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View Full Version : 4 Link on the front of an xj


4linkedXJ
January 22nd, 2009, 15:03
Anyone put a triangulated four link on the front of an XJ? To be able to delete the trac bar.

NW-ZJ-SCOTT
January 22nd, 2009, 15:06
i dont think you can Delete the tracbar?

jonathanc
January 22nd, 2009, 15:08
if the control arms were angled in or out, you could delete the trackbar. However, angling them would cause bind, and limit articulation severely.

Kittrell
January 22nd, 2009, 15:10
There isn't enough room.

JeepFreak21
January 22nd, 2009, 15:12
Kaczman is the only one I can think of that's successfully done it on the front of an XJ.
Billy

JeepFreak21
January 22nd, 2009, 15:13
Keep in mind that you'd have to go full hydro steering.
Billy

4linkedXJ
January 22nd, 2009, 15:43
Well I have been working on using a 4link teralflex from a wrangler and this is what I came up with.
Welder was acting up when I did those.http://i46.photobucket.com/albums/f131/noneed117/IMG_1331.jpghttp://i46.photobucket.com/albums/f131/noneed117/IMG_1333.jpghttp://i46.photobucket.com/albums/f131/noneed117/IMG_1332.jpg
http://i46.photobucket.com/albums/f131/noneed117/IMG_1334.jpg

foxwar71
January 22nd, 2009, 15:50
aside from the lengths being horrible, and the frame mounting locations being horrible, and the bump steer being horrible, ur UCA mount is u-bolted to ur axle

i think i may have to nominate this

JeepFreak21
January 22nd, 2009, 16:01
http://www.slicky.net/smilies/eek3.gif I gotta give you credit for determination!
Billy

Begster
January 22nd, 2009, 16:02
I think I may have to agree with you Ross. I saw the first picture, and was like WTF? then when I got to the picture of the UCA BOLTED onto the axle with u-bolts, I died. (Its rather surprising you haven't yet)

PLEASE TAKE THAT OFF BEFORE YOU KILL SOMEONE ELSE.

4linkedXJ
January 22nd, 2009, 16:19
I think I may have to agree with you Ross. I saw the first picture, and was like WTF? then when I got to the picture of the UCA BOLTED onto the axle with u-bolts, I died. (Its rather surprising you haven't yet)

PLEASE TAKE THAT OFF BEFORE YOU KILL SOMEONE ELSE.

Yep thats right all the lengths are horrible and itll never work. Or your wrong. It cycles very well, the bracket is from teraflex and the ubolts are just used to hold it in position for mocking up. Of coure its going to be welded it has not even left the shop yet. By the way the upper link kit is from the wrangler kit and it seems to work just fine. There is NO bind. The angles worksince we tacked everything in place and cycled it to make sure there was no bind. The king air bumps still need to be installed to bump it out before the oil pan. Along with the hydraulic steering.

But keep the questions coming and I'll answer them best I can. The kit was cycled several times before finally being installed. And the upper link brackets on the frame side clear 35s full lock up and down.

Begster
January 22nd, 2009, 16:45
Yep thats right all the lengths are horrible and itll never work. Or your wrong. It cycles very well, the bracket is from teraflex and the ubolts are just used to hold it in position for mocking up. Of coure its going to be welded it has not even left the shop yet. By the way the upper link kit is from the wrangler kit and it seems to work just fine. There is NO bind. The angles worksince we tacked everything in place and cycled it to make sure there was no bind. The king air bumps still need to be installed to bump it out before the oil pan. Along with the hydraulic steering.

But keep the questions coming and I'll answer them best I can. The kit was cycled several times before finally being installed. And the upper link brackets on the frame side clear 35s full lock up and down.
1. I didn't say anything about lengths, so I don't know what you're talking about.
2. :gag:.
3. I don't care where the brackets or upper link kit is from, or if you have bind.
4. Why did you come in here looking for information and asking if people have done a triangulated 4 link, then post up you have already done it?
5. I still don't see anywhere where you said that the u-bolts were just temporary, or that it hasn't even left the shop yet. So therefore, how were we supposed to know that,:gag:.
6. It still looks bad.

builder
January 22nd, 2009, 17:30
:eyes: Why even attempt it! do a 3 link and be done with it.

XJfire75
January 22nd, 2009, 19:04
Jus to delete the track bar!...why?

vetteboy
January 22nd, 2009, 19:46
Since this goober went and deleted his pictures, I have no idea WTF is going on here.

What's wrong, 4-link guy? Embarrassed about your setup? Leave it up here so we can learn something, or offer real suggestions.

