Still running hot!

[1990JEEPXJ]

I have tossed around the idea of getting a Griffin radiator. I have an all metal two row ready to go in. If that doesn't work as I'd hope Griffin it is. I occasionally wheel in the dunes in june.

 

[PRYAPSM]

Ding ding ding! Get a new fan clutch. If it doesn't sound like a 747, it's shot. Just put a hd one on my stepdad's xj and it'll blow the clothes off an Amish chick.

Ding ding!
Did you read that I have dirtbound fans??

 

[PRYAPSM]

When are your fans set to come on? Since it goes down when you are on the freeway my bet is on an air flow problem.

Clutch fan Should not matter with dirtbounds e fans. Make sure they are pulling and not pushing.

I don't the fans are a problem, they are pulling air towards that motor. I believe they are set to come on at 195 and 210?

First off, put a 195 thermostat it if you dont have one. Don't use anything else but a 195. Do you have ac? If so, does it work?

I was running a Stant 195 thermo with 13psi cap, without the thermo it has running at 210 with the A/C on the freeway.

[/QUOTE]
If no, is the condensor still in front of the radiator? If it is, remove it completely. The old condensors block A LOT of airflow. Most cooling problems of any system (oil, fuel, water) is air flow. Are your fans pushing or pulling across the radiator? Are you 100% sure you have all the air out of the system? WHAT YEAR IS YOUR JEEP? Get a meter and test the coolant temp sensor, use a infared temp gun and do a temp check across the radiator. Test inlet and outlet temps. Compare. It should be cooler coming out of the radiator obviously.[/QUOTE]

I am sure I got 99% of the air out of the system, it is a 98 jeep. Do you think the condenser is blocking that much air? What about the catalytic converter being clogged, could that cause it over heat?

 

[PRYAPSM]

maybe your old thermostat was bad.

Yeah but it is still running hot without a thermostat..It will cool down a lot faster now though..

 

[PRYAPSM]

I was having the same problem with my '95 XJ. I had a CSF Triple Core rad and I tried all kinds of different fans (even the Taurus fan). Finally, what works is to return fans to stock and put in a Griffin radiator. It's expensive and it's a lot thicker than any other radiator I've seen for the XJ, but this thing WORKS! I have had NO overheating problems since installing it. Hope this helps...

Yeah sorry man, that is not going to go over well with the wife.. Uh honey remember I spent $500 trying to fix the cooling system on the Jeep well I need another $500 for new radiator. Yeah I don't think it will go over to well with her!!

 

[garr]

Did you replace the spring in the Lower radiator hose when you changed it?
If everything is in good shape & it still runs hot There may be some kind of blockage, I would flush with one of the available long flush products & then see what happens.

 

[carves]

Confirm the actual temps by some other means ... IR, or a multimeter with a temp probe or something,

Test the CTS as per the factory service manual specs,

If the displayed temps are correct ....

-Is there too much eth-gly in the mix ???,

- Put another, new, t'stat in it ... stay with a 195* for the time being.
If you're using aftermarket t'stats ... buy the "premium" versions not the "economy" versions ... as" economy", relates to its price - NOT, how much fuel it saves you
Dont bother with 160* t'stats IMHO ... but since Jeep/Chrysler offered optional 180* t'stats for the XJ in their parts books ... there shouldnt be an issue with 180* t'stats
Its not good to run for prolonged periods with no t'stat at all ... too much flow. Much better to just knock the centre piece out as a short term, trail fix.

- Grab yourself a 15psi rad cap ... and make sure its sealing properly on the filler neck.

- If possible ... adjust the start temp of the fans ...
Begin with 180* and fine tune from there ... Adjust the higher setting down as required if nescessary.

- AW4 ??? ... still hooked up to the radiator ??? ... now theres a design flaw IMHO .. ..

Double check that all the cooling system stuff is operating correctly before moving on to heads and blocked cats ... its all just a process of elimination unfortunately.

 

[xjwisconsin]

What is hot? over the 210 mark? woooh, carves just chimed in as I was typing and he has some good advice for you. I have run the CSF 3 in my 88,89 and in the 98 with switching the 88 to an open I ran a consistent 200 in all three rigs. All were manuals and had ac.

