Marshmallows Anyone?

[JKTXJ]

Planning an XJ fire, bring stuff for smores!

I have had nothing but trouble with DW for the past few months and I've had it. This is the last straw, tomorrows work fixes it or it's gonna have a bad accident with a can of gasoline. Here's my sad story;

Have had a minor wobble for awhile now but only at 45MPH and I could drive through it by accelerating or else stop it by tapping the brake real quick... nothing major. Then things took a turn for the worse and it's been gradually getting worse. OK, here's what been done.
*Tires balanced
*Tires rotated
*New ends on tie rod
*New drag link and end at pitman arm
*New control arm bushings
*New superflex joints
*All bolts tight as hell
*Steering box seems OK
*No cracks near steering box (anymore.. welded and reinforced with C-rok inner and outer plates
*LCA and UCA mounts at unibody are solid
*LCA mounts on axle are Currie HD with skids, no probs there
*Ball joints checked, OK
*Hub bearing units checked, OK
*More air in tires (from 22 to 27, made it worse)
*Tried toe at 0 and 1/8" in
*Caster
-OK, here's where it gets fun. I have made shims and adjusted my uppers so many times that I never care to take a control arm off again. Tried less caster by taking all shims out from LCAs- little bit of wobble but dead feeling steering and no return to center. Tried more positive caster than what I had originally by adding original shims on LCA's plus another 1/8"- made worse than when I started. Went back to less positive caster by adjusting out my uppers a ways. Seemed OK aside from the dead steering, but no wobble. Then today on the freeway it hit. I had to stop in the middle off the freeway because it would not turn or stop wobbling, it was SEVERE :explosion So now I have what appears to be unpredictable hellacious DW! OK, back to the garage, going for lots of positive caster. Problem now is I can't get the first UCA back on. That axle won't pivot for nothing and I'll have to pick up a come along tomorrow (and new UCA bolt since I trashed the threads getting it out). All my tricks for getting the axle to move are not getting ot done today, WTF? Anyhow, better get t fixed tomorrow cause I am driving to Fall Fling in a few days. Maybe I will throw the Jeep in for the raffle party1:

Ideas anyne? Will tons of positive caster help this?

 

[jmsull]

Have you considered getting a HD trackbar with HD frame mount?

 

[xjj33p3r]

Get a new steering stabilizer, and just take it to a professional shop for them to figure out what the deal is. I never figured out what was wrong with mine, but I took it to a shop, they replaced everything, and it was all gone, and still is. And yes, a hd tracbar, and tracbar mount will help as well.

 

[JKTXJ]

Forgot to mention that I checked the stabilizer and it seems fine. I pulled it off, stuck it in a vise and cycled in both directions. Also running a RE HD tracbar and bracket and the tracbar has new superflex joint and bushing.

 

[JKTXJ]

My trac bar bolt hole at the axle is slightly wallowed out (very slightly) so I am gonna weld a piece of flat bar over it with a perfect size hole drilled in it. Doubt this is gonna fix it, but I'll try anything at this point. I am really hating DW lately.

 

[jonboy]

What's your caster at now? If you don't know, GoJeep has a good writeup on his site here http://www.go.jeep-xj.info/HowtoAlignment.htm on how to quickly check caster angle on a HP Dana 30 with a protractor and level.

OEM spec is 7* to 8*. With a 6" lift and drop brackets, mine drives good at 4* to 5*, measured using gojeep's method.

As for the trackbar, you might want to check out jeepin.com, Jason just posted a "how to" on fixing a worn track bar hole on the axle mount.

 

[JKTXJ]

It's been everywhere between ~1 and 7 so far, going for 8, 9 or beyond tomorrow. What gets me is my caster had not changed on it's own, however, DW stopped in for a visit anyway. This problem always creeps up out of the blue (usually before a long trip like Fall Fling) and takes forever to get rid of. Did I mention that I hate DW? Hasta

 

[xjaddiction]

You Want it fixed?

Call RE and order some drop brackets for the LCA's and UCA's with the reinforcement bracket. or GET SOME LONG ARMS.

I was at the same point years ago, and had some overnighted for $80 bucks in shipping costs, with the $350 cost for brackets and supports. IT WAS WELL WORTH IT!! BYE, BYE DW.

As the XJ wheeled after getting the drop brackets from RE, loose track-bar, out of balance tires, bad allignment, bad steering stabilizer... NON OF THESE EVER ALLOWED THE XJ TO DW AGIAIN. GET THE BRACKETS!! I could beat the hell out of it on the weekend, drive it back home at 70mph, and drive to work without the dread of DW. I hate that little wobble that comes with a bump in the road. Just like the XJ is telling you at any minute, your going to have some out-of-control DW. That will be gone with the brackets. hasta

 

[JKTXJ]

*Swapped stabilizer- didn't help
*Welded flat bar over my axle end track bar mount with a new snug hole plus tightened up the superflex joint on trac bar-didn't help
*Put golf balls in the tires- made things worse!
*Found slight play in ball joints when using a piece of steel tube under the tire to move it up and down- will change those out I suppose
*Slight movement of the sector shaft in the steering box. Enough to cause DW???

