sye using front shaft

[pudge]

thank you

cheers from up north

 

[ratman572]

For whatever it's worth, I'm running an OEM fron DS on mine, and I've flogged it hard, -so far so good.

Mt setup is as follows:

AW-4, 231 TC, D-44 Rear, 5.5"-6" lift, 4.55 gears, 32 BFG MT's.

I opted to use the 3103-27CV yoke, I drilled/tapped the TC output shaft to 3/8"-24, and machined a spacer washer to hold the 3103-27CV on the end of the TC shaft. With the D-44, this allowed me to use a bone-stock front DS out of an AW-4 rig. One thing I DID NOT do was shorten the TC output shaft (this would have made the stock DS a tad short). I even used the stock tailcone assembly on the TC to give the tailshaft some additional support. The thing is perfectly smooth running down the highway, -no vibes, -not even a hint of one, -at ANY speed.

Painless, -and so far pretty durable. I have done powerbrake burnouts in 4-Lo with the disco frontend free (2-Lo). I have peeled out on gravel and transitioned to dry pavement (which is usually when something will let go), -and nada.

I did all this as a torture test to get some sort of an idea if it was going to hold up or not.

I'm currently running a 1" TC drop just to keep as much angle off the CV sector as possible, -but this will go away when I install the T&T Y-arms that are sitting in my garage!

I have removed the TC drop and run it that way also, -and it does have a "hint" of a vibe at between 45-48 mph, -but it isn't much of one. The best part of the whole deal is only needing one spare DS. Maybe I lucked out here, but the DS in the rear doesn't bind at all going from full stuff to full droop, -and has plenty of slip-spline engagement.


By far, the best mod I've done to my XJ so far.

People get a strange look on their face when they see that the factory tailcone is still on the TC, -but it does offer a lot of support for the CV sector. I figured that I would try it this way (with intentions of hacking and making a seal carrier later), but it works so friggin good as-is, I'm going to leave it alone.

That 3103-27CV yoke is the ticket. No drive flange, no seal carrier, no hacking, -and aside from the somewhat gruelling task (patience required), of drilling and tapping and making the special washer, -a pretty painless install for sure.

For whatever it's worth.....

 

[copbait]

Welcome to , where sarcasm flows like (insert random metaphor here)

If you think this setup is just "blindly run" by a bunch of ignorant idiots, simply because it fits, you should do much more searching and reading...

first off, "ignorant idiots" are your words not mine. thanks for caring though.

anyway, so i assume you are running this setup? can you show me any specs that the front driveshaft is designed to handle 100% of the engine torque? something besides "a lot of other people are running it" or "tried and true".

obviously not many, if any, people have having problems with breakage, but i'm thinking it's possible that a weaker shaft could be contributing to premature joint and/or bearing wear due to slight flex or vibrations under heavy torque.

maybe i'm just overthinking things though. anyone else have reservations about doing this mod, or have other issues with it?

 

[Dave41079]

It's pretty simple. Lots of guys run it with no issues. That's real world experience. Anything can, and will break at some point on some vehicle. I've seen Tom Woods shafts busted and they're designed to handle 100% of the engine torque, right? The bottom line here is if you don't feel comfortable with a relatively inexpensive mod that works for numerous individuals who obviously don't baby their vehicles, then there are MANY other manufacturers out there who would be more than happy to sell you a driveshaft to give you peace of mind. That being said, don't tase me, bro.