 

[NorCalChris]

I don't the fans are a problem, they are pulling air towards that motor. I believe they are set to come on at 195 and 210?




I was running a Stant 195 thermo with 13psi cap, without the thermo it has running at 210 with the A/C on the freeway.



I am sure I got 99% of the air out of the system, it is a 98 jeep. Do you think the condenser is blocking that much air? What about the catalytic converter being clogged, could that cause it over heat?

Ok, set the fans to come on earlier. Next get a 15 or 16 psi cap. Pull your fans and use compressed air to blow backwards through the radiator and condensor, just make sure you go STRAIGHT on to the fins or they will bend. When ever you replace a radiator you want to blow air backwards across the rest of the coolers to clear dirt out. I can't say if yours is or isn't blocking that much air without seeing it. If your AC works then I'd pull the condensor last. If it doesnt, well then yank that crap out of there.

Yes a plugged cat could cause this, but You would have more issues then over heating most likely. Another thing, not gonna cause this whole problem, but make sure your oil is full. It helps cool too.
If you want to do a flush I've used vinegar before. Added a pint of vinegar and ran straight water. Ran it like that for a few days then flushed it out. Only problem I found was it removed so much crap I had a hard time flushing it all out. Had to flush twice with water before I could add coolant.

 

[NorCalChris]

"-Is there too much eth-gly in the mix ???"
I missed that one, are you running the correct mixture for your conditions?

 

[Ben824]

Have you tried doing a good flush with a heavy duty cleaner? You could possibly have some buildup in the passage ways affecting cooling. I heard Ford has some crazy good cleaner that you can get from a dealer to super clean some older Tauruses that had cooling issues. But give a good heavy duty store bought cleaner a try. Even if it doesn't solve your problem atleast you will know the block is clean and it is one more thing you can rule out.

 

[Jeepguy03]

Ok, set the fans to come on earlier. Next get a 15 or 16 psi cap. Pull your fans and use compressed air to blow backwards through the radiator and condensor, just make sure you go STRAIGHT on to the fins or they will bend. When ever you replace a radiator you want to blow air backwards across the rest of the coolers to clear dirt out. I can't say if yours is or isn't blocking that much air without seeing it. If your AC works then I'd pull the condensor last. If it doesnt, well then yank that crap out of there.

Yes a plugged cat could cause this, but You would have more issues then over heating most likely. Another thing, not gonna cause this whole problem, but make sure your oil is full. It helps cool too.
If you want to do a flush I've used vinegar before. Added a pint of vinegar and ran straight water. Ran it like that for a few days then flushed it out. Only problem I found was it removed so much crap I had a hard time flushing it all out. Had to flush twice with water before I could add coolant.

This. Set your fans to come on earlier. Setting them to come on when the jeep is already at 195 or 210 is too late. Also use a 16 psi radiator cap.

 

[PRYAPSM]

Did you replace the spring in the Lower radiator hose when you changed it?
If everything is in good shape & it still runs hot There may be some kind of blockage, I would flush with one of the available long flush products & then see what happens.

Have you tried doing a good flush with a heavy duty cleaner? You could possibly have some buildup in the passage ways affecting cooling. I heard Ford has some crazy good cleaner that you can get from a dealer to super clean some older Tauruses that had cooling issues. But give a good heavy duty store bought cleaner a try. Even if it doesn't solve your problem atleast you will know the block is clean and it is one more thing you can rule out.

Yeah when I replaced the raditor I also install new hoses, clamps and flushed it with a heavy duty flush then I ran vineagar in system and let sit over night.

Confirm the actual temps by some other means ... IR, or a multimeter with a temp probe or something,

Test the CTS as per the factory service manual specs,

If the displayed temps are correct ....

-Is there too much eth-gly in the mix ???,

- Put another, new, t'stat in it ... stay with a 195* for the time being.
If you're using aftermarket t'stats ... buy the "premium" versions not the "economy" versions ... as" economy", relates to its price - NOT, how much fuel it saves you
Dont bother with 160* t'stats IMHO ... but since Jeep/Chrysler offered optional 180* t'stats for the XJ in their parts books ... there shouldnt be an issue with 180* t'stats
Its not good to run for prolonged periods with no t'stat at all ... too much flow. Much better to just knock the centre piece out as a short term, trail fix.

