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Rough Idle - No stall, No CEL

get a pack of vacuum fittings, and 1-2 foot of vacuum hose of the correct diameter, then insert a tee fitting into one of the existing lines. I usually splice it into the line to the MAP sensor then I can pinch the gauge under the wiper arm and watch it while driving.
 
I just ordered a guage. Should arrive by the time I get back into town. I'll give this a whirl and post the results. Thanks for all the help.
 
Okay. So, I finally got around to this. Actually had to change out the fuel pump before I can begin...again. So, it had a rough start again then evened out to the same slight miss condition. Been harder starting recently. So, I got the thing up to temp and took these readings....

At idle


While playing with throttle


Also noticed this high idle. After I reconnected everything and started the motor, I had a high idle. This is new. Might switch back to my old TPS. That's what I get for jumping around. Thoughts?
 
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Thought it could be worth posting this picture. This shows how i hooked up the vacuum guage with the limited fittings that came with the kit.

4ivXRns.jpg
 
I just ordered a guage. Should arrive by the time I get back into town. I'll give this a whirl and post the results. Thanks for all the help.

Your numbers don't indicate any obvious problem, though your base vacuum is a bit low. I've seen lower on 4.0L's that run smooth though. Does the needle bounce at all during idle or at 2500rpm steady?

Your low vacuum (assuming the needle isn't bouncing) could be an intake leak (usually at the gasket, or possibly anywhere in the vacuum lines. Or it could just be an old motor and nothing to worry about.

A sticky valve usually presents as some fluctuation (usually between 2-5HG) at idle.
 
It shakes slightly. Pretty much rests at 16...but I'd say bounces between 15.5 and 16.0. Seems to coincide with the stumble. I could be crazy though. Needle definitely shakes a little though. I didn't record video long enough to be obvious. But, if you watch you'll see it briefly.

Looks like maybe could be worn piston rings or incorrect ignition timing? The worn rings make sense given the age. I'm sure it's losing something. Maybe compression test and leakdown tests would be good next. Rule out all internals. Then I'm back to the bolt on parts. I have to missing something...

I even went and threw in champion plugs tonight to be sure it wasn't those.

LDwm0BE.jpg


2sD9Id1.jpg
 
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Could any of this be because I don't drive this? It just sits. I drive around the neighborhood occasionally, but, that's it. Is it possible the computer needs to relearn how to drive? I tried to reset the ecu a week or two ago....didn't do much.

Hell, maybe at this point I'm just crazy and it's fine. Seems very weak on acceleration. Could that be just because of 31s? I don't expect the xj to burn the tires when floored. It just feels like it has no guts
 
It's intermittent though. I haven't found it, but, giving it some hard throttle it drops back to somewhere close to normal. Maybe this IAC is sticking. I'll monitor and see if it continues to be a problem.
 
As ehall suggested, the high idle is probably a vacuum leak. If you still have it, check with the vacuum gauge again and/or make sure all your hoses are plugged back in and not cracked.

How drivable is it right now? ie: Could you just daily drive it for a few days to see how it goes? A slight stumble is very common in any 4.0L with any miles on it, but probably doesn't matter so long as it's making power and not getting shit for fuel economy.
 
I don't drive this thing. It's got too man other driveability issues at the moment to be road worth. I've got the front end off the ground and going through everything. Probably replacing these shocks and reinstalling the sway bar with quick disconnects. Needs tires bad too. Too many vibrations from them. Plus brakes are soft and not stopping adequately.

That and this thing isn't registered means it's not going anywhere at the moment.

But, it definitely seems to be lacking power. That's what has me concerned. From a dead stop flooring it, just doesn't have much steam. Could be the tires though. I used to have a stock 2000 limited and that thing would move. I could easily light up the tires as well. I keep comparing this to that.

I'm not much worried about the high idle. It's either the IAC or the TPS if I can't find a leak. It was fine a couple days ago till I swapped the new throttle body with sensors in place. It's not the cause of the stumble either way.
 
What causes very rough cold starts? This problem has been getting worse. It just had a hell of a time starting up. Had to give it throttle to keep it alive. Let it run 30 seconds with no improvement. Let it die.

Started up and ran better a few minutes later. Long crank. But, stayed alive with input of the throttle.

And how does this O2 sensor look?
 
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Nevermind. I can't post pictures at the moment. I tested resistance on the heater circuit of the O2 sensor and came up with 4 ohms. I tested voltage of the sensor and it was barely reading 1/10th volt. I used a mini torch to heat it up. It was glowing. Not sure if this is a reliable test.
 
