SUA SPONTE
NAXJA Forum User
- Location
- Pacific N.W.
I have some random bottles of 80-90 gear lube- some is synthetic, some is not. Can I mix it all together in an old BA-10 or should i stick to one or the other? Wanted to be sure, thanks
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Mixing fluid
- Thread starter SUA SPONTE
- Start date
Rick Anderson
NAXJA Forum User
- Location
- Lusby, MD
Every Synthetic I've seen says its perfectly fine to mix with conventional oil, they are compatible. Why should you NOT mix synthetic and conventional.
I've only seen the advice that you should NOT mix different viscosity oils. I guess (don't know) they can separate at rest and that could create problems during start-up or first use.
I've only seen the advice that you should NOT mix different viscosity oils. I guess (don't know) they can separate at rest and that could create problems during start-up or first use.
The oils your talking about are most likely "synthetic blends". True synthetics are not mineral oil based, they are polyalkyleneglycol (spelling?) based. "Amesoil" is a true synthetic. We used this in quick change rear ends for a buddies race team. The difference in temperatures was truely amazing. After a qualifying run (2-laps) the gear sets would be so hot, gloves were needed to touch them. After switching to the Amesoil, they were pretty much just luke warm. The Amesoil rep told us if mixed w/ regular gear lube, it would gum up like jello. Never acually seen this though, didn't want to risk a rear end!Rick Anderson said:
Gerr
NAXJA Forum User
- Location
- River Drive Norco Ca 92860
the old addage of "when in doubt....don't" probably should be followed here.
In my work we use regular and synthetic oils and I have seen bad results when they are mixed even in small amounts. Ive also read where you can mix them so whats the truth???? who knows but im playing it safe and just running synthetics in my axels and trannys because they are expensive to have rebuilt especially if it could have been prevented.
In my work we use regular and synthetic oils and I have seen bad results when they are mixed even in small amounts. Ive also read where you can mix them so whats the truth???? who knows but im playing it safe and just running synthetics in my axels and trannys because they are expensive to have rebuilt especially if it could have been prevented.
Rick Anderson
NAXJA Forum User
- Location
- Lusby, MD
http://motorcycleinfo.calsci.com/Oils1.html
Most "TRUE" Synthetic oil is mad of either Polyalphaolefin (PAO) or PolyEster (PEO).
Unfortunately, Castrol won a lawsuite when they switched to Base III base stock for their Syntec "True Synthetic" Oil, which it was NOT. Its only highly refined oil, that does perform nearly as well as synthetic. Its also costs half as much to produce, but Castrol still charges full price. Because of this, most oil companies have switched to this scheme, and their synthetic oil is really just highly refined mineral oil, and they are laughing all the way to the bank.
Of course, the fake synthetics that use mineral oil base stock will mix just fine with conventional oil.
These Base III fake Synthetics are NOT the blends, they are sold as Synthetic, because its considered a pure marketing term, and since they perform close enough, they get away with calling themselves Synthetic.
From the link above.
The blends, are exactly that, some Synthetic mixed with Conventional Oil, the synthetic may or may NOT be true synthetic oil, but its a mix, pre-done at the factory.
Everything I've read and seen, PAO and PEO oils will mix and work fine with conventional oil. Some of the very first synthetics didn't mix well, maybe some conventional wisdom was left over because of that. Todays will just fine.
There is tons of advice out there about mixing synthetic and conventional. Some recommending for and against it, the negative usually falls along the line that your degrading the synthetic with conventional and must act accordingly.
Now under extreme racing conditions, with a quick change rear-end, maybe a mix would create a problem because the lower capacity of conventional oil would breakdown faster than a full capacity, and half a tub of destroyed oil would probably create a problem with the remaining synthetic oil, perhaps that was the logic behind the Amsoil reps recommendation. The situation is rather extreme to base a recommendation for conventional use off of. OR perhaps Amsoil has some additives that don't play well with conventional oils.
I haven't seen that advice with the other synthetics, nor heard of anyone suffering problems from mixing the synthetics with conventional oil.
