Brake upgrades?

So its time to do the breaks. Except, as I am trying to make sure that every service I do is an upgrade and not just a repair, I am looking for ways to upgrade the brakes instead. So, I pose a question to you all; is there a commonly performed brake upgrade kit I could buy, or parts from another model that could be swapped in there. For example dual piston calipers or better brake master cylinder? I've done a little searching around and have seen that people often swap WJ brakes, but that seems to require replacement of the knuckles. I have no doubt there are some better rotors and pads I can swap in, but Im really looking for something more, I am currently running 16inch wheels with a 3.75 offset, not sure what will fit in there but it seems there is a decent amount of extra space around the stock rotors and caliper. Anyhow, just looking for something a little better than what I have for the front. I plan to do the disk brake conversion on the back soon so I am not worrying too much about that right now.

Anyhow, I have a 95 2dr cherokee sport 4x4. Any advice you all might have would be greatly apprecaited.

WJ brakes are the best bang for your buck. there used to be a ford falcon conversion kit but idk if thats available anymore.

For the rear I would say swaping to a F8.8 is the most cost-effective alternative, you would end with disc brakes, a stonger axle (assuming you have at least a 8.25/27spl axle) and inclusive 4.10s installed.

for the front, I would suggest the WJ swap but it is not cheap at all due to all the components required and the gears change to match the F8.8.

Skip the 8.8 swap ... it's overrated IMO, swap in 29spline shafts and spiders for the 8.25 if you have one (or swap a 29spl 8.25 if you have a D35 - cheaper, easier and just as strong), convert to ZJ/TJ/KJ rear disks and then ponder the WJ swap. No gear changes required, plenty of rear axle, and unbeatable brakes. The WJ swap can be done cheaply or expensively ... retain stock steering to save a bunch of coin.
With just the ZJ rears braking will be greatly improved (use TJ pads and sliders to eliminate bracket wear as a concern).
If you don't want to jump into the WJ swap, just run slotted rotors and better pads on the front. Use ZJ prop valve internals and you'll have a night and day improvement in braking over stock.

This ^^ Rear disc swap.
I recommend doing the WJ swap, I intend to soon.
Otherwise, black magic pads/rotors.

Well, the only upgrade would be larger rotors and rear disks. If you plan on bigger tires, start looking for a D44, or do the 8.8. 8.8 gives you 31 spline axles and disk brakes. 44 gives you 30 spline and a TON of options all the way up to 35 spline, plus most guys on the trail will have spare 30 spline shafts. You can put the 8.8 explorer brakes on a D44 with minimal effort. I did a write up a few years back for the d44 brakes. As for the front without upgrading to black magic, vancos, or WJ, your stuck with putting good pads on. The 95 already has a dual master cylinder booster and all XJ's have a 1" master cylinder so a WJ brake booster upgrade won't gain you anything except taking a part that fits and modifying a part that doesn't fit so it will fit. So you're stuck with putting better pads on, and just get some premium rotors. The slotted/vented stuff is more for show and for the track where the brakes need to dissipate heat. If you're not road racing your jeep, then you won't need it.

My setup is a 95 with 33's, stock front brakes with brembo OEM rotors, and Hawk pads, ZJ disk brake proportioning spring in the valve, and a d44 with explorer disks, it's quite capable of locking up 33's on dry pavement from speed, and stops very well. I am in the process of collecting the WJ parts, as I want better steering. Not too concerned over "improved" braking, but that will be a side benefit.

Mark

Well like I said guys I'm focusing on the front here right now. I definitely plan on going rear disks in the future, but Im just addressing what NEEDS to be replaced right now. The WJ swap looks like a good option, but I'm a little confused by some of the write ups. Some are suggesting you need a custom steering setup, and some just some kind of spacer it seems. In either case, I'm not 100% clear on that and it looks like it might be pricey coming up with all those parts. The Vanco kit looks promising, although I'm sure thats not the least bit cheap either. I like the ZJ prop valve idea, that looks fairly straightforward. I suppose it might just be ZJ valve, slotted rotors and better pads for now. Unless anybody else has any other suggestions?

