rkates
NAXJA Forum User
- Location
- indianapolis in
As of January 1st Redbird is known as a multi-use park. Dnr had a meeting about it last night, a group of us from IndyORV went out there to see what was going on. This is one of the guys from our group that commented on our sight. I'll just copy n paste so you can see
Well the hour is late, the night is slow, and no one else has posted about the meeting yet so here's a quick recap with an obligatory disclaimer stating the opinions expressed herein should in no way be interpreted as the opinions of IndyORV or INDNR, but rather my current thoughts based on what I heard tonight as well as previous history. I’m sure my opinion will continue to evolve as I learn more about the matter.
As of 1-1-11 Redbird was deemed a multi-use recreational facility by the current Indiana Department of Natural Resources management team. This was apparently a pretty low-key and not much publicized shift in direction to the general public, but has obviously been in the works for quite some time. While the anti-establishment side of me quite enjoyed the low profile good ole boy getaway character of the place in the past, another part of me believes this change will be beneficial to Redbird, its users, and Indiana in the long run. The reason I say this is because last year Redbird took in about $28,000 in admission fees which equates to 2,800 paid admissions, and that kind of money isn’t even enough to shut the place down much less keep it open. A wider user base is needed to either possibly generate maintenance revenues or at least justify tax dollar expenditures there. Therefore Redbird will soon cater to entertainment and adventure for not only ORV’s but also hikers, bikers, campers, fishermen, birdwatchers, equestrians and whatever other outdoor interests might befit the property.
The stated purpose for tonight’s meeting was to seek input from current park users on how best to proceed, though based on the amount of thought and planning already put into the matter, I couldn’t help but feel the meeting was more about selling the idea to the ORV crowd and gaining their support for the concept rather than resistance to it. Ideas were solicited, gathered, and voted on. There was definitely some steering of attendee independent thought processes by those conducting the meeting, but I guess that’s what project management is all about.
Reasons given for the need of evolution include but are not limited to the following:
1) The need to open a state asset to use by a larger percentage of the state population.
2) The desire to be an asset rather than burden to local residents and nearby towns. This was not so much stated as something I read between some lines.
3) The need to address serious environmental issues stemming from this and other surrounding properties. This is largely a pre-existing condition remaining from the coal mining that took place there but is greatly exasperated by off-road vehicle traffic breaking through the minimal containments that have been previously enacted.
4) The fact that the property is divided by the railway and county road running through it, with the entrance gate being on the substantially smaller part, and access to the larger area requiring illegally crossing the railroad tracks at spots other than designated crossings or traversing a county road in vehicles not legal for on-road use or by drivers under the age of legal driving. My understanding is that the railroad is unwilling to accept any additional costs, liabilities, or inconvenience to accommodate the SRA. There is also a small 45 acre parcel south of the county road containing ATV and dirt bike trails with similar legal accessibility issues.
Possible relocation of the main entrance to better facilitate overall park access was discussed along with the possibility of dual entrances, though the latter wasn’t deemed likely due to staffing requirements. Based on conceptual drawings presented, it doesn’t appear at this time that there’s any plan to eliminate or convert any of the existing ORV trails to any other usage. The major renovations noted on the conceptual drawings included a proposed fishing lake, a camping area with showers, as well as hiking, biking, and horseback trails in areas of the SRA we were previously not allowed access to on the far or north side of the power lines. There were some additional ORV trails added in the concept drawings, though a bicycle path was also noted through the center of the new ORV trails. Also included were new and additional access roads and several small parking areas to allow accessing the far reaches without traversing the park. Restrooms and shelter houses throughout the park were also alluded to. The maps and conceptual drawings did bring a better understanding of the size and scale of the property to my mind and the realization that currently only about half is being utilized. I haven’t had time yet to do a topographical analysis of the “new” northern area but my current understanding is that the terrain is for the most part smoother there, thus no new incredibly awesome jeep trails are expected. Perhaps Redbird could use some trails for the lesser modified vehicles crowd.
The strongest opinion expressed by the ORV participants present was for separation of ORV’s from the non-motorized vehicle users, not only on the trails but in parking areas as well for the sake of a peaceful coexistence. There were some sad stories and concerns shared around by some of the old timers who had been through similar situations before and ended up pushed out of places that had been solely theirs to use after they agreed to share with other users. This is indeed a risk, however I believe the final outcome depends on those entrusted to manage the project and property. As a lifelong resident of Indiana, besides being an off-roader I’m also an avid outdoorsman, hunter, boater, fisherman, hiker, and camper who has looked up to and trusted the Indiana DNR despite a bit of a mistrust of government in general. I hope they don’t let me down on this one. I’m interested in hearing anyone else’s thoughts and opinions.
