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  #1  
Old June 21st, 2006, 18:44
oakesters oakesters is offline
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AXLES FOR 36 IROKS

I want to run 36'' iroks, i have a xj dana 44 in the rear and a 30 in the front, i know the 30 will have to go, but will a dana 44 be ok in the front? If I go with the 44 in front i will go with alloys and ctm. Will a 33 spline up-grade rear axle be up to the challenge in the rear or is a full floater kit be better? and this is for the rocks (rubicon, moon rocks, jv), and is there anything you can do to make both these axles hold up?

Last edited by oakesters; June 21st, 2006 at 18:50. Reason: more 411
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  #2  
Old June 21st, 2006, 19:21
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Matt98XJ Matt98XJ is offline
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Re: AXLES FOR 36 IROKS

Check this out. http://www.naxja.org/forum/search.php Lots of info on this in there.
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  #3  
Old June 21st, 2006, 19:23
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Re: AXLES FOR 36 IROKS

60's. Might as well go big if your going through all the trouble to do some 44's.
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  #4  
Old June 21st, 2006, 19:33
az4wheeler2002 az4wheeler2002 is offline
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Re: AXLES FOR 36 IROKS

are you kidding me??
why waste your money on a front D44??
you've already got the D30, put chromos and 760x ujoint's but make sure you get full circle c-clips(snap ring) just like the alloy usa, I believe the part# is 12148, even gusset the axle alittle if you want. 36" tires aren't that big!!!
so what the D44 front axle has a bigger ring gear size, I wheel with alot of people that rock their junk harder than they should, on 35's/38's, a few Iroks and some creepy crawlers, for the rear 33spl all day long, I believe it limits your locker availability to either detroit/arb/ox, but worth it
and 12gauge is correct...................if you go 60's you'll do it right the first time, but don't waste your money on a front D44
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  #5  
Old June 21st, 2006, 19:48
oakesters oakesters is offline
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Re: AXLES FOR 36 IROKS

dana 60=38''s+ if not 40's for ground clearance, and the dana 30 max tire has been dicussed( 33's)so what are people using for there 36'' tires? and i have search, Ultimate 44 write up by crash was the best thing out there.

Last edited by oakesters; June 21st, 2006 at 19:49. Reason: sp
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  #6  
Old June 21st, 2006, 20:01
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Re: AXLES FOR 36 IROKS

Quote:
Originally Posted by az4wheeler2002
are you kidding me??
why waste your money on a front D44??
you've already got the D30, put chromos and 760x ujoint's but make sure you get full circle c-clips(snap ring) just like the alloy usa, I believe the part# is 12148, even gusset the axle alittle if you want. 36" tires aren't that big!!!
so what the D44 front axle has a bigger ring gear size, I wheel with alot of people that rock their junk harder than they should, on 35's/38's, a few Iroks and some creepy crawlers, for the rear 33spl all day long, I believe it limits your locker availability to either detroit/arb/ox, but worth it
and 12gauge is correct...................if you go 60's you'll do it right the first time, but don't waste your money on a front D44
BIG X2!!!

Alloy shafts in the front(with upgraded joints) and rear and youll be fine!! The 44 is plenty strong with alloy shafts and the 30 will last if you keep your foot out of it. Ive seen guys wheel with 37's with semi built 30/44's and they did just fine. Just remember though, driving finesse will be your best friend!!
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  #7  
Old June 21st, 2006, 21:09
oakesters oakesters is offline
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Re: AXLES FOR 36 IROKS

Its hard to think of a dana 30 being ok on 36'' .Most people on naxja think 35'' are to big of a tire for the 30( crash/jes/goatman) and i want to drive hard some times. and what about a axle like the jes/crash made for his rig. and want the best(strongest) option for the rear, 33 spline , full floater? and i know of a 35 spline, but its a Arb, i want a Detroit.

Last edited by oakesters; June 21st, 2006 at 21:12. Reason: sp
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  #8  
Old June 21st, 2006, 21:10
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TheHighHeat TheHighHeat is offline
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Re: AXLES FOR 36 IROKS

yeah a dana 30 will work for at max a 33 if you have a damn 350 v8 in your XJ, I run 35s on mine and a buddy runs 38s on his, if you know how to wheel and build a decent axle you won't break a 30 with 36s

Quote:
Originally Posted by oakesters
dana 60=38''s+ if not 40's for ground clearance, and the dana 30 max tire has been dicussed( 33's)so what are people using for there 36'' tires? and i have search, Ultimate 44 write up by crash was the best thing out there.
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  #9  
Old June 21st, 2006, 21:22
oakesters oakesters is offline
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Re: AXLES FOR 36 IROKS

""This is where I know Im going to catch some flack. I am not a very big believer in the Dana 30 for rock use. Jes and I have a pile of broken shafts and a broken carrier to prove it. So, I cannot recommend running a tire larger than 33 inches with a locker in the rocks. Larger than this, and several things become very apparent. Your braking ability becomes horrible, the unit bearings really begin to suffer, the ring and pinion are screaming for mercy and you may start having ball joint troubles.

