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Auto to manula swap 99'

XJRubicon

XJRubicon

NAXJA Forum User
Location
Minnesota
What all is involved?

I have done the swap on older models but wonder about the 99'

Far as I can tell there are two ECU's. Manual and Automatic.

So the ECU needs to be changed? Or no?

Can the auto tranny computer just be taken out of the picture?
Or does it still need to be in the loop?

All 99's are 23 spline output correct? Manual OR Auto.

Would really appreciate some help! :NAXJA:
 
Why are you converting to a manual? Do you not wheel in rocks or rough terrain? Most generally prefer an auto when wheeling is why I ask.

Anyway, if you really want to do this.... I believe if you use the auto ECU, you will throw a CEL. You don't need the TCU at all. I also think the TPS is different.
 
XJRubicon said:
What all is involved?

I have done the swap on older models but wonder about the 99'

Far as I can tell there are two ECU's. Manual and Automatic.

So the ECU needs to be changed? Or no?

Can the auto tranny computer just be taken out of the picture?
Or does it still need to be in the loop?

All 99's are 23 spline output correct? Manual OR Auto.

Would really appreciate some help! :NAXJA:
Click to expand...

yes all are 23 spline, the manual uses a longer output shaft. the ecu should be changed also other wise it will be searching for info that is not there and could conceivably cause problems and will throw a ton of codes.

now the big question...................Why the hell would you downgrade your jeep to a manual?:doh:
 
Some people run barbie jeeps, I don't knock em...

Because the Auto was a more expensive option from the factory its better? HAHAHAHA....
Its a matter of personal opinion.
The auto is a real performance killer for me.

Some times you need to dump the clutch, sometimes you need to roll back just a bit and hammer down!

To me there if far more control with a manual.
Auto's are sluggish to react and can be very hard to get a good back and fourth motion going to get unstuck.

i BREAK stuff, thats how it is. An auto is too nice to my parts and does not allow me to punish them.

The terrain does not care what equipment you run, only if you have the skill, power, control, and BALLS to complete the trail. No I am not talking about flower picking trails....

I push my vehicle's to the limit. Auto trannys have caused me more stucks then I can think of. One time I can remember, even in low lock, I could not transmit enough power to break the tires loose in reverse. If I had a manual, a simple 2500 RPM clutch dump would have had us on our way.

Not to mention all of the excess heat that an auto tranny creates. As we all know, XJ's are not the best rigs to keep cool as there is not much radiator or underhood space for good airflow.

I don't like not being able to go wheeling simply because it is hot outside.

I have many reasons to want to swap, but most of all, this is my Girlfriends XJ and she wants it that way.

....Also, I was born with three legs so one gets bored driving an auto.
 
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amen brother.

I have had a few people standing around when I was caught up on something going down hill and had to back up. Their response was sure is nice to have an auto isnt it my reply "wouldnt Know" much to their amazement to look inside the rig and find a stick. Much respect for the stick. It takes alot of skill to opperate 3 pedals with 2 feet.
 
XJRubicon said:
Some people run barbie jeeps, I don't knock em...

Because the Auto was a more expensive option from the factory its better? HAHAHAHA....
Its a matter of personal opinion.
The auto is a real performance killer for me.
Click to expand...

actually the stick is more money than the auto.

Some times you need to dump the clutch, sometimes you need to roll back just a bit and hammer down!
Click to expand...

roll back put into neutral and back to drive...very difficult

To me there if far more control with a manual.
Auto's are sluggish to react and can be very hard to get a good back and fourth motion going to get unstuck.
Click to expand...

never had that issue

i BREAK stuff, thats how it is. An auto is too nice to my parts and does not allow me to punish them.
Click to expand...

testosterone at is worst


The terrain does not care what equipment you run, only if you have the skill, power, control, and BALLS to complete the trail. No I am not talking about flower picking trails....
Click to expand...

more male chest thumping


I push my vehicle's to the limit. Auto trannys have caused me more stucks then I can think of. One time I can remember, even in low lock, I could not transmit enough power to break the tires loose in reverse. If I had a manual, a simple 2500 RPM clutch dump would have had us on our way.
Click to expand...