The ZJ prop valve is ONLY for use with rear disk brakes ... it's just to reset the brake bias when you swap rear disks on. Swapping a ZJ prop valve onto a stock disk/drum system won't make for a well functioning braking system at all.

When I swapped the TJ/ZJ rear system onto my 8.25 it stopped me and my 33's very well and I was quite pleased with the function of my brakes at that point. prior to that with a poorly functioning but new stock system it was pedal to the floor and hope for the best ... and it was all functioning as it should, just sucked.
I swapped to the WJ system purely for the steering, brakes was the gravy on the potatoes as it were.

check out the pads from www.blackmagicbrakes.com, everyone i've know who has used them has nothing but excellent things to say about them. im talking guys with stock brake setups able to lock up 35s on the street. best part is they are a stock replacement you don't have to modify anything to use them.

Devilfrog said:

The ZJ prop valve is ONLY for use with rear disk brakes ... it's just to reset the brake bias when you swap rear disks on. Swapping a ZJ prop valve onto a stock disk/drum system won't make for a well functioning braking system at all.

Click to expand...

Hah! Thanks for the clarification on that one.

Powerslot rotors!! Slotted rotors that come with Hawk composite pads. The pads are great and last really long and don't get dusty and don't make noise. A slotted rotor is stronger than a cross-drilled one. I've got front and rear power slots on my G2 44s with 37s and my jeep stops like it's still stock! HIGHLY recommend Powerslots to everyone. They are pretty reasonable too, like $250 for a set of two.

http://www.4wheelparts.com/parts/power-slot-rotors/powerslot-brake-rotors.aspx

In order of expense, low to high:
Black Magic pads
rear disc swap (go with black magic parts here, too. why not?)
WJ swap
Hydroboost

Black Magic pads will get you all the brakes you need at least until 33" tires, I'd think. The rest is gravy.

Devilfrog said:

With just the ZJ rears braking will be greatly improved (use TJ pads and sliders to eliminate bracket wear as a concern).

Click to expand...

Devilfrog...

I just recently put ZJ rears on my '01XJ and this statement caught my attention. Can you explain what this is? Can I simply get a pair of TJ pads and the sliders will come with? I don't want to wear out my brackets... so any 'preventative' upgrades are always a plus in my book.

If you look at the ZJ brackets, and even your front brackets, you may notice divots or the beginning of them forming on the ears. The later TJ brakes (and explorer ... They all use the same caliper Expy,ZJ,TJ,KJ) used a stainless overrider that the pads rode on to prevent the divots from forming ... Otherwise the pads are the same as the ZJ. The overriders can be purchased sepreately (tj brake hardware kit) as they do not come with the pads.

I think I understand here... my wife's '03 KJ have these steel 'sleeve' type things the pads ride on... guess that prevents the divots from forming. I need to find some pics since that always helps me.

Get black magic pads

Blackmagicbrakes.com

I agree... I have Black magic pads & centric rotors on both my 01XJ & my wife's 03KJ & they are really great pads.

Re: Re: Brake upgrades?

Redsnake said:

I think I understand here... my wife's '03 KJ have these steel 'sleeve' type things the pads ride on... guess that prevents the divots from forming. I need to find some pics since that always helps me.

Click to expand...

You can see them here

Do the calipers that black magic sells make a difference? Are they just a better stock part or is there a performance upgrade to these. Also i have a renix jeep 89. Most of the stuff is from 90 up. Whats the difference between the two? Im guseeing theres a reason for vendors selling 90 and up. What are differences between the years. Is there anyone that makes a bolt on big brake kit for xj? Wj is a pita. I just want to order and bolt on.

I recently went from wj frt with ebc yellow pads, and stock 8.8 discs rear
to stock fronts, with blackmagic pads and centric rotors all around

Did not.notice a downgrade. Maybe sligthly better, but too many other variables to realky say