NON disco dana 30 axle question

[cal]

Coo. Post back and let us know if the new seals fixes it or not.

 

[markaboo929]

absolutely.plus i now confirmed that the knuckles are interchangeable.I have herd of it an searched for the answer,now i know it is possible.incase anybody else wonders about it.One thing werth mentioning is that the earlier knuckles actually have inserts in the bottom where the balljoint sits that rotates to adjust camber ,illiminating the need to get offset ball joints.you are just limmited to 90 and down rotors and calipers and pads.i dont see it werth going to 91 up set up just cause there are more options for pads.I did use 2004 wj brake booster and master on my 88 . it stops way better than it ever does now.with 33's on it.I will post on this as soon as i change the seals this weekend and wheel it at Uwharrie.THANKS ever so much for the input cal.........

 

[cal]

Incorrect. You can run any year rotor as long as you run the same year unit bearing. When I ran '87 knuckles, I had 2000 unit bearings and rotors on them.

And that insert was part of a previously installed balljoint I think, I've had 5-6 sets of 87-90 knuckles that did not have that.

 

[87manche]

OK, to shed some light on the knuckle situation.
as long as your calipers match the knuckle, and your bearings match the rotr it will work.
For instance.
I have a 97 housing, with 87 knuckles and calipers, but 97 unit bearings and rotors. It all works.

About the inserts:
the early knuckles had them, but they were not adjustable from the factory. They're a PITA to deal with and usually have to be cut out. They take an odd looking socket to unscrew them from the knuckle, like a spindle socket.
Adjustable inserts are available, they're in my D30 right now. The inserts are cheaper than adjustable balljoints, and you can use the regular balljoints.

 

[markaboo929]

ok I got it now ,just match rotors to bearings,and match calipers and brackets with pads.2 seperate matches.As for the inserts,mine are all good to go took it apart and cleaned it plus used 3m copper anti sieze on them.My original 88 was from FL so no rust rot issues.I do own the socket for adjusting them.Snap-On.

 

[Goatman]

what i have is a 95 housing 97 tj shafts.everything else is 88,knuckles,bearings,calipers,rotor,pads.

What you have should work. All the axles are the same length. All the knuckles are interchangeable. The only things that aren't interchangeable are early and late model unit bearings, one is slightly thicker than the other. If you bolt up the wrong combination, the rotor will bind against the caliper and you'll immediately know you have a problem.

Just like you already know, the only reason it would leak is because of bad inner axle seals. However, it is very possible that you're D30 housing is slightly bent, especially if you say the axles don't center properly in the outer axle seals. This could also help the inner seals to leak if they are weak already. I wouldn't think that they would leak simply because the housing is slightly bent, I've seen plenty of slightly bent housings that don't have leaky seals.

As far as the shafts moving in and out slightly, don't know exactly what you mean. The u-joints do move in a slight eliptical motion which could cause a slight movement in the shafts if you're looking at it very closely.

 

[RobertF]

The insert (split ring seat) in the bottom of your 88 knuckle can be adjusted to center your axle shaft to the center of the axle tube. New ball joints come with centered inserts, offset ones can be got to change caster or camber depending where you turn them. But all of them can be screwed up or down in the knuckle to center the axle to tube. Stock depth is .206" (5.23mm) measured from the edge of the outside of the knuckle where the ball joint nut sits, to the top of the "castle" of the insert (from the factory manual). All of my old axles I've had to modify that measurement to have my axle centered in the tube. Over tightening the ball joint pulls the taper down further in the split ring resulting in the high off-centered axle. The later non-insert knuckles bottom ball joint can be tightened more with out raising the knuckle alignment, but the insert style once distorted, from over tightening, I replace the insert to get the knuckle back in adjustable range.
Hope this helps.

 

[markaboo929]

OK so in otherwords the inserts really need to be at near the bottom of the knuckle closer to the nut end-not the balljoint end-ahh i just may have found the problem then.Thaxs soo much for that info I never realized it was critical.I will be checking it after werk tommorow.And i will try to get it to the spec you mentioned-correct me if im wrong you do mean the "top" of the inserts like if you were looking at a castle- the very top part. __---__ where the 3 top lines are.

 

[markaboo929]

so in reality i should loosen the top balljoint nut,then remove the bottom one and turn the insert on the bottom one to see where the knuckle moves-up or down,and then tighten the bottom one to specs and then tighten the top one to specs?in that order.

