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  #1  
Old January 26th, 2007, 14:47
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Ecomike Ecomike is offline
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Renix oil filter adapter turned 90 degrees

Has anyone with a Renix 4.0 engine ever succesfully turned (rotated) their Renix oil filter adapter 90 degrees so that the original oil filter adapter faces the rear firewall, and the oil filter becomes a horizontal mount versus the OEM vertical position? If so did you have any clearance problems with the little tube coming out of the engine?

Also, if you did succeed, what did you do with the vapor collection canistor (where did you move it to.....)? Did you have any problems using the original Renix adapter to make the 90 degree turn modification?

For those of you wondering what I am talking about, I am looking at turning my 87 Renix 4.0 oil filter adapter 90 degrees and I am looking at changing the threaded connector to allow use of the newer larger oil filters.

Pictures and details of what I am talking about are at http://www.yuccaman.com/jeep/filter.html and at
http://www.madxj.com then go to the technical files and then the filter adapter mod link on madxj's site.

I have aquired a used oil filter adapter from a 96 xj and an earlier Renix and I am trying to decide which to use now. I have not pulled the oem off my 87 engine yet.
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  #2  
Old January 26th, 2007, 15:06
Zebaru Zebaru is offline
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Re: Renix oil filter adapter turned 90 degrees

I flipped the one on my 88 90 degrees so it is pointing back, and I can't say that I like it.

I still am using the original filter size, and it is a PITA to get out. I didn't have to relocate anything to do it, but I have to snake it in and around alot of wires and vacuum lines. A larger filter would be an even bigger pain.

I don't think it is worth the hassle, and when I swap this engine into my new rig, I will be rotating it back to vertical...

Travis
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Old January 26th, 2007, 15:30
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Re: Renix oil filter adapter turned 90 degrees

Once I get around to it, I plan to use a remote-mount filter and just hang the thing upside down somewhere a bit more convenient. I can't see any advantage to rotating the filter mount - there's too much in the way (and if I did, I'd want to hang it so it wouldn't get everywhere when I pull the filter off.)

If you end up not using those filter mounts you've got lying about, could I possibly talk you out of the "through screw" that mounts them? I need to collect a set so I can take measurements and redesign them (that 9/16" hex is a pain, I hear - and the T60 nearly impossible! AMC did it right when they put a 5/8" hex on top so you could put a wrench to it...)
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Old January 26th, 2007, 17:49
Tom R. Tom R. is offline
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Re: Renix oil filter adapter turned 90 degrees

I did it years ago and posted here several times how to do it and what part numbers to use. It wasn't very expensive to do using new parts. At least back then it wasn't. There was a write-up in JP mag how to do it, but that issued around '98. I'm not sure if the search function goes back that far and I don't have the information anymore. I might have that issue, but it'll take some time to locate it.

You just get new parts at the Stealership or junkyard from a model year XJ that came with it from the factory. However, buy new O-rings! I don't remember which year it first came on, but fairly certain parts from a '95 or '96 will work. You need the outer adapter, adapter tube, new O-rings, and maybe the bolt that keeps it all together, IIRC.

The benefits to doing this "mod" are:
  • Use of a larger, more common filter
  • Larger passages for better oil flow
  • Less of a mess when changing oil
The filter did not get in the way of anything and I found changing the oil filter to be less messy. It seems there was something about changing the direction of how the passenger side engine mount bolt was inserted into the mount. It wasn't a major issue from what I remember. Maybe the bolt needs to be inserted from the front side, with the nut toward the firewall. I think mine was already like that. Keep this in mind just in case.
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  #5  
Old January 27th, 2007, 13:25
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Re: Renix oil filter adapter turned 90 degrees

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zebaru
I flipped the one on my 88 90 degrees so it is pointing back, and I can't say that I like it.

I still am using the original filter size, and it is a PITA to get out. I didn't have to relocate anything to do it, but I have to snake it in and around alot of wires and vacuum lines. A larger filter would be an even bigger pain.

I don't think it is worth the hassle, and when I swap this engine into my new rig, I will be rotating it back to vertical...