Id suggest learning to drive it that might help.


Not to mention all of the excess heat that an auto tranny creates. As we all know, XJ's are not the best rigs to keep cool as there is not much radiator or underhood space for good airflow. I don't like not being able to go wheeling simply because it is hot outside.
Click to expand...

never been an issue even in 130+ degrees in low 4 for hours

I have many reasons to want to swap, but most of all, this is my Girlfriends XJ and she wants it that way.
Click to expand...

she will hate you afterwards


....Also, I was born with three legs so one gets bored driving an auto.
Click to expand...

keep it in your pants while you drive


all in good fun here but I have done many conversions both ways from stick to auto and auto to stick, and for a daily driver and trail rig and auto will out perform a stick 99% of the time.

you will need a new ecm, pedal assembly. trans, drive shafts modded, new trans mounts, master cylinder, flywheel and the list goes on.

The older XJ's where much easier and cheaper to convert due to a separate TCM and ECM
 
The ECU will through a P0700 code, but otherwise won't care. The TPS is the same on OBDI and OBDII - it was the Renix era with the oddball dual output TPS sensor.
 
Rockwerks,

Why are you so butthurt? I think you need to back over to Pirate4X4.com with that attitude.

As the guy above this post stated, it is a matter of personal opinion.
What do you care what I like? This is a peaceful forum, don't bring it here.

Next time you reply to a thread, you might want to pause a minute before you open your mouth.

I bet I could put your auto to shame on the trail.
When I get the 87' going I am going to come look for you.

See if you can put your money where your mouth is.

I seen you in Moab, you wouldn't DARE to follow me.
You might scratch it!:twak:

Just because YOU can't work a manual doesn't mean that EVERYONE is retarded.

PEOPLE WHO THINK THEY KNOW EVERYTHING ARE VERY ANNOYING TO THOUSE OF US WHO DO.
 
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XJRubicon said:
Rockwerks,

Why are you so butthurt? I think you need to back over to Pirate4X4.com with that attitude.

As the guy above this post stated, it is a matter of personal opinion.
What do you care what I like? This is a peaceful forum, don't bring it here.

Next time you reply to a thread, you might want to pause a minute before you open your mouth.

I bet I could put your auto to shame on the trail.
When I get the 87' going I am going to come look for you.

See if you can put your money where your mouth is.

I seen you in Moab, you wouldn't DARE to follow me.
You might scratch it!:twak:

Just because YOU can't work a manual doesn't mean that EVERYONE is retarded.

PEOPLE WHO THINK THEY KNOW EVERYTHING ARE VERY ANNOYING TO THOUSE OF US WHO DO.
Click to expand...

I grew up wheeling a lifted FJ55 3 speed in Lake Havasu City back in the day and got my license in it back in 1974, and have always had a manual truck around till now. IVe been wheeling now for over 30 years

They do have their place. Ive done nearly every trail in Moab already, and since you need to stay on the trail there is not much new to do. Ill be up there Feb 8, 9 , 10th. Ive tipped my own over a few times. Oh and Ive never broken a part in Moab.....maybe its driving style.

:The facts are that if you do the conversion on your GF's XJ it will decrease the resale value. Do what you want and have a good time. Nice quote I use it all the time.....

If you wish to come see me my address is 4755 Cosnino ROad, Flagstaf, AZ . IM about 120 miles from some great 4.5 rated trails Ive run a few times and Id be happy to show them to you!:D
 
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rockwerks said:
....now the big question...................Why the hell would you downgrade your jeep to a manual?:doh:
Click to expand...

You can't bump start an auto, nor can you start an auto in gear in 4 lo when stalled on a hill, to get going again....

There are many more reasons, but those are my 2 main ones....
 
Ivan said:
You can't bump start an auto, nor can you start an auto in gear in 4 lo when stalled on a hill, to get going again....

There are many more reasons, but those are my 2 main ones....
Click to expand...

autos also dont stall on said hills...........so its a moot point
 
rockwerks said:
If you wish to come see me my address is 4755 Cosnino ROad, Flagstaf, AZ . IM about 120 miles from some great 4.5 rated trails Ive run a few times and Id be happy to show them to you!:D
Click to expand...