Getting real close to having a bon fire! :explosion

 

[Dingo509]

ANY slop at all in ANY part of the front suspension/steering can add to the DW problem. you said you have a RD HD trackbar and bracket. Do you have the brace that acrossed to the other side of the frame? If not have you checked the bolts that go straight up?

I had DW bad ended up being the RE HD bracket bolt were not tight.

If you have wear in the sector shaft that could cause it.

What kind of lift do have on it and what do you're trackbar and steering angles look like? DW is usually started by the angle being way off starting the axle and the steering swinging in 2 different arcs. The slop in the system lets this grow into DW.

If you get to piont of burning it down, let me know and i'll come get it first.


Dingo

 

[JKTXJ]

I'm about 5.5" inches of lift right now so the angles are steep but acceptable. Been running it this way for some time now without bad DW like this. As for the trac bar bracket, it is tight but we are gonna also lay some welds on it tonight just for kicks.. Now for today's update;

Took it in to the professionals to look at (and to pull the golf balls out) They balanced the front tires, one of which now has about 3 lbs of weight on it! It has weights on both sides, plus "stick on" weights on the front (in addition to edge weights) which looks real good :shocked: They checked ball joints and said they weren't perfect, but did not need replacing and wouldn't cause the wobble. They checked the steering box.. again, has slight play in the sector shaft but they felt it did not need replaced and was not causing any wobble. Noted the drag link end (non replaceable side) was slightly worn, will replace that (it's not very old and the other end is brand new). Aside from that, they could find nothing wrong other than my MTRs don't like to balance for crap. Anyway, drives OK now but still has shimmy between 37 and 45 that has not turned to DW yet (only drove 10 miles thus far). Will test it out on my way home, hope I live to post again.

 

[Dingo509]

They checked ball joints and said they weren't perfect, but did not need replacing and wouldn't cause the wobble. They checked the steering box.. again, has slight play in the sector shaft but they felt it did not need replaced and was not causing any wobble.

ANY slop at all in ANY part of the front suspension/steering can add to the DW problem.

Dingo

Not trying to be an ass but at this point obviously they don't know what's going to fix it so i would replace ANYTHING with NOTICABLE wear. you've already thrown a ton of money at it, what's a little more to beat this.

I would also swap on some less aggressive tire for the mean time too. I have never heard of 32" tires of any type requiring 3# of weight to balance. I have 33" swampers on beadlock and they all require less than 10 OZ. to balance.

If all else fails try a different shop.

Dingo

 

[Dirt]

Get a new steering stabilizer, and just take it to a professional shop for them to figure out what the deal is. I never figured out what was wrong with mine, but I took it to a shop, they replaced everything, and it was all gone, and still is.

uh uh don't do this....





Long arms are you friend. Drop brackets are your friend also.

Heed this advice and the death wobble monkey will be off your xj's back forever. Then you will be like me, and laugh at these threads. Did you notice my tag by the avatar?

 

[RobertF]

I had a DW in one of my XJ's with every thing new in the front end. It had the slightest bit of play in the steering box. Popped the drag link off the pitman arm, took the horn button off so I could put a socket with an inch pound dial torque wrench (used for setting rolling torque on diff bearings) and set the rolling torque past the center "tight spot" to 15 inch/lbs using the sector adjustment bolt/locknut. No more DW, no more shimmy after a bump, steers like a sports car again.
The FSM calls for setting the box up on the bench at 8 inch/lbs of rolling torque on the steering shaft with the sector backed off, and then adjust sector to not more than 18 inch/lbs combined total rolling torque past the "tight spot". I figure with the drag of the steering shaft, and power steering fluid, as long as I don't exceed these specs I'm not over tightening the box doing an "in car adjustment"
Also, make sure the steering box is centered on the "tight spot" when your wheels are going straight ahead. Had to re-position the steering wheel on it's splines to the center of the "tight spot" and adjust the drag link accordingly after a "Professional Shop" aligned a friends new lift and he had DW that it didn't have on the way to the "alignment".

 

[Weasel]

uh uh don't do this....

Long arms are you friend. Drop brackets are your friend also.

Heed this advice and the death wobble monkey will be off your xj's back forever. Then you will be like me, and laugh at these threads. Did you notice my tag by the avatar?

Don't replace everything, but thats what you did? DW is not suspension geometry related, it's something giving off harmonics/vibration causing an unstable system.

 

[Lincoln]

MTR's don't require weights.

BTW, no more shakes. It just needed beer and smokes.

 

[JKTXJ]

Damn Lincoln, you're fast! As he said, wobble appears to be gone. We checked the front axle to a fixed point on the rear of the unibody and also rear axle rather than measuring from Axle to control arm mount. Turns out the two sides of the Jeep are not the same length (surprise) and needed different amount of shimming. Then we popped out the rubber LCA mounts and threw in RE's new 3 piece design. Drives like a champ now. Tomorrow morning it gets the freeway test and Saturday it gets the 600 mile Moab test :clap: Picking up some ball joints for the road and also a used steering box, just in case!

arty:

 

[ECKSJAY]

BTW, no more shakes. It just needed beer and smokes.

There it is.

 

[JKTXJ]

MTR's don't require weights.

BTW, no more shakes. It just needed beer and smokes.

BTW, has weights on the backside too!

 

[Lincoln]

I'm still trying to figure out why I was working on your shit so you could go to Moab.

Have fun.