I can't argue with DZraces logic, the cost of axles/transmissions/engines, I have to agree why risk it, if the Synthetics are too expensive, switch to a good qaulity conventional oil that you change more often. Conventional oil have improved greatly over the years, synthetic is often overkill. If you were to get into trouble with Synthetic mixed with conventional, it would probably be at the extremes, where the oils get pushed up to their very limits. Which any custom concoctions of oil would probably get into trouble as well. Which also takes into account the Amsoil recommendation we read above above. 4wheelin can put some pretty extreme pressures or conditions on the axle oil, so playing it safe may be very wise and go with one oil or the other.
Most "TRUE" Synthetic oil is mad of either Polyalphaolefin (PAO) or PolyEster (PEO).
Unfortunately, Castrol won a lawsuite when they switched to Base III base stock for their Syntec "True Synthetic" Oil, which it was NOT. Its only highly refined oil, that does perform nearly as well as synthetic. Its also costs half as much to produce, but Castrol still charges full price. Because of this, most oil companies have switched to this scheme, and their synthetic oil is really just highly refined mineral oil, and they are laughing all the way to the bank.
Of course, the fake synthetics that use mineral oil base stock will mix just fine with conventional oil.
These Base III fake Synthetics are NOT the blends, they are sold as Synthetic, because its considered a pure marketing term, and since they perform close enough, they get away with calling themselves Synthetic.
From the link above.
Delvac-1 is Mobil-1, I don't if everybrand of Mobil-Exxon that calls itself "Synthetic" is PAO based, I've seen lots of rumors that Mobil1 has given into the high-profits of passing off Group III Base Stocks as "Synthetic" but never anything official. I've been using MOBIL1 for years, before these rumors and have never noticed a difference in its appearance, feel, smell NOR performance, so I doubt the rumors. As well, I've mixed Mobil1 many a times and never had a problem. BUT, I've never raced a car with a quick change rear-end.
The blends, are exactly that, some Synthetic mixed with Conventional Oil, the synthetic may or may NOT be true synthetic oil, but its a mix, pre-done at the factory.
Everything I've read and seen, PAO and PEO oils will mix and work fine with conventional oil. Some of the very first synthetics didn't mix well, maybe some conventional wisdom was left over because of that. Todays will just fine.
There is tons of advice out there about mixing synthetic and conventional. Some recommending for and against it, the negative usually falls along the line that your degrading the synthetic with conventional and must act accordingly.
Now under extreme racing conditions, with a quick change rear-end, maybe a mix would create a problem because the lower capacity of conventional oil would breakdown faster than a full capacity, and half a tub of destroyed oil would probably create a problem with the remaining synthetic oil, perhaps that was the logic behind the Amsoil reps recommendation. The situation is rather extreme to base a recommendation for conventional use off of. OR perhaps Amsoil has some additives that don't play well with conventional oils.
I haven't seen that advice with the other synthetics, nor heard of anyone suffering problems from mixing the synthetics with conventional oil.
I can't argue with DZraces logic, the cost of axles/transmissions/engines, I have to agree why risk it, if the Synthetics are too expensive, switch to a good qaulity conventional oil that you change more often. Conventional oil have improved greatly over the years, synthetic is often overkill. If you were to get into trouble with Synthetic mixed with conventional, it would probably be at the extremes, where the oils get pushed up to their very limits. Which any custom concoctions of oil would probably get into trouble as well. Which also takes into account the Amsoil recommendation we read above above. 4wheelin can put some pretty extreme pressures or conditions on the axle oil, so playing it safe may be very wise and go with one oil or the other.
Last edited:
jforse
NAXJA Forum User
- Location
- Duluth, Minnesota
bfred said:
I live right across the bridge from where this stuff is made. I love there gear oil, hate there engine oil. In any kind of performance engine the stuff just does NOT last. Always had better luck with Mobil-1.
Back on topic...