Rockin, well I'll send you a PM when the beast is ready, come show ya what the Manual is all about.

But I think we will be meeting sooner then that again in Moab come Oct.

Just because you have run a manual before does not mean you mastered the art, hell I am still learning more all the time.

...and besides man, ITS A MATTER OF PERSONAL OPINION.

Like the the time on Rocker Knocker 06' in my Toyota...

4 low 2nd gear Wood till the radiator exploded.
(Don't worry it was only water, it had been leaking)

Soldered the upper tank back on right there on the trail while we watched a big blue chevy loose its tie rods because there was not a cotter pin on the truck...Topped it off with more water and got back to it!

I must have had it wooded at least 2 or 3 mins solid, darting the clutch peddle for a split second, just enough to roll back just an inch and the dump it! Did that about 15 or 20 times at full throttle and finally dusted off enough rock where I made it.

There is no way possible to Drive, Neutral, Drive to get the bump I needed with an Auto while at 8000RPM.

That technique would have put a serious hurting on even an AW4 Auto.
Not to mention there is no way you could have had the timing to not fall off the ledge and get after it again. Timing is a VERY important aspect of four wheeling.

I hate how the ECU does not idle the engine immediately after throttle input is canceled. Its not like a carb where you can kinda bump it with the throttle and roll back a bit while still in drive. I mean that is possible but I am pretty sure you know what I am talking about. The Reason for this is Emissions. It would spew out way too much unburnt fuel for tree huggers.

I'm not saying autos can't make Rocker Knocker, they walk it all the time.
I could have walked an easy line with my manual... but the line I took required very fast transitions from 2nd gear to neutral back in to second. An auto could not have reacted quick enough. At least not stock and it just would not be good. It is NOT designed for that kind of activity.


Picture this, you are on a pretty steep hill, and there is a section at the top where it way too steep to crawl. The first part is way too steep or bumpy to gain the speed to make the second part.

With a Manual you can crawl the first part just like the auto, but the advantage is, you can hold the vehicle on the hill While slipping the clutch just enough to allow the engine to spool up to a desired RPM level and release the clutch for a burst of speed and POWER that would send the other guys Auto crying for mommy. Neutral drop on a hill like that? Not wise.


I don't care if your AW4 takes Neutral drops all day long, its not good for it at all.

If your really after performance and control, It's my OPINION, no auto can do what a manual can.

Also... Manual's don't neutralize because of fluid starvation when you are on two wheels with the roof rack mowing the lawn. I can remember getting stuck and having to winch simply because my AW4 was at too much of an angle and could not keep pressure.

Good Times!
 
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XJRubicon said:
Rockin, well I'll send you a PM when the beast is ready, come show ya what the Manual is all about.

But I think we will be meeting sooner then that again in Moab come Oct.

Just because you have run a manual before does not mean you mastered the art, hell I am still learning more all the time.

...and besides man, ITS A MATTER OF PERSONAL OPINION.

Like the the time on Rocker Knocker 06' in my Toyota...

4 low 2nd gear Wood till the radiator exploded.
(Don't worry it was only water, it had been leaking)

Soldered the upper tank back on right there on the trail while we watched a big blue chevy loose its tie rods because there was not a cotter pin on the truck...Topped it off with more water and got back to it!

I must have had it wooded at least 2 or 3 mins solid, darting the clutch peddle for a split second, just enough to roll back just an inch and the dump it! Did that about 15 or 20 times at full throttle and finally dusted off enough rock where I made it.

There is no way possible to Drive, Neutral, Drive to get the bump I needed with an Auto while at 8000RPM.

That technique would have put a serious hurting on even an AW4 Auto.
Not to mention there is no way you could have had the timing to not fall off the ledge and get after it again. Timing is a VERY important aspect of four wheeling.

I hate how the ECU does not idle the engine immediately after throttle input is canceled. Its not like a carb where you can kinda bump it with the throttle and roll back a bit while still in drive. I mean that is possible but I am pretty sure you know what I am talking about. The Reason for this is Emissions. It would spew out way too much unburnt fuel for tree huggers.