Travis
My 87 Renix has a huge carbon vapor capture canistor right where the larger horizontal filter would try and go, at least if I went with the larger filter the vapor canistor would have to be moved for sure. With the 1/2 quart oem size filter it would be in the way when trying to change the filter, if it did not actually run into it. It would be very tight for sure.

Also I am not sure a horizontal filter would really be any better at keeping the filter from draining back into the oil pan when the engine is off, if and when the antidrain back valve failed to seal??????????????????????? Which is one of my primary motivations for thinking about changing the mounting direction.
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Old January 27th, 2007, 13:41
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Re: Renix oil filter adapter turned 90 degrees

Quote:
Originally Posted by 5-90
Once I get around to it, I plan to use a remote-mount filter and just hang the thing upside down somewhere a bit more convenient. I can't see any advantage to rotating the filter mount - there's too much in the way (and if I did, I'd want to hang it so it wouldn't get everywhere when I pull the filter off.)

If you end up not using those filter mounts you've got lying about, could I possibly talk you out of the "through screw" that mounts them? I need to collect a set so I can take measurements and redesign them (that 9/16" hex is a pain, I hear - and the T60 nearly impossible! AMC did it right when they put a 5/8" hex on top so you could put a wrench to it...)
The question is of course is where somewhere would be that one would place the remote filters??? I have looked at that option and so far decided it was more costly and involved than I really wanted to go at this stage, but I do like the fact that that option would turn the vertical filter upside down like they should have been in the first place.

5-90,

Do you still need all the through bolts, or have you aquired one or more styles yet? Once I figured out which one I am going to use here I will let know what is left if you still need one or more of them. So are there 2 hex bolt sizes, 9/16 and 5/8". Which years did the hex bolt versions show up, or do we know yet?

I may end up just reusing my original oil filter adpater, leave it vertical, and change the small coupling out (and orings which are leaking now) so I can go from the metric thread to the SAE thread which will allow me to use the larger 1 quart filters and just see how that goes for a bit. I also plan on using the K & N filters for now as I trust their anti drain back valve better.

Does anyone think, or know if the horizontal layout will really keep the filter from draining oil back out of the filter, if the antidrain back valve fails in the open position?

Zebaru,

Thanks for your answer, that was just the kind of "I tried it" info I was looking for!
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  #7  
Old January 27th, 2007, 13:51
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Re: Renix oil filter adapter turned 90 degrees

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom R.
I did it years ago and posted here several times how to do it and what part numbers to use. It wasn't very expensive to do using new parts. At least back then it wasn't. There was a write-up in JP mag how to do it, but that issued around '98. I'm not sure if the search function goes back that far and I don't have the information anymore. I might have that issue, but it'll take some time to locate it.

You just get new parts at the Stealership or junkyard from a model year XJ that came with it from the factory. However, buy new O-rings! I don't remember which year it first came on, but fairly certain parts from a '95 or '96 will work. You need the outer adapter, adapter tube, new O-rings, and maybe the bolt that keeps it all together, IIRC.

The benefits to doing this "mod" are:
  • Use of a larger, more common filter
  • Larger passages for better oil flow
  • Less of a mess when changing oil
The filter did not get in the way of anything and I found changing the oil filter to be less messy. It seems there was something about changing the direction of how the passenger side engine mount bolt was inserted into the mount. It wasn't a major issue from what I remember. Maybe the bolt needs to be inserted from the front side, with the nut toward the firewall. I think mine was already like that. Keep this in mind just in case.
Tom R.,

Interestingly enough I found the oil filter adapter o'rings at an O'Riely's auto parts late last night in a kit in the HELP section island of all places. It was $4.95 for the whole set.

What year is the jeep you modified?

Did you go from the hex head bolt version to the torx screw bolt version oil adapter?

Have you had any problems shorting out the starter solenoid when changing the oil filter????
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  #8  
Old January 27th, 2007, 16:04
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Re: Renix oil filter adapter turned 90 degrees

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ecomike
The question is of course is where somewhere would be that one would place the remote filters??? I have looked at that option and so far decided it was more costly and involved than I really wanted to go at this stage, but I do like the fact that that option would turn the vertical filter upside down like they should have been in the first place.

5-90,

Do you still need all the through bolts, or have you aquired one or more styles yet? Once I figured out which one I am going to use here I will let know what is left if you still need one or more of them. So are there 2 hex bolt sizes, 9/16 and 5/8". Which years did the hex bolt versions show up, or do we know yet?