As a standard you should not mix a true syn with conventional oil. It will gum up and make sludge in a engine. Switching back and forth every oil change will also cause this. My .02 just use conventional oil in your Jeep. Change it every 3000 miles and you will be fine. Its alot cheaper too!
Rick Anderson
NAXJA Forum User
- Location
- Lusby, MD
The only time I've mixed Synthetic was Mobil1 (PAO base stock) with some conventional oil, in a 4 cyl engine, while I had an oil leak, the Synthetic was hard enough to find and expensive enough, that I just kept topping off with Conventional oil until I fixed the oil leak. I never had a problem, but this is a pretty isolated short experience, not exactly a real demand pushing the oil, it was mostly Synthetic with a little conventional.
Everything I've seen and read, from informed sources that appear reliable, says mixing the oils should NOT be a problem.
BUT, we've got more than one person posting that it will create problems mixing synthetic and conventional.
To be honest, I'm skeptical about mixing causes gunking or failures of the oil, BUT, again I can't argue with DZRacer's Logic, "WHY RISK IT". Considering the costs if I'm wrong, spending a few extra dollars for all Synthetic or spending a little extra time changing conventional more often, is probably the wise thing to do, instead of mixing the oils.
Everything I've seen and read, from informed sources that appear reliable, says mixing the oils should NOT be a problem.
BUT, we've got more than one person posting that it will create problems mixing synthetic and conventional.
To be honest, I'm skeptical about mixing causes gunking or failures of the oil, BUT, again I can't argue with DZRacer's Logic, "WHY RISK IT". Considering the costs if I'm wrong, spending a few extra dollars for all Synthetic or spending a little extra time changing conventional more often, is probably the wise thing to do, instead of mixing the oils.
jjmat3
NAXJA Forum User
- Location
- Big Bear & Lancaster
From the Amsoil web site:Motor oils:
MIXING AMSOIL,
AMSOIL ASL is compatible with conventional and synthetic motor oils. Mixing AMSOIL motor oils with other oils, however, will shorten the oil life expectancy and reduce the performance benefits. AMSOIL does not support extended drain intervals where oils have been mixed.
Aftermarket oil additives are not recommended for use with AMSOIL motor oils.
Gear oils:
AMSOIL SEVERE GEAR® is compatible with conventional and synthetic gear oils. Mixing AMSOIL gear oils with other oils, however, will shorten the oil life expectancy and reduce the performance benefits. AMSOIL does not support extended drain intervals where oils have been mixed. Aftermarket oil additives, other than those specified by AMSOIL, are not recommended for use with AMSOIL gear oils.
Trans fluid:
AMSOIL Synthetic Universal Automatic Transmission Fluid is completely compatible with other synthetic and petroleum automatic transmission fluids.
MIXING AMSOIL,
AMSOIL ASL is compatible with conventional and synthetic motor oils. Mixing AMSOIL motor oils with other oils, however, will shorten the oil life expectancy and reduce the performance benefits. AMSOIL does not support extended drain intervals where oils have been mixed.
Aftermarket oil additives are not recommended for use with AMSOIL motor oils.
Gear oils:
AMSOIL SEVERE GEAR® is compatible with conventional and synthetic gear oils. Mixing AMSOIL gear oils with other oils, however, will shorten the oil life expectancy and reduce the performance benefits. AMSOIL does not support extended drain intervals where oils have been mixed. Aftermarket oil additives, other than those specified by AMSOIL, are not recommended for use with AMSOIL gear oils.
Trans fluid:
AMSOIL Synthetic Universal Automatic Transmission Fluid is completely compatible with other synthetic and petroleum automatic transmission fluids.
jjmat3
NAXJA Forum User
- Location
- Big Bear & Lancaster
jforse said:
What are you basing the engine oil info on? What do you mean by "In any kind of performance engine the stuff just does NOT last"? Amsoil oils are used extensively in all types of motorsports racing and they are proven to work better and last longer than Mobil 1 or any of their other competition for that matter. Mobil is still trying to play catch up to Amsoil who was first on the scene with Full synthetic motor oils and lubes in 1972.