Well the hour is late, the night is slow, and no one else has posted about the meeting yet so here's a quick recap with an obligatory disclaimer stating the opinions expressed herein should in no way be interpreted as the opinions of IndyORV or INDNR, but rather my current thoughts based on what I heard tonight as well as previous history. I’m sure my opinion will continue to evolve as I learn more about the matter.
As of 1-1-11 Redbird was deemed a multi-use recreational facility by the current Indiana Department of Natural Resources management team. This was apparently a pretty low-key and not much publicized shift in direction to the general public, but has obviously been in the works for quite some time. While the anti-establishment side of me quite enjoyed the low profile good ole boy getaway character of the place in the past, another part of me believes this change will be beneficial to Redbird, its users, and Indiana in the long run. The reason I say this is because last year Redbird took in about $28,000 in admission fees which equates to 2,800 paid admissions, and that kind of money isn’t even enough to shut the place down much less keep it open. A wider user base is needed to either possibly generate maintenance revenues or at least justify tax dollar expenditures there. Therefore Redbird will soon cater to entertainment and adventure for not only ORV’s but also hikers, bikers, campers, fishermen, birdwatchers, equestrians and whatever other outdoor interests might befit the property.
The stated purpose for tonight’s meeting was to seek input from current park users on how best to proceed, though based on the amount of thought and planning already put into the matter, I couldn’t help but feel the meeting was more about selling the idea to the ORV crowd and gaining their support for the concept rather than resistance to it. Ideas were solicited, gathered, and voted on. There was definitely some steering of attendee independent thought processes by those conducting the meeting, but I guess that’s what project management is all about.
Reasons given for the need of evolution include but are not limited to the following:
1) The need to open a state asset to use by a larger percentage of the state population.
2) The desire to be an asset rather than burden to local residents and nearby towns. This was not so much stated as something I read between some lines.
3) The need to address serious environmental issues stemming from this and other surrounding properties. This is largely a pre-existing condition remaining from the coal mining that took place there but is greatly exasperated by off-road vehicle traffic breaking through the minimal containments that have been previously enacted.
4) The fact that the property is divided by the railway and county road running through it, with the entrance gate being on the substantially smaller part, and access to the larger area requiring illegally crossing the railroad tracks at spots other than designated crossings or traversing a county road in vehicles not legal for on-road use or by drivers under the age of legal driving. My understanding is that the railroad is unwilling to accept any additional costs, liabilities, or inconvenience to accommodate the SRA. There is also a small 45 acre parcel south of the county road containing ATV and dirt bike trails with similar legal accessibility issues.
Possible relocation of the main entrance to better facilitate overall park access was discussed along with the possibility of dual entrances, though the latter wasn’t deemed likely due to staffing requirements. Based on conceptual drawings presented, it doesn’t appear at this time that there’s any plan to eliminate or convert any of the existing ORV trails to any other usage. The major renovations noted on the conceptual drawings included a proposed fishing lake, a camping area with showers, as well as hiking, biking, and horseback trails in areas of the SRA we were previously not allowed access to on the far or north side of the power lines. There were some additional ORV trails added in the concept drawings, though a bicycle path was also noted through the center of the new ORV trails. Also included were new and additional access roads and several small parking areas to allow accessing the far reaches without traversing the park. Restrooms and shelter houses throughout the park were also alluded to. The maps and conceptual drawings did bring a better understanding of the size and scale of the property to my mind and the realization that currently only about half is being utilized. I haven’t had time yet to do a topographical analysis of the “new” northern area but my current understanding is that the terrain is for the most part smoother there, thus no new incredibly awesome jeep trails are expected. Perhaps Redbird could use some trails for the lesser modified vehicles crowd.
The strongest opinion expressed by the ORV participants present was for separation of ORV’s from the non-motorized vehicle users, not only on the trails but in parking areas as well for the sake of a peaceful coexistence. There were some sad stories and concerns shared around by some of the old timers who had been through similar situations before and ended up pushed out of places that had been solely theirs to use after they agreed to share with other users. This is indeed a risk, however I believe the final outcome depends on those entrusted to manage the project and property. As a lifelong resident of Indiana, besides being an off-roader I’m also an avid outdoorsman, hunter, boater, fisherman, hiker, and camper who has looked up to and trusted the Indiana DNR despite a bit of a mistrust of government in general. I hope they don’t let me down on this one. I’m interested in hearing anyone else’s thoughts and opinions.