What vendor did you go with for your hydro steering setup?

foxwar71
January 22nd, 2009, 20:19
i can still see the pics fine

why would you ever go and try and copy teraflex's design? they have to have some of the worst setups between the XJ "long arm" kit and there kits for TJ's that you've based yours on. the steering must be all sorts of wacky.

JeepFreak21
January 22nd, 2009, 20:32
i can still see the pics fine

why would you ever go and try and copy teraflex's design? they have to have some of the worst setups between the XJ "long arm" kit and there kits for TJ's that you've based yours on. the steering must be all sorts of wacky.

It's because they're cached on your computer. Rehost them for us http://www.slicky.net/smilies/biggrin.gif
Billy

foxwar71
January 22nd, 2009, 20:49
here you go, jsut so others know what not to do

http://i43.tinypic.com/rlfcyt.jpg
http://i39.tinypic.com/2n7l2k3.jpg
http://i40.tinypic.com/2lt59vl.jpg
http://i40.tinypic.com/2mmhitc.jpg

5spd_xj
January 22nd, 2009, 21:12
WOW. that's some, uh...amazing... work you've got there.

I'm with Begster 100%

JJacobs
January 22nd, 2009, 21:45
I don't really see any major problems with it. There is no inherent bind in a triangulated 4 link, no reason it can't be used in the front just as is common in the back. Suspensions like this normally don't bind much, they instead find their outlet in pinion angle change. It might do better with shorter lower links, though.

I'd probably reinforce the back of the upper arm area into the unibody more, and try to tie those points in laterally through the body. Welding the axle mount goes without saying.

Curious what the anti-dive characteristics are going to be like with the relatively short separation.

vetteboy
January 22nd, 2009, 22:46
I don't really see any major problems with it. There is no inherent bind in a triangulated 4 link, no reason it can't be used in the front just as is common in the back.

Are you kidding me?

The execution isn't bad, I'll give it that.

But god damn if you try and couple a mechanical steering linkage to a 4-link front. Physics owns you.

JeepFreak21
January 22nd, 2009, 23:07
Are you kidding me?

The execution isn't bad, I'll give it that.

But god damn if you try and couple a mechanical steering linkage to a 4-link front. Physics owns you.

To be fair. He did say the drag link is just there during the mock-up phase.
Billy

4linkedXJ
January 23rd, 2009, 06:53
Sorry for not saying that it is still being finished up. That steering was on before the 4link and so I left it on to be able to move it around the shop. It's getting either a howe setup or an agr setup. Leaning towards the Howe setup. The pinion angle change is very minimal aswell. If there was any bind then I would have found it when I cycled it when it was tack welded in. And I dont know wtf happend to my pics. Think I need to change my host.

JeepFreak21
January 23rd, 2009, 10:16
How long are the arms? Does that drivers side upper just look bent? Or maybe it's supposed to be?
Billy

XJfire75
January 23rd, 2009, 10:37
Its going to ride like butt...if it works...

4linkedXJ
January 23rd, 2009, 11:50
The left upper arm is pre bent to clear the diff upon up travel. and from just the ride in the parking lot to make algnment adjustments it rides quite nice. Unconvential yes, but it works. The lower links are from teraflexs xj longarm kit. Specs on the jeep are d44 in the rear with 4.88s and ox locker,D30 int he front with upgraded axles 488s and obviously an ox locker. 4.0 ho motor. steering box brace, arb bull bar,warn 8kwinch, kc light rack. Bumper isn't on right now. It should work quite well when done. Rear is from the rubicon express 5.5 kit. It will be running 35x12.50x17 bfg project corr tires on 17inch kmc beadlocks. Itw will also have a interior cage made out of 1.50inchx.120wall dom tubing. May get a d44 before i weld the upper lca bracket on though.

vetteboy
January 23rd, 2009, 11:55
Its going to ride like butt...if it works...

Why would you think that?

There are a ton of cars running around with rear suspensions much like this one.

JeepAddict85
January 23rd, 2009, 12:01
should be interesting to see when you are done with it. keep posting pics

4linkedXJ
January 23rd, 2009, 13:16
Pics will keep going along with the build, will probably be a month before I'm done. Have to finish the ranger I'm building aswell.
http://i46.photobucket.com/albums/f131/noneed117/IMG_1307-2.jpg
http://i46.photobucket.com/albums/f131/noneed117/DSC_00566.jpg

4linkedXJ
January 23rd, 2009, 13:18
Thanks for the input though. Alot of time was put into the setup on the front of the XJ.