I may end up just reusing my original oil filter adpater, leave it vertical, and change the small coupling out (and orings which are leaking now) so I can go from the metric thread to the SAE thread which will allow me to use the larger 1 quart filters and just see how that goes for a bit. I also plan on using the K & N filters for now as I trust their anti drain back valve better.

Does anyone think, or know if the horizontal layout will really keep the filter from draining oil back out of the filter, if the antidrain back valve fails in the open position?

Zebaru,

Thanks for your answer, that was just the kind of "I tried it" info I was looking for!
Well, I plan on relocating the battery from underhood to about centre (behind the front seats, I think,) which will free up that space for the remote oil filter mount.

As far as the through screws, here's what I "know" -
The RENIX (1987-1990, possibly some early OBD-I) used a 5/8" hex head on the screw, which took a regular box wrench.
Sometime during OBD-I, they seemed to transition to a 9/16" hex recess, requring the use of a 9/16" hex key to remove.
OBD-II seemed to want the use of the T55 or T60 Torx - even more difficult than the 9/16" hex.

I've got a loose RENIX screw doing nothing, but it's snapped in half. I'd like to get a solid RENIX screw - and I do need the other two. I'm working on a "parts wanted" page for WiP - which should make a handy reference for donors to the cause. It seems there is at least one change to the O-ring areas on these screws, so I'd like to get at least one of each. Better would be two - that would allow me to destroy one of each to make sure how they're made by the factory (I'm almost willing to bet they're sintered - which is good from a view of manufacturing cost, but sintered material can't handle the stress that wrought stock can. I'm also not sure about the installation torque I usually see - that seems a bit high, and is likely to "crush out" the O-rings...)
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Old January 27th, 2007, 18:07
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clunk clunk is offline
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Re: Renix oil filter adapter turned 90 degrees

I'm also interested, I'm finding the anti-drainback valves to be tempermental and I'd like to mod it to use something that would sit like a conventional filter on most vehicles. I seem to go around 300km's before the anti drainback valve on the cheap filters I'm using start to act up. Pretty much right on the dot after 300km's of changing the filter, I seem to lose a little oil pressure at startup.
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  #10  
Old January 27th, 2007, 19:07
Tom R. Tom R. is offline
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Re: Renix oil filter adapter turned 90 degrees

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ecomike
Tom R.,

Interestingly enough I found the oil filter adapter o'rings at an O'Riely's auto parts late last night in a kit in the HELP section island of all places. It was $4.95 for the whole set.

What year is the jeep you modified?

Did you go from the hex head bolt version to the torx screw bolt version oil adapter?

Have you had any problems shorting out the starter solenoid when changing the oil filter????
I did this mod on an '89.

I don't remember what the bolt was replaced with, if it was even replaced at all. It's been a long time.

I never shorted the starter solenoid.
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Old January 27th, 2007, 19:27
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Re: Renix oil filter adapter turned 90 degrees

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ecomike
Tom R.,

Interestingly enough I found the oil filter adapter o'rings at an O'Riely's auto parts late last night in a kit in the HELP section island of all places. It was $4.95 for the whole set.

What year is the jeep you modified?

Did you go from the hex head bolt version to the torx screw bolt version oil adapter?

Have you had any problems shorting out the starter solenoid when changing the oil filter????
Don't suppose you still have the part number for that Motormite kit, do you?
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  #12  
Old January 28th, 2007, 12:33
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Re: Renix oil filter adapter turned 90 degrees

Quote:
Originally Posted by 5-90
Don't suppose you still have the part number for that Motormite kit, do you?
It is part number 82560. The kit did have all the o'rings for the newer style Torqs bolt design oil filter adapter, but only had the adapter to engine block flange o'ring for the Renix version oil filter adapter. It did not have the 2 other Renix internal bolt o'rings.

The kit claimed to have the orings for the 1987-1996 versions. Makes me wonder if 1984-86 and 1997-2007 had something different?