Ugh. I can't win for losing. I replaced the O2 sensor and now I'm getting a no start condition. The first attempt to start seemed to almost start, but, was going to be very rough. Battery was weak so I threw a 10amp charger on it and waited 15. Tried it. One revolution it tried to pick up then nothing. Have tried 10 times. 2-3 times it tried to pick up on a revolution but nothing. Strong crank.

I pulled ignition coil wire and verified strong spark. Spark is coming through distributer. I checked two terminals and both are sparking. Had a little fuel in the rail. I pushed in shrader valve and it didn't get a quick stream like I thought. It trickled out. Next time I checked it didnt do much at all.

I'm not hearing the fuel pump kick on. It's brand new. It's airtex...I know. I verified 6 ish volts to the fuel pump. Thoughts? I returned the fuel pump pressure tester last weekend when I knew fuel system was good. Ugh. Should I go get it?

Fml
 
Replced fuel pump with Bosch. She purs again. However, I think I see a problem. Just re-did my compression test. Results below. Got her almost up to operating temp to start the test. Guage was broke so I had to rent another one. I already pulled the plugs and wires before I noticed this. By the time I got back, motor was warm but no where near operating temp. Did test anyway. All plugs removed and foot on accelerator to the floor (for WOT). All number at 5-6 revolutions based on listening to starter.

1. 123
2. 129
3. 120
4. 130
5. 135
6. 113

All of these look a little low to me. At the bottom end of acceptable. The problem one is number 6. 22 psi below the highest reading and 8psi below the bottom threshold. I know from previous testing, putting oil in there does bring compression test up to about 125 or 130. I know the rings are failing.

Is this causing my rough idle? A better way to describe it is a shake at idle. It sounds fine, but, there is definitely a shake and hesitation.
 
Man! You've identified multiple sensor problems as well as a few mechanical, and you've had bent pushrods (indicating a valves getting stuck). I hate to say it, but I think your motor is sorta pooched and you may be better off just finding a replacement.
Your compression is very low. Even my worst 4.0L tested out to around 165 with one or two cyls +/- 25, and it wasn't running fantastic at that point.

I suppose things are a bit different in the US as your prices are WAY better, but up here, if you've got bad rings, you just replace the block because 10 minutes of labour at a machine shop to check your cylinder walls costs more than used motor.

I, like you, have spent way too much time troubleshooting a motor full of gremlins. Were this my Jeep, I'd be keeping my eyes open for a replacement long block, with sensors.

If you really want to continue hacking on your junk, I always recommend starting with what you know, and right now you KNOW your rings are toast. Start by replacing rings and have the cylinders checked and make sure your hone is good. Do a thorough visual inspection for cracks. Try to find a shop who can pressure test your head, or at least pull the head to inspect the valves (and maybe give them a grind), replace the valve stem seals, double check your rockers and pushrods again, etc.
Also yes, low compression and that #6 being that much lower can definitely cause a shitty idle (with a shake). What do your plugs look like (picture of them all in a row)?

If you're having fun doing this shit, continue having fun. If you're getting to the point of frustration, I'd just replace the motor. I know you can usually find a decent running 4.0L down there for under $400. (Around $1000 here, with no warranty, from a JY, in completely unknown condition... sigh)


That said though, if she's purring now... what's not working?
 
Ugh. This will be the third motor I've put in this thing. I'm not doing it again. Lol. I'm going to put her back together and sell it. It can be driven as is. But, I wanted it running perfect again. Oh well.

Anyways, I thought compression in these things was supposed to be 120-150. If so, I'm happy with 130.

When I say purring, I mean running. It really does sound okay. Just a slight shake at idle that I know isn't normal. Must be number 6 giving me the problems.

I'm frustrated beyond belief now. I wanted to systematically test everything to verify what I thought was the issue before I yanked the motor. Most of the time these motors are sitting on a pallet to pick one up. It's hard to compression test it. Rebuilding isn't an option as im not willing to toss a $1000 motor in a $2000 vehicle. Maybe I'd get 4 when I was done with it, but, doubtful.

Too bad I already cut the fendor to fit my nice new winch bumper on it.
 
I'm amassing quite the spare parts collection over here. If I knew enough, I'd dissassemble this short block, clean it up, and check it. I have the knowledge to take it all apart, but, checking and reassembling not so much.

It seems silly to go that far for just rings. A full rebuild seems in order. Even if I do it myself, would need a machine labor. And I'd put a new head on it.

http://imgur.com/a/V8wP3
 
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