 

[RobertF]

I have adjusted this with the axle fully assembled.
You leave the top ball joint tight. I don't know why they call it a ball joint, it's a shaft and bushing really. You can pull the shaft in and out of the outer housing of the upper "ball joint", it turns, but doesn't flop around like a real ball joint. I'd call it more of a "unit kingpin".
Now the bottom ball joint IS a ball joint.
With the axle on a jack stand, wheel off (I can't remember if you have to take the caliper and disk off or not, you'll be able to tell if you need to for clearance) loosen the bottom ball joint nut a couple of turns but don't take it off, drive the knuckle down to pop the stud out of the taper. The nut will stop the assembly from dropping too far and over extending the upper "ball joint".
Now remove the bottom nut and reach up inside the knuckle with the special "castle socket" to adjust the "split ring seat" to center your axle.
It's all upside down, you screw it up to lower the knuckle.
Do it in steps, adjust it a little, put the nut on and torque it, visually check the center of your axle in the outer tube end, if not centered keep repeating these steps untill it is.
If the "split ring seat" is protruding out of the knuckle to get your axle centered, it is distorted beyond use (usually over tightened, or rusted away) and must be replaced, it must be fully contained within the knuckle. You can get them through NAPA (for some reason listed under D44) or Specialty Products in Cololado (alignment parts)
Good luck, it may take a couple times, but there's satisfaction in a job done right!

 

[markaboo929]

ahh ok now i see.ya know about 5 years ago when i did my alignment I thought the upper ones were bad an didnt have the coin to change them .So when i took my knuckles off to put them on the 95 housing i thought that my upper ball joint was bad casue it moved in and out.on the 88 housing that is,and the 95 ones didnt move in an out ,hhhmmmmmm.............I am going to do what you sugested today an re post my results here for any one else that has this style knuckle can be made aware that if the swap a 88 dico axle fer a non disco axle in the upper 90's years they may need to do this as well.now i wonder if there is a year diffenence in the upper "ball joint" as well ill check into it.......:wave: thank you ever so much again..........

 

[87manche]

I have adjusted this with the axle fully assembled.
You leave the top ball joint tight. I don't know why they call it a ball joint, it's a shaft and bushing really. You can pull the shaft in and out of the outer housing of the upper "ball joint", it turns, but doesn't flop around like a real ball joint. I'd call it more of a "unit kingpin".
Now the bottom ball joint IS a ball joint.
With the axle on a jack stand, wheel off (I can't remember if you have to take the caliper and disk off or not, you'll be able to tell if you need to for clearance) loosen the bottom ball joint nut a couple of turns but don't take it off, drive the knuckle down to pop the stud out of the taper. The nut will stop the assembly from dropping too far and over extending the upper "ball joint".
Now remove the bottom nut and reach up inside the knuckle with the special "castle socket" to adjust the "split ring seat" to center your axle.
It's all upside down, you screw it up to lower the knuckle.
Do it in steps, adjust it a little, put the nut on and torque it, visually check the center of your axle in the outer tube end, if not centered keep repeating these steps untill it is.
If the "split ring seat" is protruding out of the knuckle to get your axle centered, it is distorted beyond use (usually over tightened, or rusted away) and must be replaced, it must be fully contained within the knuckle. You can get them through NAPA (for some reason listed under D44) or Specialty Products in Cololado (alignment parts)
Good luck, it may take a couple times, but there's satisfaction in a job done right!

absolutely brilliant information regarding that seat.
I didn't realize it could be adjusted like that.

 

[markaboo929]

YUP absolutely!!!!! I second that one,guess what It did the trick they are now centered up and down PLUS centered left and right!!!!!! It did take about 5 tries each wheel to get it right,dialing it closer a tiny bit at a time.I do have excentric inserts from the last time i did the alignment-ahh bout 4 years ago!!!!! but never had an issue with leaks on the 88 housing,HELL i never even LOOKED at it to see if it was off.Ehh i can blame that one on not haveing greaseable tube seals!!!!! GREAT info,I cant thank you enough for letting "us" know that it does matter where the inserts sit in the knuckle.Next thing is to wheel it and leave it parked in a poser shot with the drivers side up for a while and then look fer leaks.:lecture: :worship: ::==RULES!!!

 

[RobertF]

Good to hear of results!
It may take a while to drain acumulated oil from the housing tubes,
but with centered shafts running true the seals have a better chance of doing their job, not to mention wear and tear on the axle/carrier splines!
If you had a lunch box locker, this can make all the difference of it working smoothly or not. Ask me how I know!

 

[markaboo929]

WELL here's the results(as expected) NO LEAKS!!! -yet-I have only had this axle in fer bout a month now- only bout 500 miles or so- only wheeled 3 times- very slight-probably didnt even need to use 4x4.but hey after 2 years of it being inop-gotta try it.Except this time i went into the Uwharrie trails here in NC,NO leaks,yeah i was curius how the spider gears held up-they should be fine........OH wait a minute now i know i NEED a locker in the front now!!!!at least an aussie locker or simular to get rid of the spider gears!!!! plus i allready have new seals to go in ......hell just gotta convince the misses my excuse is legit..is'nt it???:gag: Praise again Robert F:worship: