how strong is a hack n tap

[Buck Jackson]

I'm thinking about doing it, and although there have been several posts on the topic of installations, I am curious if anyone has had problems with pinion strength after using an RE SYE (hack n tap). My jeep's a DD, hence hoping to rid myself of vibes, but when i am offroad, I mostly do mild wheeling, and run 31's with a 4" lift. Any thoughts about strength? Should i be concerned at all?

[ChiXJeff]

There you go, starting a religious discussion......

RE's hack-n-tap kit works at the tcase, not at the axle end. The pinion isn't changed by the kit, so that should be a non-issue.

As far as strength of the kit itself, having watched Rick Norman grenade a pinion yoke coming out of Mickey's Hot Tub (he had the RE kit,) I suspect it's actually better than a lot of people give it credit for. Getting the flange mounted securely to the tcase output shaft is probably the biggest issue.

[Kejtar]

I hate to say this... but do a search. If you do so, you will come upon this topic being discussed quite often. The thing that sold me on doing it was the fact that Farmer Matt is running the hack and tap on his rig for the past couple years.

[Buck Jackson]

RE's hack-n-tap kit works at the tcase, not at the axle end. The pinion isn't changed by the kit, so that should be a non-issue.

Sorry I meant the transfer case output shaft not the differential pinion (ie the splined part that you cut off and drill into, not the unchanged portions of the kit...)

[strokedwoody]

If you install it correctly its plenty strong. I run a 4.7 stroker, 5.13 gears and its a trailer queen , so I beat the crap out of it and it has yet to fail...4 years and counting... I'm sure you'll start the arguement on here that its not, but I'm just telling you from real trail experience not webwheeling.But who knows, maybe I've just been lucky. I've broke several warns shafts in my d44 and 2 CTM joints , but have yet to tear the hack-n-tap up.

[Buck Jackson]

I hate to say this... but do a search. If you do so, you will come upon this topic being discussed quite often. The thing that sold me on doing it was the fact that Farmer Matt is running the hack and tap on his rig for the past couple years.
Actually, I only posted the query because my searches only resulted in information about where to buy them and how to install them. I could not find any posts on strength. I will keep checking though, thanks.

[small pederson]

ive said it before and ill say it again, my friend is quite fond of baking off 40" tires on the street with a dana 60 and his 231 hack-n-tap. has never givin him problems

[Kittrell]

why is the pre 96 model so freakin much, for 40 more bucks I can get a AA HD SYE.............. :huh:

[Kejtar]

why is the pre 96 model so freakin much, for 40 more bucks I can get a AA HD SYE.............. :huh:
It's because the output @ the tailcone is different....

[Matt]

Well - I sheared a 242 t-case main shaft in half and am still using the same seal housing and flange with my hack at tap kit - happy and no leaks since 1998...

Matt

[FarmerMatt]

The Hack & Tap has nothing to do with strength. The real question is how strong is the stock np231 tail shaft. My way of thinking is that if you break the stock tailshaft in a 231 you need to upgrade T-cases. By the time you upgrade the 231 to the point where it's strong enough to not worry about you could have bought an atlas or flipped a 300 over. A chain driven 231 will never be as strong as either one of those cases no matter how you build it or what you upgrade. I used the RE kit because it was a quick, dirty, & cheap way to solve the slip yoke problem with the full understanding that if I broke something or when I felt I needed to, I would swap in a different case. I've been running it for several years now & I have yet to have a problem with either the kit or the stock t-case.

Matt

[CRASH]

The Hack & Tap has nothing to do with strength. The real question is how strong is the stock np231 tail shaft. My way of thinking is that if you break the stock tailshaft in a 231 you need to upgrade T-cases. By the time you upgrade the 231 to the point where it's strong enough to not worry about you could have bought an atlas or flipped a 300 over. A chain driven 231 will never be as strong as either one of those cases no matter how you build it or what you upgrade. I used the RE kit because it was a quick, dirty, & cheap way to solve the slip yoke problem with the full understanding that if I broke something or when I felt I needed to, I would swap in a different case. I've been running it for several years now & I have yet to have a problem with either the kit or the stock t-case.

Matt

My offer on your spare Atlas stands, I'll even throw in my AA'ed 231 as a bonus. :D

CRASH

[FarmerMatt]

My offer on your spare Atlas stands, I'll even throw in my AA'ed 231 as a bonus. :D

CRASH
Dude, that's a hell of a deal. Throw in a set of your tail light eliminators & you've got a deal. :rolleyes:

Matt

[BIG98XJ]

Im locked on 37s and havent had a problem

[Buck Jackson]

Thanks everybody, I''m gonna do it as soon as the part arrive!
Buck

[azxjman]

I twisted off the output shaft right at the speedo gear. I was also being the hardest I have ever been on my jeep trying to help someone out.

[89xj]

I twisted off the output shaft right at the speedo gear. I was also being the hardest I have ever been on my jeep trying to help someone out.

what size tires and gears were you running?

[Buck Jackson]

I twisted off the output shaft right at the speedo gear. I was also being the hardest I have ever been on my jeep trying to help someone out.
Crap, that was exactly what i was afraid to hear. What kind of motor, gears, tires you running, and what kind of surface were you on, and how stuck was the other guy? Actually I guess its good to only hear one story of failure amongst several testamonials about how strong it is. So far, i have mostly heard that one can kick the crap out of it and in MOST cases it will hold.