- Grab yourself a 15psi rad cap ... and make sure its sealing properly on the filler neck.

- If possible ... adjust the start temp of the fans ...
Begin with 180* and fine tune from there ... Adjust the higher setting down as required if nescessary.

- AW4 ??? ... still hooked up to the radiator ??? ... now theres a design flaw IMHO .. ..

Double check that all the cooling system stuff is operating correctly before moving on to heads and blocked cats ... its all just a process of elimination unfortunately.

Ok, set the fans to come on earlier. Next get a 15 or 16 psi cap. Pull your fans and use compressed air to blow backwards through the radiator and condensor, just make sure you go STRAIGHT on to the fins or they will bend. When ever you replace a radiator you want to blow air backwards across the rest of the coolers to clear dirt out. I can't say if yours is or isn't blocking that much air without seeing it. If your AC works then I'd pull the condensor last. If it doesnt, well then yank that crap out of there.

Yes a plugged cat could cause this, but You would have more issues then over heating most likely. Another thing, not gonna cause this whole problem, but make sure your oil is full. It helps cool too.
If you want to do a flush I've used vinegar before. Added a pint of vinegar and ran straight water. Ran it like that for a few days then flushed it out. Only problem I found was it removed so much crap I had a hard time flushing it all out. Had to flush twice with water before I could add coolant.

"-Is there too much eth-gly in the mix ???"
I missed that one, are you running the correct mixture for your conditions?

I am filled the system with 50/50 pre-mix, and the CSF rad I can only find a 18 PSI or 13PSI cap to fit properly. I ran an 18psi cap until removed thermostat. I was under the impression the high cap the higher boiling temp?
Yeah I still have the tranny fluid running though the raditor, but will that really make a huge diffrence in cooling the whole Jeep? I am going to add a tranny cooler eventaully, but I was going to wait until I put new tranny in. With 202k miles on it I don't think I am going to make much of a diffrence now?

This. Set your fans to come on earlier. Setting them to come on when the jeep is already at 195 or 210 is too late. Also use a 16 psi radiator cap.

 

[Ben824]

Yeah I still have the tranny fluid running though the raditor, but will that really make a huge diffrence in cooling the whole Jeep? I am going to add a tranny cooler eventaully, but I was going to wait until I put new tranny in. With 202k miles on it I don't think I am going to make much of a diffrence now?

I added a tranny cooler and a tranny temp gauge but still kept it running through the radiator at first. I then later changed it to just the tranny cooler. I didn't notice as much of a difference in engine temps but did notice some for the tranny. The tranny should really be running around 155-170 and the engine runs at 210 so if the engine is running hot the the tranny will over heat and if the transmission is running hot then it could affect engine temps. My transmission runs fairly cool for the most part now but when working really hard it can get as high as 200 (not good I know but trying to tow a trailer while pushing 33 bfg muds and stock gears is just going to do that). The cooling element for the tranny cooler in the radiator is on the cool side right where the coolant flows out into the lower radiators hose. So if the tranny fluid is running super hot then it could be preheating the coolant before it flows back to the engine and doesn't help as much with cooling. This is all theoretical so don't take it as fact. But running the tranny fluid through a separate cooler and bypassing the radiator entirely has presented good results for me. Oh and I have 223,000 miles on my 97 so at 202,000 there is still room for improvement.

 

[Pelican]

Have you confirmed the temperature with an IR thermometer? This has been suggested and I apologize if you have already answered.

 

[carves]

You're getting yourself quite a list of things to consider - and seemingly ... all at once.

Step back a pace ... and confirm the running temps are what the gauge says.

Adjust the fan settings so they activate sooner.

Test drive it and see what the result is.

......................... I am filled the system with 50/50 pre-mix,

50/50 is the recommended mix ... as an all area, general use, ratio. You could try a 30/70 mix or less ... I use a 10/90, 12mnthly changeout, off the shelf, pre-mix, we have available down here.

Its not an overheating "fix" ... but it can assist in regards to - maintaining a more stable, running temp in hotter climates.

and the CSF rad I can only find a 18 PSI or 13PSI cap to fit properly. I ran an 18psi cap until removed thermostat. I was under the impression the high cap the higher boiling temp?

