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Shift kit and Trans cooler

DeadEyeJ said:
So, I'm retarded. I just reread your quote up there and realized you were joking. Just ignore my first paragraph please.:anon:

It's ok, I had many a retarded moment this evening putting on my RE lift..."crap, I need a spring compressor".... I was just pointing out my distaste for car companies combining systems. If there was ever a problem, trans fluid ends up in the radiator and engine....and not in the trans. and ditto about what bluto said about hot days.
 
While it's true that the transmission cooler is on the cooler side of the radiator, the XJ radiator is small enough without introducing more thermal load. That, and what if the brazing fails? The "cooler" for the transmission fluid is essentially a hollow tube (think two layers of pipe brazed together at the ends) and that's not the most efficient design.

Also, the upper fitting is a flare, the lower is usually a QD.

Considering the XJ has a tendency to run hot (I think nominal is up around 200*,) I've never been fond of running hot oil through hot water, and the internal cooler is a cheap solution to a potentially expensive problem (and the excuse "that's how everyone does it" just doesn't work with me.) The thermal valve with the external cooler is a better idea.

For the argument of the water system heating the fluid to operating temp - true, but it takes the engine a while to heat up due to the greater volume of coolant involved, so how much help is it? On some other vehicles I've had where I did the thermal valve, spin-on filter, and external cooler setup - and compared times for temperature shift - the thermal valve won out AND the engine stayed cooler the whole time. I don't have the notes, but the timing was farily significant.

So, all else being equal, I am willing to go on record saying that an external cooler with a thermal control valve is a better option than the OEM setup, and further state that modifying the system to delete the OEM internal cooler in favour of a PROPERLY CONFIGURED (it's not that difficult) external cooler setup is a better way to go - especially for a vehicle that has the potential of seeing little "ram air" cooling (think off-roading,) which will reduce the cooling efficiency of the radiator and associated systems. Even with the fans going full tilt, it's still not going to get as much air as it would at freeway speed - that's just the nature of the beast. If you are planning on off-roading extensively, I'd even go so far as to make you start thinking about an engine oil cooler, and possible a P/S cooler. Bringing the fluid temperature down on P/S (like any hydraulic system) will make it a little more consistent, and cooling the engine oil will help bring overall engine temperatures down by assisting the task of the radiator with a fluid that gets closer to the combustion process, and is directly impacted by internal friction...

5-90
 
Old A/C condensors make good trans coolers. they're light, big, and made out of aluminum. If you've got the room. Never looked on an XJ, since I don't have one yet.
As far as the trans fluid and engine coolant never mixing, not true. My friends cousin was complaning about his Grand Cherokee always leaking water, and it was always full. yeah it was full of trans fluid and the trans was full of coolant. Bye-bye transmission. $2500 later he had a new trans and was back on the road. I'd run an aux cooler and disconnect it from the radiator. I'd run an oil cooler too, get's pretty hot around here.
200F is normal for an XJ? So is it the same for an MJ? My friends MJ hits 215F-220F pulling his little tent trailer up the 4 lane of the 168 going to Shaver Lake.
 
would it be posable to set it up so the radiator is in the curcit untill the thermal valve opens that way you still get the quick warm up[for those of us that drive shorter distences in cold weather] and the lower cooling atvantages.
 
Dont forget to take into account that the bigger the auto transmission cooler or even just the more heat you remove from a cooler in front of the engine radiator, the more heat is passed onto the radiator. I also places far more resistance to the airflow passing all the way through the the cooler and the radiator especially at low speeds. There is no free lunch, the heat you removed from one area is now in another.
You be better off looking at one of those coolers that can be mounted else where like along the 'frame' rail shown in a tread the same as this before on NAXJA. I also have had great results with my deeper pan that has proved itself really well to remove the slow shifts I was getting in hot sand while towing.
 
5-90 said:
While it's true that the transmission cooler is on the cooler side of the radiator, the XJ radiator is small enough without introducing more thermal load. That, and what if the brazing fails? The "cooler" for the transmission fluid is essentially a hollow tube (think two layers of pipe brazed together at the ends) and that's not the most efficient design.

Also, the upper fitting is a flare, the lower is usually a QD.

Considering the XJ has a tendency to run hot (I think nominal is up around 200*,) I've never been fond of running hot oil through hot water, and the internal cooler is a cheap solution to a potentially expensive problem (and the excuse "that's how everyone does it" just doesn't work with me.) The thermal valve with the external cooler is a better idea.

For the argument of the water system heating the fluid to operating temp - true, but it takes the engine a while to heat up due to the greater volume of coolant involved, so how much help is it? On some other vehicles I've had where I did the thermal valve, spin-on filter, and external cooler setup - and compared times for temperature shift - the thermal valve won out AND the engine stayed cooler the whole time. I don't have the notes, but the timing was farily significant.

So, all else being equal, I am willing to go on record saying that an external cooler with a thermal control valve is a better option than the OEM setup, and further state that modifying the system to delete the OEM internal cooler in favour of a PROPERLY CONFIGURED (it's not that difficult) external cooler setup is a better way to go - especially for a vehicle that has the potential of seeing little "ram air" cooling (think off-roading,) which will reduce the cooling efficiency of the radiator and associated systems. Even with the fans going full tilt, it's still not going to get as much air as it would at freeway speed - that's just the nature of the beast. If you are planning on off-roading extensively, I'd even go so far as to make you start thinking about an engine oil cooler, and possible a P/S cooler. Bringing the fluid temperature down on P/S (like any hydraulic system) will make it a little more consistent, and cooling the engine oil will help bring overall engine temperatures down by assisting the task of the radiator with a fluid that gets closer to the combustion process, and is directly impacted by internal friction...

5-90
5-90, I truly don't mean this in a smart-ass way at all. It's just that when someone is giving potentially damaging advice, particularly when it goes against conventional wisdom, I need to know their credentials. Who are you and what qualifies you in this area?
 
or buy a 5 spd...
 
kid4lyf said:
5-90, I truly don't mean this in a smart-ass way at all. It's just that when someone is giving potentially damaging advice, particularly when it goes against conventional wisdom, I need to know their credentials. Who are you and what qualifies you in this area?

how is this advice potentially damaging at all? maybe if youre a fawkin idiot you shouldnt work on your own shit cause you may damage it, sure, take it to 4 wheel parts. and how is this against conventional wisdom? im pretty sure doing most of the shit we do to our rigs is very unconventional in the wisdom department.
 
small pederson said:
how is this advice potentially damaging at all? maybe if youre a fawkin idiot you shouldnt work on your own shit cause you may damage it, sure, take it to 4 wheel parts. and how is this against conventional wisdom? im pretty sure doing most of the shit we do to our rigs is very unconventional in the wisdom department.
Are you kidding me here? If you can't see the potential for damage by eliminating cooling features for your transmission then you must be a fuckin idiot. Yes, bipassing the trans cooling in your radiator does go against conventional wisdom. Don't believe me? How many people do you know who do it?
Reread my post a$$hat. I'm not saying it's wrong, I'm only asking his background to see what credibility he brings to the table. Opinions & a$$holes, everyone has them. It's up to you to see if they are full of $hit. I'm not saying he's full of $hit, But if I'm going to follow advice I want to know who's giving it.
 
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