Wandering Jeep

Hey guys, I need some input. 93 cherokee sport, 4.0, auto, 231, 4" lift. It all seem to have started when I put some winter tires on this thing. I went from 31/10.50/15 MTR Kevlar to Cooper M/S 265/70/15. There are definitely lighter, and this is only temporary until the winter season is gone, yes I do know they are smaller than the 31's.

They seem to follow the grooves fairly persistently, its like I have no control of the vehicle. I replaced the tie rods because of some movement, I actually upgraded to the ZJ tie rod. It seemed to have made the wandering worse. I adjusted the toe, and everything is tight. So I figured the caster was off, I set it to 5°, rechecked the toe. That seemed to have made it better, until I decided to drive it more. On my way home I was white knuckling it on the highway, no fun to drive it anymore. Ball joints have no movement, trackbar ha no movement, and frame doesn't seemed cracked nor is there movement on the gear box.

Here is what I noticed after everything, I seem to have a lot of wiggle in the steering, I am going around a corner and then it seems to almost want to straighten out or go straight even though the wheel is still turned. Like a dead spot when turning. I was at home this morning, I probably have about 6" or more of wiggle before it seems to move the tires. I adjusted the steering box to reduce the wiggle, but doing so now it just feels dangerous to drive it, will not stay straight no matter what I do.

Before I get a new steering box, since I feel this is my last resort, wanted some opinions before dropping that much coin to only have the same issue. I have searched all over the place, which makes me to believe its the box.

I once had the Pitman arm try to come off the steering box an a Chevy truck. All of a sudden it started wandering, and the steering wheel felt unresponsive. Got it home, and noticed that the nut had loosened, and was hanging on by about one turn. And the Pitman arm was loosely laying on top of the nut. So much for a Pitman arm puller...

Take a look there. Also, inspect the ends of the control arms, especially the bushings. You don't mention that they've been replaced, and anything over a couple of inches on stock control arms could be stressful to soft bits. You mention adjusting the steering box. There's not much there to adjust, and if the box itself is shot, well, it's the single most expensive piece on the front end. Here's hoping you find something easier and cheaper to fix.

I did totally forget to mention that, I have adjustable uppers and lowers, johnny joints on the lowers, poly bushings on the ends of those. Bought those maybe a 1 1/2 ago, the bushings axle side were replaced about 6 months ago. Also adjustable trackbar in the same time frame.

The way the steering feels, its like the toe is set out. The jeep wonders one way, grooves in the road, lines, the paint lines. I go to correct it and it seems to be an extreme change, now it goes the other sometimes severely. It just feels unsafe driving the vehicle. Ill go double check the joints and the alignment. Im gonna recheck the caster, Im wondering if the reading from the ball joint is just not good enough. I may have to just hve to take it to an alignment shop to check out my numbers.

If you're not sure or able to check the front end, sounds like it's time for an alignment. Typically, if there's something wrong, they'll tell you, and if they can't align it, they may not charge anything, or possibly just a nominal fee.

Usually an assistant sawing the steering wheel back and forth (only an inch or two each side of center, with wheels on the ground, with the engine running for PS boost) while you watch/feel/listen will reveal any spent bushings, tie rod ends or ball joints. I like to slip on a nitrile glove and grip the joints as my assistant (usually my son, he knows the drill) rocks the wheel. With so much slop at the wheel, start by watching the slip joint in the collapsible steering column. It wouldn't be the first one I've seen go bad.

The steering shaft was actually the main thing I was focused on when I first got everything back together, cause it was about the same issue when I first got this jeep. I replaced it with a known good one form the parts jeep I had. I had someone move the steering back and forth last night, everything is tight that way.

Today I am going to check the caster again, father has some alignment tools from the golden era, he has aligned many vehicles with them. Gonna also check how much play with the tires off the ground, I only checked at 6 and 12, never did the 3 and 9 positions. Maybe Ill take the drag link off and check the pitman arm to see if there is any play. If that all fails, alignment it is.

Does it do it with both sets of tires? Put the other tires back on & see if it still does it.

Kenny, that was my initial thought cause with the 31's it did it but was barely noticeable as with the tires I have on now. I do know there is a huge weight difference between the two, 31's being heavier.

I did however made some good headway today. I went back through used the alignment tools my father had, and it said my caster was at 3.5°, not at the 5° previous stated. I did get it to just above 4.5°, drove it and all feels better. Doesn't seem to wander, at least its tolerable and wanders very little, no bump steer, don't have vibes that I can tell, and not a death trap anymore. I still have quite a bit of play, maybe 2"-3", but if I put the steering box any tighter, it doesn't feel right. I think I can live with it, for now.

Well good that you got it a little better. My truck did the same thing, the wonder almost like you described it. Turned out the tires had seperated. I put a new set of BFG and it drove fine.

My father and I were talking last night, he was also saying about the same thing. He also stated since the tires were not new, its possible they could have been installed backwards. They stayed on the other vehicle in one directions, now they are on mine going the opposite direction, possible the belts could just have gotten use to it one way. I have had used tires before, just never dealt with this before.