Polishing the turd.

OK, so youve got some money in your 30 and want to keep it. Understandable. Whats the ultimate 30? If I had to keep a 30, and I wanted to run 35;s on it against my better judgement, Id build it this way.- Crash"**

** this is were it seems to me that even 35's are a bad idea, so how can 36" hold up, and i heard from people that its almost as tall as a 37 mtr? - Ron

Last edited by oakesters; June 21st, 2006 at 21:23. Reason: '''
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  #10  
Old June 21st, 2006, 21:53
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Harvo Harvo is offline
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Re: AXLES FOR 36 IROKS

Not sure about the 30, but the 44's have held up to years of flogging under my CJ7 with 36" TSL's and the original stock shafts. The front 44 has ejected a couple of u-joint caps, but has never broken.

I say if you are only going to run 36" tires, Dana 44 is the way to go. If you get a Dana 60, you may as well run the stock axles with 31" tires because the diff clearance would be about the same.
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  #11  
Old June 21st, 2006, 22:06
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Re: AXLES FOR 36 IROKS

Things like vehicle weight, motor torque, transmission type, gearing, and weight of right foot need to be factored in. To people replying saying their friends run 37s on the D30; do you have rocks like JV? If not, shut it.

I think Richard's (goatman) XJ can be used as a good point of comparison. It's heavy, has a stroker motor, and fairly deep gearing (also an auto, which is generally considered to be easier on axles). He runs 37" MTRs, which are basically the same size as 36" iroks, on the same trails, and runs a front D44. He occasionally brakes hubs, stub shafts, or CTMs, but I know he has attributed much of that to residual effects of towing a dead XJ out of much of Fordyce. He is also frequently talking of upgrading to larger outers, but the D44 stuff seems to get him by.

take that for what it's worth.

my opinion is that if you can keep your XJ under 4000 pounds trail ready, run a minimally modded 4.0, auto tranny, and nothing crazy for gears, you will be fine on a D44 with alloys in the front and a 33 spline D44 in the rear. however with this combination still be prepared for a very occasional break, if you're looking for bulletproof you need to go 1.5" front and rear (60s, 9s, whatever)
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  #12  
Old June 21st, 2006, 22:40
oakesters oakesters is offline
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Re: AXLES FOR 36 IROKS

Quote:
Originally Posted by BrettM
Things like vehicle weight, motor torque, transmission type, gearing, and weight of right foot need to be factored in. To people replying saying their friends run 37s on the D30; do you have rocks like JV? If not, shut it.

I think Richard's (goatman) XJ can be used as a good point of comparison. It's heavy, has a stroker motor, and fairly deep gearing (also an auto, which is generally considered to be easier on axles). He runs 37" MTRs, which are basically the same size as 36" iroks, on the same trails, and runs a front D44. He occasionally brakes hubs, stub shafts, or CTMs, but I know he has attributed much of that to residual effects of towing a dead XJ out of much of Fordyce. He is also frequently talking of upgrading to larger outers, but the D44 stuff seems to get him by.

take that for what it's worth.

my opinion is that if you can keep your XJ under 4000 pounds trail ready, run a minimally modded 4.0, auto tranny, and nothing crazy for gears, you will be fine on a D44 with alloys in the front and a 33 spline D44 in the rear. however with this combination still be prepared for a very occasional break, if you're looking for bulletproof you need to go 1.5" front and rear (60s, 9s, whatever)
**I have a auto and i just cut the back half of my jeep, (like paul s and hinkly)i was thinking 4.88 or 5.13 for gears . and i want to go to jv/ moon rocks real bad , i seen you (brettm) in the 4wheel mag.i just dont want to break all the time , or have wheel soft or light to make it by.It all most seems like the max tire size for 44 is 35'', i have a 35'' bfg km and what some thing better( the rubicon. riped a 3 inch hole in the side wall last year) and i hear that is very comon thing.
on the rear, so 33 spline is better then a full floater kit?and should i still carry spares for the rear? thanks for all the help.
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  #13  
Old June 21st, 2006, 22:57
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Re: AXLES FOR 36 IROKS