I'm not saying autos can't make Rocker Knocker, they walk it all the time.
I could have walked an easy line with my manual... but the line I took required very fast transitions from 2nd gear to neutral back in to second. An auto could not have reacted quick enough. At least not stock and it just would not be good. It is NOT designed for that kind of activity.


Picture this, you are on a pretty steep hill, and there is a section at the top where it way too steep to crawl. The first part is way too steep or bumpy to gain the speed to make the second part.

With a Manual you can crawl the first part just like the auto, but the advantage is, you can hold the vehicle on the hill While slipping the clutch just enough to allow the engine to spool up to a desired RPM level and release the clutch for a burst of speed and POWER that would send the other guys Auto crying for mommy. Neutral drop on a hill like that? Not wise.


I don't care if your AW4 takes Neutral drops all day long, its not good for it at all.

If your really after performance and control, It's my OPINION, no auto can do what a manual can.

Also... Manual's don't neutralize because of fluid starvation when you are on two wheels with the roof rack mowing the lawn. I can remember getting stuck and having to winch simply because my AW4 was at too much of an angle and could not keep pressure.

Good Times!
Click to expand...

LALALALALA....BLAH BLAH BLAH. you would be the only one who has had the issues of no pressure on its side. must be you have no clue on how to drive an auto. and Ive never needed to do a neutral drop either. I guess the difference is I drive and you thrash. and Id love to see you drop it at 8000 rpm. dont tell anyone but thats only 2500 above redline.:rolleyes:

Ive heard it all before and been with those who love their manuals and at the end of the day it makes no real difference. And why is it that 99% of the competition rock crawlers and racers use automatics.....gee I wonder:cheers:
 
XJRubicon said:
Rockwerks,

Why are you so butthurt? I think you need to back over to Pirate4X4.com with that attitude.

As the guy above this post stated, it is a matter of personal opinion.
What do you care what I like? This is a peaceful forum, don't bring it here.

Next time you reply to a thread, you might want to pause a minute before you open your mouth.

I bet I could put your auto to shame on the trail.
When I get the 87' going I am going to come look for you.

See if you can put your money where your mouth is.

I seen you in Moab, you wouldn't DARE to follow me.
You might scratch it!:twak:

Just because YOU can't work a manual doesn't mean that EVERYONE is retarded.

PEOPLE WHO THINK THEY KNOW EVERYTHING ARE VERY ANNOYING TO THOUSE OF US WHO DO.
Click to expand...
This has to be one of the funniest things I have ever read, I don't mean to be rude but are you trying to explain yourself in the last sentance? You must be quite high on yourself to talk bad about someone you don't even know and someone who has been wheeling for a lot longer than you. Listening to you talk about wheeling your Toyota like that just means you might have a little to learn, I also don't believe your 5 speed likes neutral drops any better than an automatic does. I have also been wheeling a 5 speed since I have been driving but 90% of people would agree automatics are the way to go. It is your choice though, I want to see how many neutral drops it takes to blow up your 5 speed!
 
To each their own man.

I believe the only reason you have gotten so confrontational is because you love to argue. That was proved to me on the other forum.

I just don't understand why you bring it here over a personal opinion.

I have ALWAYS gotten comments on how well I drive.
I believe there is no point in having something unless you use it!
If it does not work how it needs to it needs to be replaced.

I really don't see why you feel the need to come down on me because of what I prefer to drive. That is just stupid.

I thank you for your post on what all is required to do the swap, but as for your comments on the manual/auto war.. How old are you anyways man?
Because this is childish.

People pushing their rigs to the absolute maximum is hardly the product of someone who does not know how to drive.

Because you have never had fluid starvation proves to me you have NOT pushed your XJ as hard as I have. Fact of the matter is when you are on your side, an auto will NOT work. I don't care if you have never experienced it it does not mean it will never happen.

All rock crawlers use autos? That is a false statement.
There is currently NO ROCK CRAWLING competition other then R/C.

