Weld on the crossmember?

[EMSJEEP]

So my portion of the lift is completed, new tires, looks good and all. Brought it in to my mechanic to see if he would do my SYE, do the alignment and tighten down the control arm brackets in the process. He got the vehicle Monday at noon, it is now Saturday, and I won't be seeing the Jeep again until Tuesday at best. It went in with a few issues, the CA drop brackets didn't fit tight and the bump needed to be ground off, no biggie, the four bolts that held in the crossmember that supports the t-case, etc. weren't threaded all the way and it needed an alignment. The SYE wound up taking a few days, on day 2 I got a panicked phone call asking if I could bring the instructions in...finally today eveything else is done, and its time to do the alignment and send it home and apparently now one of the stock CA brackets is bent, the nub still needs to be ground off and he wants to weld the brackets down to the frame, to solve the issue with the bolts for the crossmember not threading all the way because of the added width of the brackets he wants to weld that in place...seriously...is that a good idea, I mean if it ever needs service I'm going to need a grinder and an air chisel to get the thing off...what do we think? I've used this guy for a while now, hes almost a friend of the family I guess, but I'm not sure I want to go along with this.
Thanks,
Alex

 

[TRAILREADYXJ]

Don't weld it!!! Just get the right size bolt! They should have come with the kit.

However with an SYE+CV you don't need a t-case drop.

Not to mention, a SYE install should only take a couple hours max.

 

[outlander]

Is this a rubicon express kit?

 

[EMSJEEP]

Is this a rubicon express kit?

Yes.

There was no planned t-case drop, though the kit came with the parts. The 4 bolts that came with the drop brackets are not threaded for the weld nuts, which can be fixed, but there is no easy way to extend/replace the studs which are welded to the unibody. That is to say, on each side there is one weld nut and one stud, so giving me 4 bolts does no good. God only knows why it took a shop so frickin long to do the SYE kit, but I'm not happy about them wanting to weld this thing on...and a little curious why they needed the installation instructions so badly.

 

[CHUGLYxj]

how many SYE's has the shop done or how many xfer cases have they had appart?

As far as the drop, you don't want it with the SYE, re-use the factory hardware.

RE never, at least for me, sends the right sized hardware. Or at least hardware that works with the factory hardware.

Out of curiosity, how much is this costing you?

 

[EMSJEEP]

The control arm drop bracket braces use the t-case support's bolts which equates to a 1/8" lowering of the crossmember, it is not a t-case lowering kit that has been installed, the support braces came with 4 new bolts, maybe the hardware form the t-case lowering kit could be used....hmmm...anyway, I have no idea, how much this is costing me I doubt they have done many if any SYE installs specifically but they do plenty of driveline work so its not too much of a stretch and they didn't even question doing the work...he does this to me alot, with the price ambiguity but he is usually very fair in the end and no one else wanted to work with me aside from taking the whole lift apart and doing eveything their way to make sure it was perfect. I am very worried about them wanting to weld the crossmember on though, what if I want to add a skid plate later or need to do my own t-case work....even the exhaust is obscured by the piece...is this something one would expect to do, something a shop would want to do?
If I hadn't burned myself on the last day of the lift I would have jumped into the SYE but its just too much of a PITA with one hand not working so well...

 

[DirtyMJ]

Why can't you replace the bolts? The factory used studs threaded in to nutserts in the frame. You can pull the studs out and put bolts in.




Anyways, you DO NOT want to weld that crossmember on.

 

[EMSJEEP]

so when I get the, "you don't know anything, we are the Gods of all things automotive" talk what are some good reasons for not welding it on?

I'm thinking welding the CA drop brackets isn't such a bad idea....but not the crossmember

 

[TRAILREADYXJ]

what are some good reasons for not welding it on?

I think you listed most of them, It would make future drive train work an absolute PITA! Also the stock cross member is not too strong and will bend if you hit it hard enough. I have had to replace mine because of this.

And as far as the stud goes, the stud itself isn't welded to the body, mine unscrewed with vise grips.

Family friend or not, if they can't even go get the right hardware, I'd find a new mechanic. Those brackets will have a lot of leverage, I wouldn't trust them just welded to the unibodys sheet metal. I say install them the way RE says to.

I have a small shop myself and would NEVER weld any of this unless the manufacturers instructions said to. I'm surprised any shop would want to, because it would make them fully liable if something went wrong. With it properly installed, some of that liability would fall on RE instead.

 

[EMSJEEP]

The support brace on the driver side bowed out between the stock bracket and the crossmember attachment point...the shop was unable to pop the studs out, as it is now the bolts are about 2/3 threaded so hes going to tack it up in 8 places until we figure out what to do, what a PITA....
The SYE is done, looks good, I start on the electrical when I get it back, moving all or most of the components off of the floor and on to the cargo rack in back.

 

[jeeperjohn]

Personally, I would have them cut out the nut plates in the frame and weld in some sort of new nutplates. See this thread: http://www.naxja.org/forum/showthread.php?t=920042

 

[EMSJEEP]

Yeah I actually saw that thread....its just so much of a pain with the fuel line right there and all....I'll see if I can break the stud out some other time, I think this setup should be alright for the time being. This whole idea of putting weld nuts inside the frame was really dumb...

 

[KSXJ]

Get new bolts, they are 3/8 grade 8.

 

[EMSJEEP]

I have two sets of them, one came with the braces kit and another with the t-case lowering kit....he couldn't get the studs out

 

[RCP Phx]

Get new bolts, they are 3/8 grade 8.

Wrong,they are metric 10mm!
Also they are not nuts welded in the frame,they are "nut-serts"(blind threaded rivets).They are replacable and available from the dealer!

 

[andrew2516]

FIND A NEW MECHANIC!!!!!!!

put two nuts on the stud....then back them up against each other...after they are tight you can loosen the stud with a wrench.

 

[KSXJ]

or tac the nuts onto the studs, and then just take them right out.

 

[EMSJEEP]

so you are saying that I can just turn the stud out of the hole....then put in the new bolt, easy as that? What the hell man, why does this have to be such a process? Is there a head or anything on the stud or should it just thread right through

 

[Hypoid]

put two nuts on the stud....then back them up against each other...after they are tight you can loosen the stud with a wrench.

or tac the nuts onto the studs, and then just take them right out.

Or just torch 'em off now so you can get right to the eventuality of installing new nut-certs.

Some of the design is irritating, these little heeps are full of awshits, but, there is a plan B if you should happen to break a stud or two. Just give it hell, get on with the correct installation.

Send your machanic a link to this thread, he's not alone in his misery.

 

[xj92]

Get a new mechanic. If he can weld the crossmember to the body, he should be smart enough to weld a nut or something onto the stud to get it out. I did my SYE in a couple hours, first time I'd ever done one or ever seen the inside of a transfer case. This isn't hard stuff.