running out of options on death wobble

[RickHB19]

This vehicle is at stock suspension height, correct?
The new tires were balanced properly, correct?
Did you finish the swaybar bushings, I'd do the frame to bar bushings as well, its only a couple of extra bucks? BTW, your extremely likely to break the sway bar links trying to take them apart for the new bushings, most auto places sell new ones fairly cheap, but its just one more expense.

Adjusting the pre-load on the steering box should get rid of the play, that was what the previous poster was talking about when he said to put a couple of turns on the allen screw. Be careful on this, only do about a half turn at a time, you over tighten that pre-load adjustment and you'll chew up that steering box in no time.

Have you checked for play in the ball joints? Support the front axle with the wheels off the ground, use a 2X4 as a lever, see if you can find some play in the wheel/hub and the axle. Up/Down, In/Out and Tilt.

Front Wheel Bearings?

I hate to say it, but if everything above checks out, the only thing I can think of is the UCA/LCA Bushings. Even though they appear OK and you can't find anything loose, perhaps they may be soften and deteriorated enough that they don't stand up to the forces on the axle going down the road. Its a lot of work, and although you can probably get the arms and/or all bushings for roughly $80, thats a lot for just a guess.

Have you read any of the first page? Oh, and when I said "A BIT" on the screw thats what I meant, a half a turn would lock that thing tight.

 

[Rick Anderson]

Yes, I read the first page and I saw little response as too if he had completed any of the plans he talked about nor any of the suggestions he already had. That is why a lot of the suggestions are questions ending "correct?". Checking that he did these things before going into new suggestions.

And the Pre-Load adjustment, sorry you never did imply a couple of turns, I didn't mean to imply you did, we both agree that its a small adjustment at a time. You were a little vague on the location of such an adjustment and I was narrowing down where to go to do it, as well as re-enforcing the point that you adjust it a little at a time.

UCA/LCA bushings were suggested, but again, its possible they look OK and seem OK with a push of the hand, but its possible they are still bad with those simple test. The forces they absorb on the road are far greater than what you do ever trying to test them. It might be worth trying a fresh set of those bushings if you've tried everything else and it didn't solve the problem.

 

[BIgDaddyChia]

when was the last time u replaced all the tie rods.

 

[Rick Anderson]

The best check of the steering system altogether, with the motor off and the driver's side window open. Stand outside the car by the driver's side window, reach in and grab the steering wheel,

while looking at the rim of the front tire, turn the steering wheel back and forth only a 1/4" or so, without stopping inbetween. You should see the front rim turning back and forth without stopping inbetween also. You look at the rim edge, because the movement is so little, the tires will actually flex and the edge of the tire may not actually move that little bit.

Checking the rim on the passenger side is more difficult, your going to have a friend do it, and hope you can get a feel for how he is moving the steering while your watching the rim, to try to catch any slop in the system.

Your looking that there is no lag or latency in the steering. The rims move with the steering well, and not a moment behind it. If it does, there is slop in the steering, you have to isolate where the slop is. It could be wear in the tie-rods, it can be in the steering box itself, it could be in the joints on the shaft between the steering wheel down to the steering box.

Slop in the steering links, the tie-rods, between the steering box and the steering knuckles, seems to me to be the most likely to cause DW. Slop in this part will let the wheels move a little bit, independent of each other, which also changes the alignment, that is likely too really mess with the axle.

Slop in the other parts just makes for a loose steering wheel. The wheels turn with each like they should, so as far as the axle is concerned, your steering, even though your not, its the slop in the steering link between the steering wheel and the steering box or the box itself that is letting the wheels steer a little on their own.

 

[dbswede]

you really have to get good leverage to see the ball-joint play....I didnt think I had any and then my friend at the alignment shopp showed me with a lift and a upward press.

 

[RickHB19]

Rick Anderson,

I just reread my post from last night and I wanted to appologize if I came off as a D!ck. I thought most of your ?'s were right here:

Bone stock 92 cherokee, I have replaced:Steering stabilizer, two weeks ago

Trac bar and shock absorbers, today. I used a buddies lift to get the jeep off the ground and do the trac bar install.

We checked everything for loose parts and everything came out ok. Hub assemblies are good along with tierod ends.

I was moving the steering wheel around while the mechanic checked underneath and also I checked while he turned the wheel and only a very small amount of play in the gearbox.

We checked on the hoist then after the trac bar was installed I took it for a ride and got the same results.

I went back and we checked everything again on the ground and seemed to be in good working order.

That's when I found the minimal play in the steering gearbox.

It tracks good down the road and no bad wear on the tires. An alignment never crossed my mind in this situation.

One thing worth mentioning is when driving and getting up to speed the entire front end feels very loose even though everything is tight.


KIM


But aside from all that, just to make it clear to all:

DO NOT ADJUST THE STEERING BOX PRELOAD TOO TIGHT!!!
IT IS THE SMALL ALLEN SCREW ON TOP OF THE BOX AND HAS A JAM NUT AROUND IT TO HOLD IT. Wear can be compensated for by putting the preload back into the worn parts inside. BUT, if you go too tight it will not come back to center after a turn and WILL DESTROY EVERYTHING INSIDE!!!

Checking the front end:
with the key in just so you can turn the wheel, have someone shake the wheel side to side in a somewhat violent manner and put your hand on each joint of the steering, one at a time.
To check the track bar have the guy, or girl, that was just shaking the wheel, get out take a break then grab the rian gutter and rock the jeep side to side, as if to tip it over. FEEL the bar for a clunk.
For the ball joints, jack the axle off the gound so that you can pry up on the bottom of the tire, again feel for movement.

This is how I do it, any corrections/suggestions welcome.

 

[Blue XJ]

I would check the ball joints again, mien felt pretty tight when I checked them on the vehicle, but when I took the knuckle off to replace them they practically fell apart. I have had death wobble on two separate occasions and both times the cause was the ball joints.

 

[85xjwoody]

I will be replacing the lower control arms this evening along with checking out the hub assemblies again. The ball joints are good with no play. I will be checking out that gearbox too.
I have checked for play with the motor off, me inside the jeep and a friend checking out everything for play. No play anywhere visible except that gearbox. I also visually checked everything while he moved the wheel.
I am also going to just take everything down except the tierod and reinstall. Hopefully something good comes from tonights efforts.
Thanks to all who are chiming in on this. It is greatly appreciated.

Kim