No brakes!

Ok guys just did my iro lift, after installing the longer brake lines I can't seem to get my brakes to work after I bled them. I bled them for 2 hours this afternoon, ps rear to ds rear to ps front to ds front. It stopped bubbling after the 3rd or 4th round, after that it ran clear. I figured after 2 hours I should be close to havin brakes but they're the same as when I started. Any input on this? Its a 96 xj no ABS

Sounds like it's bleeding past the piston in the MC. I've had an MC or two give up on me once a bunch of fresh fluid gets flushed through.

Any sure way to tell that without going and buying a new one?

The brake system is 2 systems, 1 front, 1 back.

You bleed 1 system at a time. So for the rear brakes, I bleed the shortest side 1st. That would be the drivers side. Then I do the pass side rear.

The front is the same way, I do the drivers side 1st, then pass side.

A tool I use is a vacuum bleeder. Has a hand pump and a catch cup. I fill the MC, pump up a vacuum, then release the bleeder. When the vaccum dissipates, I close the bleeder, check/fill the MC, and go again.

If you had the calipers off, make sure you had the correct one per side, bleeder should be up.

-Ron

You bleed the furthest from the pedal. Passenger rear, driver rear, passenger front, driver front.

Are you seeing any weeping at the connections you replaced? I know the new copper washers will feel like you are stripping the bolt trying to get them crushed. I want to say it's around 25 ft lbs torque on the new lines for the banjo bolt.

To be honest, on an XJ I don't think short or long side matters as long as you do one system at a time. The actual difference in distance is maybe a foot of line. The practice of bleeding the long line 1st dates back to when cars only had 1 brake system.

Mark makes a good point about sealing. Those brass washers can hide on a caliper. You don't want to delete them or stack them.

-Ron

No leaks I will double check once I get started thismorning. We checked everything over a few times. Once we get it pumped up and bleed one, let it set a minute and the pedal will go right back to the floor

Sounds to me that there is still air in the system.

I'd be inclined to start over. Bleed the MC, then bleed the system over again.

-Ron

It has been my experience that when one of the junctions fail to seal properly, the brakes will not bleed out due to air being pulled into the system.

MC. Unless the master cylinder was disturbed by removing the lines from it, it is seriously doubtful that it is the cause of this issue.

If it were me, I would revisit the connection points where the new brake lines were installed and go from there.

In the past, it has been customary to bleed the longest line first working your way to the shortest line. That would mean that the back axle gets done first with the passenger side starting the bleed cycle. After completing the back axle, the passenger side front gets done next followed by the driver's side front.

If you do decide to bleed the MC, you will need a way to connect the output ports back to the MC reservoir so as to prevent air getting into the MC. Be advised though... Once the lines at the MC are broken open, the entire system will be full of air.

Usually, I will do a gravity bleed first prior to connecting my "one man" brake bleeder which is nothing more than a hand held vacuum pump. It will take time.

But, until and unless you can verify that all of the new lines are sealed, you will be chasing this forever. It would have value to have all of the bleeder valves closed and then pump the brakes until pressure is developed. If pressure can not be developed, then you should be able to find the leaks as the fluid should aught to be dripping out of the faulty joint(s).

This is the bleeder that I use:



Works just fine for an inexpensive tool.

It does not need to be said but I will say it anyway. Do not allow the MC to go low on fluid. Once you draw air into the system by allowing the level to drop, you are in for a long haul for bleeding the system...

Thanks for the info much appreciated. Going to check out the connections and try to bleed it again!

This is a pain but may help. Take one caliper at a time loose and fully collapse the piston and bleed it with a c-clamp holding the piston in. For drum brakes you could try taking the adjuster out and fully collapsing the wheel cylinder. After you bleed each corner put the brakes back together and slowly pump it up making sure you don't empty the master cylinder. Hope that helps.

Well after a new master cylinder and rebuilding basically my entire rear brake system, my brakes are excellent now!

goodluckchuck said:

Well after a new master cylinder and rebuilding basically my entire rear brake system, my brakes are excellent now!

Click to expand...

When I first lifted and replaced lines, my system bled past the master. Had to put a New MC in and it fixed my problem.

This highlights the problem of the pump, pump, hold, bleed traditional method of bleeding brakes. Pushing the master piston down into the bore further than it has been in a long time might ruin the rubber parts that would have been good for a lot longer.