3 row radiator and Taurus fan tolerance

Does anyone know if a 3 row radiator will allow enough clearance for a Ford Taurus fan swap? I have the fan already and plan on installing it in the next month or so. My cooling system needs an overhaul (205k original equip starting to leak and not cool well) so while I'm there I was going to to the water pump, T-stat, radiator, and fan. I know with the stock radiator that the Taurus fan is tight but would a 3 row be too thick?

You'll have to measure how much room you have after the 3 row radiator is installed. As it is, you have to use small bolts on the idler pulley that the engine driven fan attached to if not remove it altogether. When I did a Taurus fan on my rig I moved the radiator 1 1/2" forward to make room for the 3 row radiator.

jeeperjohn said:

You'll have to measure how much room you have after the 3 row radiator is installed. As it is, you have to use small bolts on the idler pulley that the engine driven fan attached to if not remove it altogether. When I did a Taurus fan on my rig I moved the radiator 1 1/2" forward to make room for the 3 row radiator.

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Do you have to do any cutting/modifying to move the radiator forward?

ctnsupra1 said:

Do you have to do any cutting/modifying to move the radiator forward?

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I had to redrill the 2 holes in the bottom support, make special brackets for the upper radiator supports, and trim out a bunch of material from the inside edges of the grille. Having done this I advise people to carefully consider whether this is worth it to them. The fan kit from FFDynamics is a great setup although it costs a bit.

Don't get cought up on the number of rows, they don't mean squat. For instance the two row radiators for our xj's have teo rows of 1/2" tubes and are usually made out of brass/copper. The stock radiator has one row of one inch tubes and is made of aluminium. So the two row radiator actuall has LESS cooling capacity than the stock radiator because aluminum dissapates heat better than a brass/copper radiator. If your engine is stock or close to stock the factory one row aluminum radiator is more than enough to cool it down. Just buy a factory replacement for 100 bucks and be done with it. If you are still running hot after a new radiator then you have problems eslewhere, problems that will only be masked by a three row radiator and a taurus fan. Problems that will come back around sooner or later.

My375hp302 said:

Don't get cought up on the number of rows, they don't mean squat. For instance the two row radiators for our xj's have teo rows of 1/2" tubes and are usually made out of brass/copper. The stock radiator has one row of one inch tubes and is made of aluminium. So the two row radiator actuall has LESS cooling capacity than the stock radiator because aluminum dissapates heat better than a brass/copper radiator. If your engine is stock or close to stock the factory one row aluminum radiator is more than enough to cool it down. Just buy a factory replacement for 100 bucks and be done with it. If you are still running hot after a new radiator then you have problems eslewhere, problems that will only be masked by a three row radiator and a taurus fan. Problems that will come back around sooner or later.

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Yep ... I dont carried away with excitement over three row radiators either ... altho there is a lot of happy posters on forums after fitting that CSF 3core.

After 6mnths of 30'f - 100'f+ .... using a 2row copper/brass radiator ... I certainly wont be bothering with the maxcool chrysler radiator or whatever they fitted for sales down here ... EVER AGAIN.

Its probably why middle east bound XJs had the factory option copper/brass radiators fitted.

IMHO ... the single row radiator is probably just enough ... rather than more than enough to adequately provide cooling for the 4wd 4.0i6 AW4 version of an XJ.

:cheers:

I'd like to take the opportunity to beg to differ. You're only looking, I dare say, at a single dimension of the cooling equation, being the material used. You're not taking into account that the two-row you're describing has approximately four times the surface area. And then - you're not even taking into account the thickness of material used. That has a HUGE bearing on cooling effectiveness. And copper (being much stronger) tends to be far thinner than aluminum assemblies). But even if the metal WERE the same thickness and has a lower coefficient of thermal conductivity, four times the surface area trumps that aspect by such a long shot to make the material nearly completely insignificant. But really, I think the most important aspects of cooling are:

1. how much fluid gets carried and exposed to outside temperature influence per unit length ( the less fluid, i.e. smaller the diameter)

2. the amount of time it spends in the radiator per trip

3. the ratio of the capacity of the radiator to the capacity of the system (incl. water jacket inside engine)

The only really good metric to use and judge from is the temperature drop before re-entering the engine...

I'm not trying to bash you here... honestly... I'm just trying to say that there's a lot more going on in the cooling process than what metal a rad uses...

my opinion is that two and three core rads DO cool far more effectively than singles... though they are also FAR more prone to clogging and can be a pain from that perspective. They also put far more stress on the water pump and result in premature equipment failures and result in less fuel economy...