20psi is the usual, test pressure, of a cooling system .... but the pressure is only applied for a short time .... It may be nit-picking or perhaps even irrelevant ... but running a very high pressure constantly, over the long term ... is likely to stress out gaskets and seals quicker.

15/16 psi seems to be a happy balance. Lower pressure is fine ... as long as the cooling system is efficient enough in design, so as to prevent high temps/spikes in the first place.

Yep ... higher pressure increases the boil temp. About 3* for every psi ... but that gain should be used as a, cooling bonus ... not as an operating requirement because a vehicle manufacturer ... saved a few bucks by fitting too small a radiator

Yeah I still have the tranny fluid running though the raditor, but will that really make a huge diffrence in cooling the whole Jeep? I am going to add a tranny cooler eventaully, but I was going to wait until I put new tranny in. With 202k miles on it I don't think I am going to make much of a diffrence now?

Like the others .... A seperate cooler has made a significant difference on my vehicle.
It does have a slightly longer, tranny warmup period .... of no consequence IMHO,
Longer oil life,
Better shifting,
and bypassing the rad will will partly contribute - to a more stable, coolant temp ...
..... but you need to consider - whether the tranny needs the warm up assistance, at a cold start, that the tranny/rad, heat exchanger provides .... in your operating environment.

If you fit one now ... it can only extend the life of the current tranny.

 

[sakosha]

after replacing 2 different senders i came to the conclusion that my gauge was bad, so i disconnected it. i keep a $40 ryobi infrared thermometer in the jeep and check out the temps whenever i get a chance and everything is running cool. tranny fluid is running cool as well.

 

[garr]

Yeah when I replaced the raditor I also install new hoses, clamps and flushed it with a heavy duty flush then I ran vineagar in system and let sit over night.

Did you transfer the lower hose spring from the old hose into the new one?
Most new hoses do not contain the spring & it needs to be transferred in.

 

[PRYAPSM]

Did you transfer the lower hose spring from the old hose into the new one?
Most new hoses do not contain the spring & it needs to be transferred in.

My old lower rad hose did not contain a spring so I did not replace it with one.

..... but you need to consider - whether the tranny needs the warm up assistance, at a cold start, that the tranny/rad, heat exchanger provides .... in your operating environment.

If you fit one now ... it can only extend the life of the current tranny.

I don't think it will ever be cold enough out here where I would have to worry about that. I also remember reading somewhere that B&M makes you can use a 'thermal bypass valve. So I would install a bypass valve when I installed a tranny cooler so I would have not to worry about my wife not letting the transmission properly warm up before she speeds off!

"which short-circuits the fluid back to the transmission when it's cold, and allowed it to flow through the cooler when it's warm. Also not a bad idea (and what I would do after totally removing the OEM "heat exchanger" from the circuit - warmup times are similar, but it takes a thermal load off of your engine coolant loop - heating the air with a cooler in front of the radiator has less impact than using the coolant to "exchange heat" in the transmission fluid directly.)" Tranny cooler question

Have you confirmed the temperature with an IR thermometer? This has been suggested and I apologize if you have already answered.

No I have not had chance to check it with a IR thermometer..

 

[Fred]

I have a 90 converted to an open system. Originally I used a three row all copper radiator. I converted when the OEM system finally would over heat while not moving in 2002. It has a 12? year old heavy duty fan clutch, the original electric fan, a flowkooler water pump that is ten years old. It overheated on the trail a few years back. I suspected a head gasket, because everything was copacetic up until then. Turned out to be the wonderful Mr. Gasket high flow thermostat that was less than a year old. I replaced the three row anyway with a two row aluminum and plastic radiator from perfomance radiator. Once I got the thing completely burped(difficult for XJ's), I have only had to use my auxilary fan when stationary in 90 degree weather, and that was just to take it down from 210 degrees indicated. I towed the 97 tonight in 70 degree weather, and never got close to 210 indicated. I drove up a steep dirt road pulling a trailer without the auxilary fan at 10-20 MPH, and it just crested 210 indicated.

Summary, I'd rather have a two row aluminum with the right size tubes, than a three row copper.

Lest I forget, I have a manual tranny, so that may make a diff.