Quote:
Originally Posted by oakesters
**I have a auto and i just cut the back half of my jeep, (like paul s and hinkly)i was thinking 4.88 or 5.13 for gears . and i want to go to jv/ moon rocks real bad , i seen you (brettm) in the 4wheel mag.i just dont want to break all the time , or have wheel soft or light to make it by.It all most seems like the max tire size for 44 is 35'', i have a 35'' bfg km and what some thing better( the rubicon. riped a 3 inch hole in the side wall last year) and i hear that is very comon thing.
on the rear, so 33 spline is better then a full floater kit?and should i still carry spares for the rear? thanks for all the help.
A lot depends on how you drive. If you have big tires, then use finesse and not throttle especially when you are caught in a wedge or some kind of bind, especially if you start bouncing and not moving and also if you have your steering cranked. An automatic helps lessen the impact quite a bit over a manual as does the right gearing. There will always be exceptions to the rules, but as a general rule of thumb look at what people are running on the trails you are wanting to run and see what setup they have their breakage. I run 37" MTRs (HP44/35 spline 9" alloys, OX u-joints, 4:1, 5.38/5.43s) and only have wheeled the Rubicon and Fordyce and don't get out nearly as much as Jes, Goatman, etc and these guys do the JV stuff that will eat you up and spit you out.

A good axle for up to a 37" tire are HP44/9" or 44/60 or 44/44 but use caution and drive smart not trying to show off because you'll be spending a lot of your time repairing what you broke. Crash has layed all this stuff out in his axle articles which is a great rule of thumb for extreme rock trails. Mud of course is a lot more forgiving as is an auto over a manual tranny.

Have fun and drive safe, that's my piece, I sure miss posting hear. I'll contain myself and leave it at that.

Troy
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  #14  
Old June 21st, 2006, 23:06
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BrettM BrettM is offline
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Re: AXLES FOR 36 IROKS

Quote:
Originally Posted by oakesters
**I have a auto and i just cut the back half of my jeep, (like paul s and hinkly)i was thinking 4.88 or 5.13 for gears . and i want to go to jv/ moon rocks real bad , i seen you (brettm) in the 4wheel mag.i just dont want to break all the time , or have wheel soft or light to make it by.It all most seems like the max tire size for 44 is 35'', i have a 35'' bfg km and what some thing better( the rubicon. riped a 3 inch hole in the side wall last year) and i hear that is very comon thing.
on the rear, so 33 spline is better then a full floater kit?and should i still carry spares for the rear? thanks for all the help.
what full float kit? If it's semi-float 33 spline alloys versus full-float 30 spline alloys, I'll take the 33 spliners. As for spares, it's always a good idea. If you had 1.5" alloy shafts front and rear I wouldn't bother with spares, but I know some people still would just incase.

2 questions:
First, are you set on 36" Iroks and why?
Second, do you want bulletproof or are you willing to break a shaft on rare occasion (and are you prepared to open your wallet to reflect the answer)?
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  #15  
Old June 21st, 2006, 23:29
oakesters oakesters is offline
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Re: AXLES FOR 36 IROKS

Quote:
Originally Posted by BrettM
what full float kit? If it's semi-float 33 spline alloys versus full-float 30 spline alloys, I'll take the 33 spliners. As for spares, it's always a good idea. If you had 1.5" alloy shafts front and rear I wouldn't bother with spares, but I know some people still would just incase.

2 questions:
First, are you set on 36" Iroks and why?
Second, do you want bulletproof or are you willing to break a shaft on rare occasion (and are you prepared to open your wallet to reflect the answer)?
** not set on 36 irok's like them and have see what they can do,Do you think there not a good tire? I want a good trail tire that can see the road too i drive to and from trail. no my dd anymore, got a lil honda. so noise /tire wear is not that big of a deal. was thinking of creepy crawlers and krawlers, and my wallet is allway open for my jeep. now that my jeep is more a trail rig i want to make it bulletproof, but i can work on my junk, and much is occasion?
** this is what i was thinking of...........
Ultimate 44.

Lets get down to assembling parts for the ultimate 44. Basically, Im describing the axle Jes and I just built for him, hes got a thread here: http://www.naxja.org/forum/showthread.php?t=36273

Id start with a Ford RS housing, narrowed to late model Waggy width. Id use Moog HD ball joints, Warn or Superior shafts, Crane or Parts Mike outer knuckles, OTT or Parts Mike high steer arms, an ARB or Ox Locker and Warn hubs. CTMs or OXs would be my joint of choice, though Longfields and Jantzz are more budget friendly. Built this way, a 44 is good for **36's, 37s if you have a light (sub-3500lb) vehicle. The weak link seems to be either the stub shaft or the hub, as they seem to break interchangeably.

With the advent of new parts, an even better 44 is now available. You can now run an ARB or OX with 33 or 35 spline inner axles. If you left the 19 spline outers you wouldnt be gaining anything. But, with a Warn spindle designed for 5 on5.5 Dana 30 application, you could run a 30 spline outer. I think the hub would then definitely be the weak link, but you could always run a Warn 30 spline drive flange for the ultimate in strength. I think this setup could stand up to 37s.

Last edited by oakesters; June 21st, 2006 at 23:31. Reason: sp
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