The two Renix adapters and bolts I have are both exactly 5/8" hex bolts. Unfortunately a short socket and wratchet will not fit between the bolt and jeep frame, so I will be forced to use a box end wrench to remove it. I just hope I can get it loose. I need to get the other 2 o'rings next as I have decided to stay with the Renix adapter for now because I do not want to fight with a torqs bolt and the clearance issues.

I did notice that if the internal o'ring on the shaft goes bad (starts to leak internally) that it could lead to some oil pressure loss! Not sure if it is a significant loss, but they did put the oring in there for some reason! This applies to both style filter adapters!
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Old February 10th, 2007, 15:09
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Re: Renix oil filter adapter turned 90 degrees

Well the dirty deed is done! Last sunday (6 days ago) I worked on the 1 quart per 100 mile oil filter adapter leak.

I reused the '87 Renix oil filter adapter, replaced the o'rings (less than $5.00 at the dealer, and they were instock, NICE!) and swaped out the OEM '87 metric thread oil filter pipe nipple for the newer 3/4" SAE pipe nipple. Then I installed a new 1 quart oil filter in the vertical (87 OEM Style) direction.

But let me digress first. A few days earlier I swaped out the Quaker State oil filter (which I was under the wrong impression to be a relabled Fram, but it turned out to be a decent relabled Purolator, I think) for a Mobil 1 filter.

I saw no difference in start up oil pressure, cold, warm, or hot oil pressure, or oil pressure at various loads and rpms. The oil pressures were exactly the same for all operating conditions with both filters.

Then with the new 1 quart oil filter K & N Part #HP-3001 (which replaced the 1/2 quart OEM size filter) I noticed the following.

Took about 5 to 6 seconds to see oil pressure on the gauge during the first start up. Now the pressure comes up pretty fast at start up.

The oil pressure on the dash gauge, overall at all operating condisitions seems to be a bit higher now. I have monitored it for over 200 miles the last 6 days and it seems to have helped increase the oil pressure just a little. I am close to 60 psi at a first morning cold start now versus about 50 to 55 psi before switching to the larger oil filter.

Also the idle rpm oil pressure when hot seems to be about 5 psi higher now as well.

The lowest oil pressure, hot idle just after a long hot highway run for 30 minutes, with the water coolant at about 190 F, is about 22 to 23 PSI, where as before I had seen it as low as 18 to 19 psi. Also once I slow down to neighborhood speeds (less than 40 mph) for a few minutes the hot idle oil pressure comes back up much more quickly than before and to a higher idle oil pressure of about 28 to 29 psi.

Still not 100% sure if it is just the new oil and new filter media effect I am seeing at the hot oil idle condition, but it definetly has raised the engine oil pressure at least 5 psi (if not 10 psi) for most of the other operating temperatures, and rpms. The hot oil pressure at 60 mph, 2000 rpm is running 33 to 40 psi, versus 28 to 30 before.

The current oil is a slightly different mix (from what I had a few weeks ago) currently of 5w-50 Castrol synthetic (about 35%), 20W50 Castrol Syntech (part synthetic, part dyno, about 40%) and some Exxon straight dyno 40Wt (about 20%) and some Quaker state 20W50 (maybe 10%).

Since the recent leaks were so huge and the crankcase oil was mostly brand new, I only topped off what was still in the engine after fixing the leak and doing the filter modification.

During the last few weeks (3 weeks) of the big leak, I was replacing leaking 20W50 Quaker State with Castrol 5W50 synthetic at first*, and towards the end with 40 wt Exxon dyno oil.

I saw very little if any change in the oil pressure readings during the last weeks when I was using the different oils to replace the leaked oils.

One last note! I think the oil filter adapter leak started when I used a 1/2 quart of Marvel mystery oil and 1/2 quart of Risolene oil additive during my last oil change about four weeks ago to help with lifter noise. I thought the two additives had just burned off quickly (which is normal) and replaced the first lost quart with a trial of partial synthetic for the first time, 5W50 Castrol 100% synthetic.

It was obviously Leak City at the oil filter adapter after that. The o'rings were flat, hard and brittle so the additives and synthtic oil must have cleaned the trash out that was still sealing the oil filter adapter o'rings before I used the additives and synthetic oil.

Conclusions:

I like the new larger oil filter in the vertical position!!!!!
I am getting more oil flow and pressure to the engine!

The leak has stopped!!!!!
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