XJ sector shaft brace - without losing or relocating sway bar

[techno1154]

Maybe I do not understand your assumption that the addition of a hydraulic ram will negatively affect the compression and or articulation of the axle thus loading the steering box more :dunno:. Just an FYI,...the ram do not mount to the steering box or any other part of the unibody. One end is mounted to the axle and the other end to (typically) the steering tie rod. Therefore, neither the steering box nor the unibody will be subjected to extra forces generated by the ram.

Axle articulation will be exactly as it was before the addition of the ram.

 

[blistovmhz]

Right, but as the axle moves up, it pushes the drag link up as well. if the drag link goes up, either the wheels have to turn right, or the pitman has to spin left. That's what bumpsteer is all about. Whether or not you can FEEL any bump steer, the effect is there. That said, if you have rubber bushings anywhere in the suspension, they'll soak up a little bit of that force, but in my case, there's no rubber, so that force hast to go somewhere.
But, after looking into how the box itself actually distributes fluid, it looks like the pitman will still be able to soak up some of that force, but the ram will also take on half of that load, so it's really a non-issue unless you have noticeable bump steer to begin with.

 

[trippled]

Start with the totm on hydro assist in the pirate 4x4 Cherokee section. There's some good info to get you started

 

[1990JEEPXJ]

You're waaaayyy over thinking this. If there is no brace that fits your needs, make one.

If you keep destroying boxes, maybe the box it the issue. Are they off the shelf part store reman stuff? My PSC box never had an issue even on 35's.

Tone of people run set ups not that different than yours without much issue. Just because you're having an issue doesn't mean it's some unicorn of an issue that requires some elaborate engineering and thought processes to fix.

 

[blistovmhz]

You're waaaayyy over thinking this. If there is no brace that fits your needs, make one.

If you keep destroying boxes, maybe the box it the issue. Are they off the shelf part store reman stuff? My PSC box never had an issue even on 35's.

Tone of people run set ups not that different than yours without much issue. Just because you're having an issue doesn't mean it's some unicorn of an issue that requires some elaborate engineering and thought processes to fix.

There's definitely nothing wrong with my suspension/steering. We just wheel hard. A sector shaft brace isn't an elaborate engineering project, it's just something that becomes necessary when you're driving 35's, real fast, in harsh terrain. There's a reason why lots of fab shops make them.
All my boxes have been used, and I'm not about to spend $500 on a new box, only to have it fail in the same manner. It'd be silly to spend that much money on a new box, when a sector shaft brace is guaranteed to solve the problem. Besides which, I've seen LOADS of sector shaft bearing/seal failures on rigs with boxes only a few months old.. That said, I'm sorta convinced on the ram assist at this point. Just ordered some offset TRE's so I can get full lock/lock again before throwing the ram together.

 

[rockclimber]

:banghead:

you aren't doing anything new, you don't have some kind of miracle jeep that is different. its a solid axle with a mechanical steering linkage. every possible option available has been built and broken by somebody. hydro assist is the cure for 99% of the steering problems for 99% of the wheeling population.
believe me you are not a part of the 1% of the 1% .
those guys are hauling ass across Johnson Valley right now.

but to your argument
any "bumpsteer" seen by the ram would also be seen by the box. regardless of the box being there or not. so, because the box will see this (since it is an effect of suspension cycle and not an outside object acting on the tire) it will move the ram just fine.

secondly, if you have enough bumpsteer to even make that a concern then your steering ****ing sucks.

do what you want. you have been given the tools and info you need to create a good system. !!!1

 

[blistovmhz]

:banghead:

you aren't doing anything new, you don't have some kind of miracle jeep that is different. its a solid axle with a mechanical steering linkage. every possible option available has been built and broken by somebody. hydro assist is the cure for 99% of the steering problems for 99% of the wheeling population.
believe me you are not a part of the 1% of the 1% .
those guys are hauling ass across Johnson Valley right now.

but to your argument
any "bumpsteer" seen by the ram would also be seen by the box. regardless of the box being there or not. so, because the box will see this (since it is an effect of suspension cycle and not an outside object acting on the tire) it will move the ram just fine.

secondly, if you have enough bumpsteer to even make that a concern then your steering ****ing sucks.

do what you want. you have been given the tools and info you need to create a good system. !!!1

Not arguin' with you man Ram assist is the plan. Just waitin' for parts at this point.

 

[blondejoncherokee]

Go assist and be done . Youll never regret assist

 

[blistovmhz]

Did the ram assist. Its not quite right yet though. High speed turning (emergency speed) is a little slow, and the jeep is pulling left constantly (slightly). Probably not enough flow with 1/4" HP lines (bored restrictor to 5/32). Going to give myself a few days to get used to the steering and try to figure out why its pulling left.

 

[yossarian19]

Pulling can be camber, caster, tires or the steering gear. Maybe your sector bearings are toast..?

 

[blistovmhz]

Pulling can be camber, caster, tires or the steering gear. Maybe your sector bearings are toast..?

HA! Sector shaft bearings . That's why I did the RAM. Blew out sector shaft bearing and seal on my third box, so was going to do a sector shaft brace, but everyone convinced me to do the RAM instead.

Caster SHOULD be bang on, but I'll be checking it again today just cause. It was self centering very well before the RAM (and steering box swap), so I doubt it'll be the caster, but ya never know.
I loosened off the steering gear lash a quarter turn this morning before going to grab my coffee, and it didn't feel like it was pulling as hard, but also never got over 50km/h. Will give it another test drive down the highway tonight.

While I was doing this, I just realized I've no idea how to figure out correct steering gear lash when there's a ram installed. The ram will always keep things super tight, so doing it by feel doesn't seem to make sense. Is there another method other than disconnecting the ram?

Camber could be out as well. That's something I've never manage to check because I don't have a level surface anywhere, and I absolutely don't trust shops here for an alignment (I've never paid for one that ended up as good as my own.) I know my BJ's aren't out, but the inner c's could certainly be bent with the number of big impacts they've seen. I'll try to figure a way to measure them.
Any idea off hand, what the correct camber should be?

 

[yossarian19]

While I was doing this, I just realized I've no idea how to figure out correct steering gear lash when there's a ram installed.

You are supposed to adjust lash with the gearbox on the work bench. Otherwise you are trying to feel how tight / loose it is through the steering column & linkage. Add a ram... you are flying blind.

 

[blistovmhz]

I'm aware. I've done in on the vehicle most times though, with good results. Agreed though that you're pretty much entirely blind with the ram installed. What I'm hoping is that I'm correct that the box is too tight, and that some of my problems will just disappear as I loosen the box. If I loosen it off and all of a sudden the twitchiness goes away and the high speed caster centering gets better, I at least know the gear lash was a problem. Probably take the box off from there to adjust it correctly (though I AM PRETTY LAZY..).

I checked my caster again just now. Diff cover at 85.5 which is exactly where I set it years ago and should be enough for adequate caster induced centering, so really crossing my fingers on the box gear lash.