My375hp302 said:

Don't get cought up on the number of rows, they don't mean squat. For instance the two row radiators for our xj's have teo rows of 1/2" tubes and are usually made out of brass/copper. The stock radiator has one row of one inch tubes and is made of aluminium. So the two row radiator actuall has LESS cooling capacity than the stock radiator because aluminum dissapates heat better than a brass/copper radiator. If your engine is stock or close to stock the factory one row aluminum radiator is more than enough to cool it down. Just buy a factory replacement for 100 bucks and be done with it. If you are still running hot after a new radiator then you have problems eslewhere, problems that will only be masked by a three row radiator and a taurus fan. Problems that will come back around sooner or later.

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My375hp302 said:

Don't get cought up on the number of rows, they don't mean squat. For instance the two row radiators for our xj's have teo rows of 1/2" tubes and are usually made out of brass/copper. The stock radiator has one row of one inch tubes and is made of aluminium. So the two row radiator actuall has LESS cooling capacity than the stock radiator because aluminum dissapates heat better than a brass/copper radiator. If your engine is stock or close to stock the factory one row aluminum radiator is more than enough to cool it down. Just buy a factory replacement for 100 bucks and be done with it. If you are still running hot after a new radiator then you have problems eslewhere, problems that will only be masked by a three row radiator and a taurus fan. Problems that will come back around sooner or later.

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Thats what Ive been wanting to hear for a while now. my stock rad is literally in perfect condition, but I was planning on installing a 3 row just because it was the thing to do.

But right now my temps are fine, so i think ill throw on a Taurus fan and be done with it.

austinaubinoe said:

Thats what Ive been wanting to hear for a while now. my stock rad is literally in perfect condition, but I was planning on installing a 3 row just because it was the thing to do.

But right now my temps are fine, so i think ill throw on a Taurus fan and be done with it.

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Dont forget that even tho you can suck as much air through the radiator as you want - with "better" fans such as the taurus or a heavier duty fanclutch ....

In the end - Its the cooling capacity of the radiator that determines what the liquid temperature in the bottom hose is.

"better" fans just ensure that the radiator, when in good condition, is performing at its best ...

For many - a stock OME 1row .. or stock OME 2row ... or stock OME copper/brass are adequate ... depending on their driving location and performance requirements.

I wish radiators were rated by the amount of total surface area in contact with the air flowing through the radiator. This would be a much better gauge of cooling capacity. I had a custom radiator made for my Dodge Ram 50 that had dimpled tubes to increase the total surface area and it worked very well.

My375hp302 said:

Don't get cought up on the number of rows, they don't mean squat. For instance the two row radiators for our xj's have teo rows of 1/2" tubes and are usually made out of brass/copper. The stock radiator has one row of one inch tubes and is made of aluminium. So the two row radiator actuall has LESS cooling capacity than the stock radiator because aluminum dissapates heat better than a brass/copper radiator. If your engine is stock or close to stock the factory one row aluminum radiator is more than enough to cool it down. Just buy a factory replacement for 100 bucks and be done with it. If you are still running hot after a new radiator then you have problems eslewhere, problems that will only be masked by a three row radiator and a taurus fan. Problems that will come back around sooner or later.

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Yup, I should really take advice from someone who can't even spell. Replacing the stock plastic tank radiator with a 3 row or getting a better fan is for sure masking the problem. The problem of a poorly designed cooling system. If the stock cooling system was perfect or "more than enough" we wouldn't see so many posts about overheating. I maintain the crap out of my vehicles, and I still saw improvement with a QUALITY 3 row radiator. Some 3 rows aren't much of an improvement, thats why you actually spend money, do it right, and get a good one. Just because a radiator has 3 rows doesn't mean its better than a 1 row, but a 3 row radiator that has more capacity, more fins, and big enough tubes WILL cool better.

This is the problem with the internet at times (clearly) - people come out with all kinds of suspect information - thinking that if they put it out there with confidence it will cover up any sort of lack of accuracy... it blows my mind a little...for instance suggesting that aluminum transfers heat better than copper... which is just crazy...

Just to clarify once and for all:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_thermal_conductivities
(where copper has TWICE the thermal conductivity as aluminum)

Also so (though not AS dramatic) with diffusivity:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thermal_diffusivity

For those who are green-minded, copper also uses about ONE THIRD The embodied energy to manufacture as aluminum.

However ALUMINUM is more profitable for the manufacturers. Which is why you have aluminum cheerleaders from time to time.

A three row radiator is not thicker than a two row; the tubes are smaller in a three row than the two rows and therefore tend to clog quicker. The two rows should be more efficient due to more surface area.
I believe the size (height and width) is marginal for a stock XJ, say this because of my expense with full size Wagoneer’s. I had one with an I6 the radiator was so big it could be a gallon low on water and not over heat towing a trailer.