even toe? its aligned pretty well...any ideas?

Click to expand...

Couple of things...
First of all, I'd use an axle from a '74-'76 Ford truck. The mounts for the radius arms are welded on, and easier to remove. My axle is being built from a '76. I cut it down to use '80-'87 Waggy innners. The outers can be what ever bolt pattern you want. I'm using Chevy outers and Ford hubs and rotors to get the 5 on 5.5" pattern, and I'll get some custom shafts for the rear to match. (don't like adapters) You CAN use all Waggy stuff for the outers and match the rear to be 6 on 5.5, but I thought I'd stay with a Jeep(CJ)/Ford bolt pattern. Wheels are easier to find, as many vehicles used this pattern.
HTH :wave:

One way to go is get an F150 front Dana 44 and have it narrowed to waggy width and then you can use waggie axles, Dave T. did this and I beleive he is still running 5 lug front and back, not sure if it is 5 on 5 1/2 or 5 on 4 1/2

Bill has got you on the right track here. You want a pre-78 HP44, 78 and newer have the cast on c-mount bushings. You can either retube the axle or grind the castings enough until the bracket kit fits (neither of which are very fun) More specifically you will want a '71 - '76 ('77 was a changeover year, no guarantee on which one you will get). '66 - '70 HP 44's will be a Kingpin axle as well has having the weaker housing. So unless you want to get new knuckles, pass on these (although Crane sells them now, so it's not to much of any issue). Now as Bill said you can either run the 5 on 5.5 or the 6 on 5.5. The advantage to the 6 on 5.5 is running the matching waggy 44 rear or an isuzu 44 with factory disc brakes. The advantage to the 5 on 5.5 is running a Ford 9" that vertually bolts right into your XJ. There are more parts available to make the 9" rediculously strong. The 44 now has a 33 spline ARB, but the 9" can be made HP as well as 35 spline, or 40 if you thought you needed it. You have alot of options as far as what you want to do, you just need to sit down and map out what works best for you.

I am personally running (currently building) a narrowed '75 HP 44 up front. I chose to go with the waggy bolt pattern. This is simply because my 9" (already built) has custom 31 Spline Mosers with a 6 on 5.5 Bolt Pattern............ :lecture:

quick question....

the mid '70's f150's have the HPD44 in front.... What axle do they use in the rear of that truck?

kewlkatdady said:

quick question....

the mid '70's f150's have the HPD44 in front.... What axle do they use in the rear of that truck?

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Usually a 9".