 

[copbait]

It's pretty simple. Lots of guys run it with no issues. That's real world experience. Anything can, and will break at some point on some vehicle. I've seen Tom Woods shafts busted and they're designed to handle 100% of the engine torque, right? The bottom line here is if you don't feel comfortable with a relatively inexpensive mod that works for numerous individuals who obviously don't baby their vehicles, then there are MANY other manufacturers out there who would be more than happy to sell you a driveshaft to give you peace of mind. That being said, don't tase me, bro.

that sounds great, but the thing you don't seem to be understanding is that the driveshaft can and will affect other parts of the driveline, and people may not even realize the true cause. like someone might be eating up ujoints more often than is normal, or the pinion bearings might be going, but they attribute that to some other problem.

oh, and don't worry, if i shoot someone it sure won't be with a taser, bro

 

[mk153smaw]

FWIW, if your really worried about the other parts, transfer case, transmission, difrentials...ect... Most would have said it by now. The worst damage I have seen yet so far from the front shaft set-up was over extension, and someone with over 7" of lift was asking for it by using it for other than an emergency spare on the trail.
Me, I purposely use weak U-joints when I can. I prefer to change a U-joint than say a bust TC or a screwed up pinion. I have not heard of, I sure someone has done it, a twisted front driveshaft or the front DS doing something bad to the rest of the system.
What you are really getting from buying a "better" professionally made DS is a longer yoke set-up, better U-joints (which will transfer unwanted stress), and some shiney chrome. That is about it.

 

[Frankkl]

The front shaft can, and will andle 100% of the torque. Many will say its even stronger than the stock rear shaft.
I am running one, its kinda short but works fine. 4'' lift, 8.25 rear.

 

[xalexjx]

I run a front shaft in the back. Have for about a year with no problems.. just keep the slip yoke greased.. 33's beadlocked. with an 8.25 locked.. Going to move the back axle back 2 inches so i just made an older shafts i had a bit longer....

make sure you shim the back axle accordingly so the pinion is pointing right at the tcase pinion.

 

[copbait]

The front shaft can, and will andle 100% of the torque. Many will say its even stronger than the stock rear shaft.
I am running one, its kinda short but works fine. 4'' lift, 8.25 rear.

stronger than the rear? interesting, i haven't heard that before.

despite what some of you may think i do hope it's true, as i said i do like the idea of having the same shaft in front and back. i was just hoping that maybe someone in the business has done some sort of testing on that front shaft, or measured it's strength and construction in some scientific way. can it's tube dimensions be compared to other rear shafts that are available? if so how does it compare?

 

[xjtrailrider]

I have a TW in the trail rig, if I had it to do over I would have just run a stock front. I carry a stock front for a spare.

On my DD I have the stock front on the rear with a PORC SYE. I tow on that thing hard with no worry. Never had an issue.

 

[xalexjx]

stronger than the rear? interesting, i haven't heard that before.

despite what some of you may think i do hope it's true, as i said i do like the idea of having the same shaft in front and back. i was just hoping that maybe someone in the business has done some sort of testing on that front shaft, or measured it's strength and construction in some scientific way. can it's tube dimensions be compared to other rear shafts that are available? if so how does it compare?

the wall on the front shafts is much thicker then the wall on the rear shafts.. that wont fail though unless its dented by a rock.. On a front shaft the u-joint or slip joint will break first.. whats the big deal.. run it till it breaks then replace it.. Ive ran mine for over a year now with now problems.. And I do a lot of wheeling on it.. Everyweekend and twice a week after work

 

[proskier101]

the wall on the front shafts is much thicker then the wall on the rear shafts.. that wont fail though unless its dented by a rock.. On a front shaft the u-joint or slip joint will break first.. whats the big deal.. run it till it breaks then replace it.. Ive ran mine for over a year now with now problems.. And I do a lot of wheeling on it.. Everyweekend and twice a week after work

x2

a XJ front is heavier than a XJ rear..it does have thicker tubing. cop bait you seem to know alot about the front shaft..how about you give us the numbers??? you seem to know alot to be arguing???:scottm:

 

[Frankkl]

when you think about it, the front end is only designed to handle 50% of the engine torque. so why would you want to use those parts in the rear which needs to be able to handle 100% of the torque?

don't get me wrong, i like the idea of only having to carry one spare, but i just don't know how strong the front shaft actually is. are there any specs or ratings on it we can compare to other shafts?

