Death Wobble at 55

yossarian19 · Oct 20, 2008

So, I had a slip-up with a block of wood and the front end of my rig. I thought I bent something in the steering linkage that caused my new deathwobble, but:
I used a level against the tie rod - it's straight as an arrow all the way around.
Checked all the joints by hand and by eyeball with engine on and wheel being turned back & forth.
Track bar feels solid - immovable - like a rock.
All wheel lugs were tight to within 5-10 ft lbs of 110 (now all exactly 110)
Toe is the same as it's ever been: 0'
The only things that have changed since it was steering properly are that I rotated tires front to back (same sides) and that I now have rear discs.
2" lift, 30s, D30 / 8.25, NP231, 1" tcase drop, AW4.
Could a tire balance issue I never noticed in the rear be causing death wobble ?

KarlVP · Oct 20, 2008

Is it death wobble or a little shimmy?

yossarian19 · Oct 20, 2008

KarlVP said:
Is it death wobble or a little shimmy?

I've never had full blown, I'm gonna lose control type death wobble. I don't know if what I've got going on qualifies as DW.
I'll say for sure that I can feel it in the seat of my pants, the car rocks side to side a little and it is very clearly not a driveline vibe - whatever is going on has enough moxie to rock the suspension. I didn't feel like my ability to steer the car or stop was seriously compromised, and nothing changed under braking until my speed dropped below 52 or so.
For experiment's sake, I pushed past 55 and it continued to worsen until I chickened out at 60.

tonexj · Oct 20, 2008

thats weird cause my death wobble happens around 20-30 and whenever i push it past 40 the rotating mass of tires just keep it straight, these are 33x12.50 tsl non-radials mind you. id go to a shop n ask if theyll test if its in balance, usually they will for free, then if their out, my local place charges 10 bucks a tire to balance, straight pocket change..

KarlVP · Oct 20, 2008

Most of the time it is a track bar issue.

If that sucker can move even 1/8 of an inch it can cause death wobble.

Start simple, balance your tires, jack the front end off the ground and try to wiggle your tires grasping them at the top and bottom and from side to side.

Once things start getting loose in the front end, it quickly adds up and death wobble can be caused by many things. Steering linkages, track bar, control arms, caster, alignment... etc.

Putting a bigger steering stablilizer on can mask the issues, but it is a band aid fix, not an actual solution. In an ideal setting, you can take the stablizer off and run without it.

Death wobble sucks. You can throw parts at your front end till the cows come home and you still may have problems.

I'd start by checking wheel balance and replacing your track bar bushing with a polyurethane one. That will cost you less than $30 and you can go from there.

krelja · Oct 20, 2008

I had a shimmy at 55 and it was a tire balance issue. When I searched around it seems like when an XJ has a tire out of balance that is the number you feel it. I shot a couple of wheel weights off on my last trip and I vibe and shimmy a bit around 75

KarlVP · Oct 20, 2008

get rid of your wheel weights.

www.innovativebalancing.com

94CountryXJ · Oct 20, 2008

I've seen those before. It's a cool idea.

KarlVP · Oct 20, 2008

94CountryXJ said:
I've seen those before. It's a cool idea.

I used thier chart and just put steel bb's in my tires.

SMOOOTH.... all the way to 70 MPH.

FiFo · Oct 20, 2008

I didn't even use the chart, just aded 1/4 of a bottle of bb's to each tire. The tires are the only thing smooth in my rig.

Crabapple · Oct 21, 2008

I had SERIOUS full blown death wobble on my way home from SC/GA 5 times last month. The final time I skidded off the road stopping inches infront of a full highway sign on I-95. The tractor trailer behind me locked up his brakes and skidded to a halt. I had just had my tires "balanced" the day before. So on the side of I-95 I rotated all 4 tires and put my 100% tread spare on the front replacing the most bald tire and it fully corrected the problem until I handed Discount Tire an asschewing back in Greensboro.

yossarian19 · Oct 21, 2008

OK - so the internal balancing thing -
My tire guy, trusted by family and friends (all SCCA racers) for decades, really good guy: he told me to forget about it before I'd even finished explaining what I was looking for.
Whats the deal there?
In any case, I'm going to the shop tomorrow AM to get tires looked at and balanced. Whats the down side to internal balancing medium?
Also - I couldn't move the track bar by hand at all. Or anything else except the tie rid, which flexed because it is stock and girly.

KarlVP · Oct 21, 2008

I don't know what your tire guy is talking about. He needs to research the technology.

I've been running BB's in the tires for a few years now with zero issues.

The benefit is there are no longer wheel weights to knock off when wheeling.

Everyone I know that has switched to dynamic balancing swears by it.

fyrfytr1717 · Oct 21, 2008

KarlVP said:
I used thier chart and just put steel bb's in my tires.

SMOOOTH.... all the way to 70 MPH.

I thought plastic Airsoft BB's were the normal work around. Don't you have issues with the steel BB's rusting?

ColoradoRaptor · Oct 21, 2008

yossarian19 said:
OK - so the internal balancing thing -
My tire guy, trusted by family and friends (all SCCA racers) for decades, really good guy: he told me to forget about it before I'd even finished explaining what I was looking for.
Whats the deal there?
In any case, I'm going to the shop tomorrow AM to get tires looked at and balanced. Whats the down side to internal balancing medium?
Also - I couldn't move the track bar by hand at all. Or anything else except the tie rid, which flexed because it is stock and girly.

He does not know crap!! Internal balancing works great, several of my club members do it including myself!!

NorCalChris · Oct 21, 2008

with this internal balancing, how fast can u go?...i heard one member mention there smooth up to 70 mph.
whats better, plastic or steel. how do u get the tire shop to install them?..do you just do it yourself.

ColoradoRaptor · Oct 21, 2008

norcalchris said:
with this internal balancing, how fast can u go?...i heard one member mention there smooth up to 70 mph.
whats better, plastic or steel. how do u get the tire shop to install them?..do you just do it yourself.

As fast as you can get that damn thing going!!!! There is no speedlimit that I ever heard of for tire balancing......:wierd: I use zinc bb's and they are just fine. They both do the same job! Most shops will not install them for you. I had the local shop mount my tires minus the outer bead, then went home put the bb's in and aired them up.

KarlVP · Oct 21, 2008

norcalchris said:
with this internal balancing, how fast can u go?...i heard one member mention there smooth up to 70 mph.
whats better, plastic or steel. how do u get the tire shop to install them?..do you just do it yourself.

Some tire shops will just pour them in when they mount your tires if you already have them in baggies.

I prefer steel BB's because I have heard that the plastic, or airsoft ones turn to dust after a while. Plus they don't weigh as much so it takes much more volume of plastic vs steel.

yossarian19 · Oct 21, 2008

So, I guess I'll try and get airsofts into my tires. Only complications are not having an air compressor or tire tools...
No comments on the air compressor, please. I realize it is un-manly but it is a heavy piece to haul around when I move every 5 months.

KarlVP · Oct 21, 2008

On Board Air is the shit.

Demount with a hi-lift, pour BB's in and reseat, refill with OBA.

Death Wobble at 55

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