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new guy with drive shaft issues

H

hondadave

NAXJA Forum User
Location
charlotte nc
new guy here.new to jeeps and to this site. recently talked my wife into letting me lift my xj. 89 tbird coils in the front. 96 s10 bastard pack in the rear. was going for 3" to clear some 31's i got cheap but ended up at 4.5". driveshaft was doing the death wobble so i dropped the transfer case around 1" . seemed to work for about 30 miles and it came back with a vengeance and now is leaking bad from the rear transfer case seal. my question is should i bother with replacing the seal and bushing and u joints or just try to scrape together enough for an sye? itsa a 92 xj auto np231 transfer case stock everything except the lift.thanks for your reply. heres a pic, just cuz i want to show off the new lift">
5548019803_05ce5b4619.jpg

a%3E
 
Check your u-joint angles. you want them to be within 1.5 degrees of each other.
If they are not then you need to angle the rear diff with shims usually available at a spring shop.
Also make sure that the yoke ears are not hitting due to excessive angle.
If all this does not help it is time for a double cardan cv joint on one end of the driveshaft.
 
any link to a thread discussing how to check driveshaft angles? anybody have 4.5" of lift with no sye? im considering the ironrock yoke but it costs more than i have in my entire lift including wheels and tires. heres a pic of my driveline as is ">

and the slip yoke, out about 1/4" fromk stock
">

im not seeing any extreme angles. is it possible i just killed the bushing driving it 10 miles back from the shop before i dropped the t-case?
 
didnt know i needed degree shims. could this cause the front to mess up the seal? how do i know how many degrees i need? thanks for your help. im used to working on hondas. never had driveline issues before.
 
hondadave said:
any link to a thread discussing how to check driveshaft angles? anybody have 4.5" of lift with no sye? im considering the ironrock yoke but it costs more than i have in my entire lift including wheels and tires. heres a pic of my driveline as is ">

and the slip yoke, out about 1/4" fromk stock
">

im not seeing any extreme angles. is it possible i just killed the bushing driving it 10 miles back from the shop before i dropped the t-case?
Click to expand...


AHHHHHH!!! You're not seeing any extreme angles? Those angles scare the shit out of me. SYE, shims, front driveshfat out of an auto XJ and be done with it! A drop won't do anything for you. You need to do a little research. Search the site. Since this subject has been beaten to death, you will find plenty of threads regarding the basics of lifting, etc etc.

The axle pinion should be pointed at the tcase!!! People don't understand that MANY other things change besides the ride height of the vehicle. It gets expensive quickly for it to be 100% problem free (or as close as you will ever get it).

Those aren't "wobbles" as you describe them,. they're vibes, and you're prob getting a ton of them! Wait until you hit a bump at above 45, then you will know what we refer to as a death wobble...
 
so am i stuck doing an sye? i actually just got back from the junkyard with a stock xj front driveshaft. im thinking finding the adapter on anything stock is an internet rumor. i was under several hundred trucks, vans and rear wheel drive cars and didnt see a double cardan joint outside of xj front shafts. should i bother trying to shim the rear end to point more towards the transfer case or just spend the $175 on the ironrock sye?
 
You will need to shim it regardless. If you have the shaft already, you have to have a fixed output on the transfer case i.e. a SYE to attach that front shaft to. It's ultimately better in the long run to do a SYE for numerous reasons that I'm not getting into (search).