Where did you get the info that the front shaft is designed to handle 50%? If you know something we dont, please tell us. I think that users wont be able to get you the info you want. Call Chrysler.

' measured it's strength and construction in some scientific way'

This was covered so many times, I had that same question, search, find and got it done. If the scientific are so important, call TomWood, give them the specs you want and they will build it for you. The forum is give and take: people sharing their experience. I don't know of any jeeper that spends time to take a new stockshaft in a dyno until it breaks just to get the specs.

'maybe i'm just overthinking things though. anyone else have reservations about doing this mod, or have other issues with it?'

Yes, NO.

Have a nice day

 

[copbait]

x2

a XJ front is heavier than a XJ rear..it does have thicker tubing. cop bait you seem to know alot about the front shaft..how about you give us the numbers??? you seem to know alot to be arguing???

no actually i know little about the front shaft, that's the main reason i'm posting here looking for more information on it. i have searched but have not found many details regarding it's construction and strength.

and i don't think i'm really arguing, i'm just saying that i'm looking for something more than just "many people run it with no problems"

for instance, you know how axle shafts are rated by the spline count, and the type of alloy used? people judge the strength of a shaft on these figures. why can't i apply the same concept to a driveshaft?

 

[Frankkl]

for instance, you know how axle shafts are rated by the spline count, and the type of alloy used? people judge the strength of a shaft on these figures. why can't i apply the same concept to a driveshaft?[/quote]

Cause most people break other stuff. The u-joint is so much weaker than the shaft. The u-joint will break well before the shaft.

 

[Georgia Mike]

can you show me any specs that the front driveshaft is designed to handle 100% of the engine torque? something besides "a lot of other people are running it" or "tried and true".

Specs are just what is on paper. It has been PROVEN that it works, what more do you want?

obviously not many, if any, people have having problems with breakage

See, you said it for yourself

maybe i'm just overthinking things though.

Yes you are.

 

[copbait]

obviously not many, if any, people have having problems with breakage

See, you said it for yourself

so you think that just because something doesn't break, that means it can't have any negative effects on other components? wow thanks for that very thorough analysis there, you must be an engineer.

 

[copbait]

Where did you get the info that the front shaft is designed to handle 50%? If you know something we dont, please tell us. I think that users wont be able to get you the info you want. Call Chrysler.

do you have a FWD option on your transfer case? i know mine doesn't. my vehicle was designed to only have the front receive torque when the rear is also receiving torque. that tells me the front was not designed to get 100% of the engine torque. why would they overbuild it to do so when that could never normally happen? i don't know if the 50% figure is exactly accurate, but it's certainly going to be less than the full shot.

yea, i'm sure Chrysler will have exactly what i'm looking for:

me: "Hello, can I please speak to a technician"
Chrysler: "One moment please..."

(45 minutes of porn surfing elapse while on hold)

Chrysler: "Hello how can I help you?"
me: "Umm, can i use a front drive shaft in the rear of my Cherokee?"
Chrysler: "No." Click.

 

[mk153smaw]

This thread has probably gone as far as it can really.

My reccomendation to you, and I am sure many at this point will second it, go spend your hard earned money on a custom driveshaft. It will only set you back between $150 to $300 depending on who you buy it from and what you want custom.
Some people on this forum are engineers, or have been at some point in thier lives, and don't have the time nor the want to creat a metal fatiuge chart just for all us to look at. Having information like that will do nothing but confuse you anyway since that is the domain of engineers. I look at it this way, why dont you take out a piece of paper write down the numbers you wish to calculate and go to your local college and see if one of the graduates wants to take on your ideas.
Always keep in mind this.... Custom shiney parts aren't dreamed up by engineers, nor thoroughly tested by them (unless it is a safety piece). What happens is some smart business man see's a community using a rough part, sourced probably from a junker, and decides to make it shiney with a few 'extra' niceties that are usefull.


Welcome to owning a Jeep.:repair:

 

[Pharaoh XJ]

With the front DS in the back whats the maximum lift I can run ?