[azxjman]

I was running 3.55s and 35s it was on a hill and he had to go up and I was trying to pull him there it is a really hard situation to explain but I dug huge holes in the hill and I did a little yank fell back in the wholes on full throttle and boom goodbye output shaft. It really screwed me to because when the shaft breaks the bearings dont support the shaft anymore so there is no front or rear wheel drive that is the only time I got towed home.

[RCP Phx]

I was running 3.55s and 35s

And thats one of the reasons it broke,proper gearing will reduce the load on the drivetrain.Also dont forget that the HD SYE kits also reduce driveline angles(less wear and tear)!

[Matt S.]

I ran that kit, I had no problems with it. But you CAN break that shaft even with the right stuff. I just swapped out a 231 in my roommates wrangler. He broke that shaft. He was running 31s at the time! So it is possible.

Matt

[Genster]

im sure if you wheel with caution and go fairly easy on the gas it will be fine.

[stoneattic]

I twisted off the output shaft right at the speedo gear. I was also being the hardest I have ever been on my jeep trying to help someone out.


The HD SYE still have the same diameter at the speed gear so you most likely would have broken it even with a non-H&T SYE. Correct?

[RCP Phx]

The HD SYE still have the same diameter at the speed gear so you most likely would have broken it even with a non-H&T SYE. Correct?

Wrong,plus the JB unit is under 200$ now!
http://hometown.aol.com/rpayne9421/images/hd%20sye.jpg

[stoneattic]

How does the speedo work on that shaft or is it a trail only setup?

[RCP Phx]

How does the speedo work on that shaft or is it a trail only setup?
It uses the factory speedo drive but it has a different drive gear that is relocated in the "new" housing!

[ChuckD]

my AA one has a plastic gear that turns the speedo.

[Goatman]

Like Matt said, it has nothing to do with the hack and tap, it has to do with the size of the output shaft. I've seen a number of 28 spline output shafts break. Two years a go in Moab, I saw two XJ's break 28 spline output shafts within a few minutes of each other on Double Wammy. It seems that what it takes to break one is a good bounce with plenty of throttle. I haven't seen one break even with a lot of throttle if there isn't any bouncing. There are two problems with this.....you can be doing well and then get that one bounce....and if it does break you are either leaving it there and bringing back the parts to fix it or you're getting dead pulled out.

I ran a long time with a 28 spline output shaft with no problems. When I went to the Tera60 I changed to the HD 32 spline output, because I didn't want the t-case to be the new weak link. Back when I bought the 28 spline SYE (Currie) I saved $100 over the HD SYE. I would have been money and labor ahead to have spent the extra $100 back then.

The decision is between a 28 and a 32 spline output, what you can afford to spend, and what you think you'll do in the future.

[Buck Jackson]

Thanks Goatman, as usual you have sage advice....Unfortunately about 3 days after my initial post ( a month ago) I went out and did the hack n' tap. I probably could have afforded the HD, but the hack n' tap seemed so easy. Its too bad, because I learned long ago to just go ahead and do the best you can afford, as this jeep thing just never goes away.....
Buck

[Bender]

There is one funny thing with the RE hack and tap kit. When they first came out people found the new flange yoke would easily slide onto the t-case output shaft. After a few months it would get a little sloppy on there. Somewhere along the line RE tightened up the splines giving a much tighter fit. I bought a RE hack and tap kit a year or so ago but unfortunately I must have received an old stock item from my local off-road shop as the flange just slid on easily...sure enough now it's sloppy on there.

I'm not 100% sure on this info but it seems to be the case from hearing peoples experience over the past few years.

[ChuckD]

Part of the problem with the Hack-n-tap, is the age and use of the original output shaft. Where did you go wheeling, what size tires were you running, did you have the propper diff ratio before the SYE. At what angles was your shaft at before the SYE. All this plus the normal service life are all contributing factors to the stress on the OEM shaft.

The hack-n-tap has it's place. Fro Ex. Do you plan on keeping the 231 or 242? If you have a latter Tcase, the H&T is a very affordable solution. For earlier Tcases your maybe within $50 to having a HD SYE. All in all it does eliviate driveline stress? Also with propper gearing, one may never have an issue with it.

[shizza-my-nizza]

I gave my buddy's freightliner rollback a little tug so he could get all his rear wheels back on pavement and my output shaft and hack n tap had no problems. If you break a 231 output shaft it is time for a stronger case anyway.

[Island XJ]

Buck??? Is that you? I thought you already did the Hack n' tap?

[Island XJ]

wait, i just read that yes you did indeed! :)

[Buck Jackson]

Buck??? Is that you? I thought you already did the Hack n' tap?
yes I did, and glad to see you here, even if you are at work :nono:. I'm glad i pay you as little as i do!
I don't know why this thread is still going on, I installed it about a month ago. Call me, lets go up to Sooke on sunday eh?
Buck

[Island XJ]

yes I did, and glad to see you here, even if you are at work :nono:. I'm glad i pay you as little as i do!
I don't know why this thread is still going on, I installed it about a month ago. Call me, lets go up to Sooke on sunday eh?
Buck

I can't go to sooke tomorrow, I have to work for you! Can't these assessments wait? I wanna go wheeling!!!!! wahh!

[Buck Jackson]

I can't go to sooke tomorrow, I have to work for you! Can't these assessments wait? I wanna go wheeling!!!!! wahh!
PM me, nobody here wants to listen to you whine..... :bawl:
Your employer,
Buck.