Pharaoh XJ
January 23rd, 2009, 13:55
here is another example or triangulated front

the problem with this one is that both arms of the UCA are parallel ( NO TRIANGULATION HERE ) & will definitely shear the mounts off the unibody. Could have been better if the UCA mounts were outboard of the frame which would have given him more angle, but here it is anyway

http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z308/gabroxy/POST/19_326954103_0_ALB103.jpg

http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z308/gabroxy/POST/19_326954103_0_ALB106.jpg

http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z308/gabroxy/POST/19_hbone36113.jpg

http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z308/gabroxy/POST/19_hbone48116.jpg

http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z308/gabroxy/POST/3rd_link_bushing_mount2.jpg

http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z308/gabroxy/POST/DSC04169r.jpg

http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z308/gabroxy/POST/DSC04170r.jpg

http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z308/gabroxy/POST/DSC04172r.jpg

http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z308/gabroxy/POST/Dsc04156.jpg

http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z308/gabroxy/POST/Frontshot.jpg

4linkedXJ
January 23rd, 2009, 14:09
Thats the way a three link is setup. Thats a pretty intuitive design though.

JeepFreak21
January 23rd, 2009, 14:20
here is another example or triangulated front
the problem with this one is that both arms of the UCA are parallel ( NO TRIANGULATION HERE ) & will definitely shear the mounts off the unibody. Could have been better if the UCA mounts were outboard of the frame which would have given him more angle, but here it is anyway

http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z308/gabroxy/POST/19_326954103_0_ALB103.jpg

http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z308/gabroxy/POST/19_326954103_0_ALB106.jpg

http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z308/gabroxy/POST/19_hbone36113.jpg

http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z308/gabroxy/POST/19_hbone48116.jpg

http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z308/gabroxy/POST/3rd_link_bushing_mount2.jpg

http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z308/gabroxy/POST/DSC04169r.jpg

http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z308/gabroxy/POST/DSC04170r.jpg

http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z308/gabroxy/POST/DSC04172r.jpg

http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z308/gabroxy/POST/Dsc04156.jpg

http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z308/gabroxy/POST/Frontshot.jpg

You realize there are at least 3 different rigs in there, right?

Not sure what you mean by "the problem with this one is that both arms of the UCA are parallel".

If the upper mounted to the outside of the frame it would probably hit the tire when they turned.

Billy

igotanxj
January 23rd, 2009, 17:56
I've got to ask.... WHY???
The XJ already has 4 link that works perfectly fine. Whats the point of getting rid of the track bar, spending a lot of money, and complicating up your front suspension?

vetteboy
January 23rd, 2009, 18:34
I've got to ask.... WHY???

I was wondering the same thing.

bigalpha
January 24th, 2009, 09:22
Billy, I think it might be same rig .. just pictures taken at different times.

:dunno:

JeepFreak21
January 24th, 2009, 09:45
Billy, I think it might be same rig .. just pictures taken at different times.

:dunno:



The two with the "smurf blue" links are are VintageSpeed's...
http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z308/gabroxy/POST/19_326954103_0_ALB103.jpg
http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z308/gabroxy/POST/19_326954103_0_ALB106.jpg

The next two with the rolled bends are Beezil's...
http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z308/gabroxy/POST/19_hbone36113.jpg
http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z308/gabroxy/POST/19_hbone48116.jpg

I believe this one is one of WanderingWilly's revisions...
http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z308/gabroxy/POST/3rd_link_bushing_mount2.jpg

The next 4 are from 87xjco's "Xota"...
http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z308/gabroxy/POST/DSC04169r.jpg
http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z308/gabroxy/POST/DSC04170r.jpg
http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z308/gabroxy/POST/DSC04172r.jpg
http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z308/gabroxy/POST/Dsc04156.jpg

I just can't place this one at the moment.
http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z308/gabroxy/POST/Frontshot.jpg


I'm a reformed wishbone 3 link e-stalker http://www.slicky.net/smilies/biggrin.gif
Billy

bigalpha
January 24th, 2009, 09:57
lol, I stand corrected.

JeepAddict85
January 24th, 2009, 18:57
Pics will keep going along with the build, will probably be a month before I'm done. Have to finish the ranger I'm building aswell.
http://i46.photobucket.com/albums/f131/noneed117/IMG_1307-2.jpg
http://i46.photobucket.com/albums/f131/noneed117/DSC_00566.jpg

cut and turned beams? would you mind postin some info on this? sorry for the hijack.

xcm
January 25th, 2009, 03:26
'bilstein motorsports', are you working for ze germans?
also, what coilover setup are you running on the ranger?

MDR88MJ
February 22nd, 2009, 14:29
it looks like the issue would be the arms binding up with each other

i looks like they will eventualy hit each other if articulated too much

MDR88MJ
February 22nd, 2009, 14:31
oh i was looking at the first set of pics, i love the design jeepfreak

Gravesdiggerxj
February 22nd, 2009, 15:01
Interesting design.

I know there was a wishbone three link on the Xota too before it got wrecked. And Terry runs one too I think