I did drive it around and all seems good, I just hope I have it set up so vibrations are not that bad. I got it up to 45mph, didn't feel anything, maybe thats a good sign. Ill see how it goes at 50+

Back in the '70s, when radial tires became popular, there was the thought that whichever direction a tire 'broke-in' rolling, it should remain that way. The rotation patterns back then suggested that when rotating tires, just go front to back, not side to side. I've always used the front to back, and have never had the symptoms you've described in this thread, at least not caused by tires not behaving...

Had the same kind of issues when I bought my 92. Had play in steering and it wandered a little with stock tires. Went to 31's and it got worse. Looked for a long time (about a year) and couldnt find anything until a friend decided we were gonna take the afternoon and go back over everything. He borrowed the jeep on many occasions and expressed his concern about all the play. Ended up being the joint at the top of the steering shaft where its connected to the column. Welded the two pieces together and all the play went away. Kinda hard to explain and I dont have a picture of it. No, I didnt weld the ujoint, that would be insane.

Wiggleworm, yeah I know exactly what you are talking about. When I first got this Jeep, it had a severe steering issue. The first time I noticed it was doing a long curve on the highway at probably 65mph, everything was fine then all of a sudden steering wheel stay with the turn, but the tires had a different plan, they went straight. I think I had to go home and change my shorts, damn near took out another vehicle. That night when I got home, I switch out the steering shaft, problem went away. Apparently they have a plastic piece in that area you welded, its supposed to absorb road feel, I think its a death trap waiting to happen. I can tell you that is not the issue, I can see the play in the steering box when I turn the wheel. It moves with the wheel. But when or if I do have that issue again, definitely welding it.

Heyhar, that is the exact conversation I had with the old man. Im still 50/50 on whether that may be the actual issue, but it never hurts trying to move them around. I know what a separating belt feels like, can tell you thats not issue I have, but I have been wrong before. Ask my wife, LOL.

you haven't mentioned what pressure you have in the tires ... over inflated tires will cause some wandering and squirrely steering as you describe. Had set of Tires the PO had inflated to 43psi, what a ride that was until I dropped them to 30psi. Did the whole alignment thing and didn't get much for better results until I checked the pressure as a last thought.

Devil, just check psi is at 32, all 4. I drove it a little today, not vibration at 55, the wandering is definitely down, still there but waaaaayyy better. Im gonna attempt to turn the tire around when I change the oil, just for peace of mind. Almost jut want to put on mt MTR back on, they just hate the snow and ice.

The only other thing I can thing of is maybe the vehicle it was on before may of had some crazy alignment issues so it will cause the issues Im having. Had a vehicle that had a bad alignment on the rear, swapped the tire unknowing the issues, had some crazy issues with them. New tires were the only way to solve the problems. MIght just need to get new tire on the front.Ill keep everyone posted in case someone else has this issue.

My 93 jeep does the same thing. Everything is new in the front. Jks trackbar, currie steering etc. Waiting for new greasable rear spring bushings to replace all the rear bushings on the springs. Hoping this helps it. Have a little bit of wheel hop on the ugly ice on the hills so thinking the springs are moving around on the corners on the highway causing same problems.

Winter tires are made of a silica based rubber that is very soft and stays soft to a lower temprature. Down side to silica compound is exactly what u described. They feel loose and wander bad. They almost feel like driving home from wheeling andnot airing ur tires back up. If it started when the winter tires wet on and drove good with the allseasons then its the tires.

Yeah, Im starting to think its more the tires than anything else. I have heard due to the compound of the tires they like to do that, just like you said slk88xj. I am thinking about going back to my MTR's and selling the snow tires. I do not like the feeling like I cannot control the Jeep. Don't really need a cop pulling over because he thinks I am drunk when I am not. Thanks for all the help guys

One last place to check, I don't think anyone mentioned it, remove the 3 mounting bolts on the steering box and check the unibody for cracks. Also check that aluminum spacer to see if it's broken or sloppy. Might consider replacing that with a metal plate, lots of people sell that - also a steering box brace if you don't have one.

Seems like you've already been looking at the box pretty closely though so this may already have been done...

G2WANIT said:

One last place to check, I don't think anyone mentioned it, remove the 3 mounting bolts on the steering box and check the unibody for cracks. Also check that aluminum spacer to see if it's broken or sloppy. Might consider replacing that with a metal plate, lots of people sell that - also a steering box brace if you don't have one.

Seems like you've already been looking at the box pretty closely though so this may already have been done...

Click to expand...

Yeah, that was my concern when it really started to wander. I checked it but couldn't really notice without taking it completely apart. I have some 3/16 steel just dying to be modified in the aluminum spacers place. I still have a feeling the steering box needs to be replaced because of how much play it has, even after adjusting it. That will have to be down the road. Money is tight at the moment and I really don't drive it all that much. I am beginning to miss exploring, even that has to wait until the snow is gone, well for the most part.