I don't know if you noticed, but its all about rock RACING.
If I wanted to race, then an auto would be the best choice. Fact of the matter is if I wanted to race, it would be in some sort of CAR or a Baja Truck. Of course they are going to run autos. They are going FAST.
Also my Atlas 4.3 would be totally useless in racing.

There is no technicality in rock RACING. Point and shoot.
Hardly rock CRAWLING.
Call it what you want, I know the truth.

I am into rock CRAWLING and the occasional full throttle assault.
If it was not for advancing my skill, an auto would be just fine for CRAWLING.

I don't have a problem with you but it seems you might with me.
I think thats pretty sad over an opinion.

Also your facts are not 100% correct.
You like Auto's, I get it.
I don't.

"There's ALWAYS someone bigger and better."
 
jeepboy381 said:
This has to be one of the funniest things I have ever read, I don't mean to be rude but are you trying to explain yourself in the last sentance? You must be quite high on yourself to talk bad about someone you don't even know and someone who has been wheeling for a lot longer than you. Listening to you talk about wheeling your Toyota like that just means you might have a little to learn, I also don't believe your 5 speed likes neutral drops any better than an automatic does. I have also been wheeling a 5 speed since I have been driving but 90% of people would agree automatics are the way to go. It is your choice though, I want to see how many neutral drops it takes to blow up your 5 speed!
Click to expand...

The last sentence was JUST for Rockwerks, I knew he would get a kick out of it...

I met Rockwerks in Moab last year so I do know him.

What is different about you saying I am not as good a driver as rockwerks? You don't know me...

Just because someone has been doing something a long time does not make them better then anyone else.

My Grandma has been driving since the 40's. She is one of the worst drivers I know. I feel safer now that she does not drive.

As for neutral drops in a Manual... Are you retarded?! Syncros prevent this.

If you are saying putting it in gear and reving it up and dumping the clutch, and calling that a neutral drop... Well you are just an Idiot.

Yeah, the toyota 5 speed does not like shock loads, but I have NEVER had a tranny fail from dropping the clutch. NEVER. It is by FAR easier to replace the clutch then to rebuild an auto.

If It is so bad for a clutch to drop it, Why do 3000HP dragsters run one?
BECAUSE AN AUTO COULD NEVER DREAM OF TRANSMITTING THAT MUCH POWER.

I really do not understand you people attacking a personal opinion.

Do you really not have anything better to do then push your views on someone else? Are you a Jehovah's witness?

I asked for TECH not CHIT CHAT.
 
Wow you are god!! You might know more than everyone here and it sure seems like you think so, I am sure you know more than me and more than the vast majority but you sound like a 16 year old girl yelling at her parents. Be prepared to take some criticism without getting on the defensive man. No one is trying to hurt your feelings there just giving their perspective on the topic to maybe help you out. I don't think you need any help though, you know eveything obviously and everyone else is wrong. Good luck on your swap!

Oh yeah and for the record I am a Jehovah's witness. :dunno:

I never said you were a worse driver, I said he has been driving longer than you. I don't know you or him.

Please explain a neutral drop to me, obviously I am a stupid Jahovah witness.

It is easier to replace a clutch than a Automatic transmission, thats why I wheel a 5 speed.

Did I ever say it was bad for your clutch to drop it? I think it is bad for everything in your truck!

Not one person attacked your personal opinion until you freaked out on everyone for not seeing everything the same as you. They just gave there opinion and tried to help.

It looks like you want tech and a fight to me, calm down.
 
Haha, I don't want to fight.

I never got my feelings hurt..
My feelings never had anything to do with this, I know Rockwerks likes to fight and argue. I also know to take what he says with a grain of sand.

I just like to express my points with capitals.

I think this is all nonsense, All I have done here is reply to comments.

I am god eh? Hahaha far from. But I do know what the hell I am doing.

I got the answers I was seeking and now I am just in this thread for fun!
party1:

This is Hilarious...You guys act like I am trying to convert YOUR truck... HAHAHA

The only way she would let me buy her an AUTO was if I promised to convert it to a manual.

So the entire "WHY" does not matter, after RockWerks joined in on this, I knew where things would go. I think its funny.
 
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