Once the SYE is installed, find out the angle the pinion will need to be set to in order for it to point directly at the output of the case. Install the appropriate degree shim, remove the drop, and presto, no more vibes.
 
i know an sye will solve my vibration problem. i just want to know if its possible to eliminate or alleviate vibrations at 4.5" of lift without the sye. i realize now i will need shims regardless, i just dont know what degree to get. i researched for weeks on this and other forums and there was never any definitive answer. some people seem to have vibe issues at 2" and others seem to be able to go to 5 inches and more with just a transfer case drop. i have less than 175 in this lift including wheels and tires and i just want to know if i can get away without doubling that on an sye. thanks for your time
 
Yes, you can just use shims and a drop; I did it that way for a couple of months before I did my SYE. the degrees pointed towards the output of the case from the pinion will give you the degree shim. New leaves come with them, so I don't know what mine were...
 
since you say my angle looks pretty bad in the rear, should i assume i need a pretty big number on degree shims. i see them on ebay starting at 2 degrees all the way to 12 degrees. start with 8 degrees? i already dropped the t case around and inch. it seems theres a consensus that is as far as you want to go. i read somewhere about not getting the aluminum shims, i seem to remember seeing some steel ones in the towing section of autozone. so anyway to know for sure what degree shims i need?
 
bdahlg said:
AHHHHHH!!! You're not seeing any extreme angles? Those angles scare the shit out of me. SYE, shims, front driveshfat out of an auto XJ and be done with it! A drop won't do anything for you. You need to do a little research. Search the site. Since this subject has been beaten to death, you will find plenty of threads regarding the basics of lifting, etc etc.

The axle pinion should be pointed at the tcase!!! People don't understand that MANY other things change besides the ride height of the vehicle. It gets expensive quickly for it to be 100% problem free (or as close as you will ever get it).

Those aren't "wobbles" as you describe them,. they're vibes, and you're prob getting a ton of them! Wait until you hit a bump at above 45, then you will know what we refer to as a death wobble...
Click to expand...

for a double cardan ds the pinion should be pointed at the tcase output, but for a regular drive shaft like he has im pretty sure they are supposed to be parallel.
2joint_angle.gif


cv_angle.gif
 
Last edited:
With the slip-yoke setup you have now the pinion and slip-yoke should be at the same angle--get an angle finder and check. When you have a double-cardan shaft (like the front shaft) THEN you want the pinion to point at the transfer case output (the pinion in-line with the shaft). U-joints wobble and they need to be phased to eliminate vibrations, see http://www.4xshaft.com/driveline101.html

Another source of vibes in the rear is that the slip joint hangs out too far and does not have engagement. The way to fix that is a longer shaft or a longer slip-joint.

Are you sure the vibes are from the shaft? Pull the shaft and drive it in 4WD to see if they still there
 
i cant drive without the rear shaft because i have the old style case with the 3 bolt tail shaft. my first vibes were because of the slip yoke being out too far, i fixed that with the t case drop but now i think my rear pinion angle is way off. what exactly is an angle finder and where do you get one? does harbor freight carry such a thing. ive been working on cars awhile and i cant say ive ever heard of one
 
You wont really know what degree shim to get until you install the SYE and install the shaft, as it might have different angles then the current shaft.

Sears sells an angle finder for like $9.99.
 
and the slip yoke, out about 1/4" fromk stock


while you're under there, make sure the slip yoke and driveshaft aren't still hitting each other-- it looks like they've "clearanced" themselves some, but unless they are free throughout the full range of motion, you've still got problems.
 
hondadave said:
i cant drive without the rear shaft because i have the old style case with the 3 bolt tail shaft
Click to expand...
the slip yoke isn't held into the output housing with anything, the only thing keeping it installed is the driveshaft length... unbolt the axle end and tug the shaft, it will pop right out

you will need something like a juice bottle cap in the output seal to keep fluid from flying out the cone
 
get ready for the punchline....you ready.... so im looking all over the internet pricing sye's and i get to thinking. i go out and check all the bolts that i took off for the rear lift and there all pretty tight still. i stand back to smoke a cigarette and guess what? i only have one lug nut holding on my right rear tire. apparently in the rush to get it back together it never got torqued. please make fun of me, i deserve it. i have no vibes up to 65 now. should i still shim my rearend or is it a matter of "if its not broke dont fix it" i still have that troublesome new leak at the transfer case tailshaft but i think thats mostly because the t-case drop tilted the t-case back some. any thoughts?
 
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