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Anyone running the Clayton four link rear.

Nuke Proof

NAXJA Forum User
I have the front long arm from them and the guys at Clayton probably have the best customer support and products I have ever seen. For that reason now that I want to upgrade my rear suspension I want to spend my money with them. However, before I do that I want to know if it works better than the leafs, or if it is just a cool factor.

If you have it, how well does it perform on the street? Does it stay stable under heavy acceleration and braking?

Thanks guys
 
You're not going to go anywhere you couldn't go with leafs.

Geometry will be a compromise, links will go through the floor, or links will mount way under the frame.

It will cost significantly more than a good pair of leaf packs and a good pair of shocks.
 
I dont understand that eather? A 4 link is going to out flex leafs no matter what. TJ's and JK's run them and there full body rigs and do great. Look at TNT Customs XJ that has a rear link set up, that thing is mad flexy and most deff will out flex any leaf.

Im getting ready to build a rear 4 link. Lowers will mount ot the bottom of the frame and uppers will mount inside against the frame.
 
I dont understand that eather? A 4 link is going to out flex leafs no matter what. TJ's and JK's run them and there full body rigs and do great. Look at TNT Customs XJ that has a rear link set up, that thing is mad flexy and most deff will out flex any leaf.

Im getting ready to build a rear 4 link. Lowers will mount ot the bottom of the frame and uppers will mount inside against the frame.


Then read it again.
He did not say a 4 link won't flex. He's saying that proper geometry on a full bodied rig will require hacking into the body for the uppers, because nobody wants to reduce ground clearance by putting the lowers under the frame, right? Even stock XJ front leaf mounts don't hang below the frame.
Mad flex with loss of ground clearance works great on a ramp. Slightly less flex, without a frame mounted rock anchor, works great on the trail.
 
I have a four link rear and I think it would not be a useful modification to a full body rig.
I do as well, and I disagree for the most part.
Those bolt on kits aren't worth the cash IMO for what they gain you over a leaf setup. That's not to say that the Clayton kit is well built for the most part though.
A good friend of mine runs a full body XJ with a rear four-link on coils that works very well; almost as good as mine even and I'm not near full body in the rear. His lower mounts are at frame level.
You're not going to go anywhere you couldn't go with leafs.

Geometry will be a compromise, links will go through the floor, or links will mount way under the frame.

It will cost significantly more than a good pair of leaf packs and a good pair of shocks.
Agree on the 1st line.

Nah, not so much. What's a little bit of floor trimming anyway? If you really need the benefits of a 4 link a little bit of floor trimming sure isn't going to stop you at all.

Again, kit version that gains you not a whole lot other than ramp scores? Sure. Build you own? Eh, it'd be mighty close.
I dont understand that eather? A 4 link is going to out flex leafs no matter what. TJ's and JK's run them and there full body rigs and do great. Look at TNT Customs XJ that has a rear link set up, that thing is mad flexy and most deff will out flex any leaf.
Flex is not everything. Without weight and traction on the tire I don't care if it flexes seven miles, its useless.
 
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After purchasing all your own materials, I have a feeling you'll still be ahead moneywise just buying leaves/shocks.

I've yet to be held back by my leaf springs (though I added a traction bar). I actually enjoy the stability they provide. If I was going to 4-link the back, I'd go straight to coilovers which makes it significantly more expensive.
 
Thanks guys. As far as hacking the truck up, I'm not really worried about that. I asked about on road behaviors just to have the knowledge of whether or not I could drive it into town every once in a while.

I have tried to design a four link for the rear of this jeep but with all the calc's I can find are for a drag car. With our jeeps the center of gravity is much higher, which places the anti squat line at a much steeper angle. Additionally, I have NO IDEA where to put the instant center in relation to the anti squat line. I've debated just designing it two ways. First would be to put the frame mounts all in a line, so the suspension behaves like a ladder bar, but has the flex of 8 mounting places. The other was to place the instant center on the squat line at the center of gravity, but I can't get a definitive answer on whether this would work or not.

So I haven't done either in fear of spending the money on building a suspension that might be a complete disaster. At least with a drag car the mounting points have multiple holes to fine tune the suspension, but here you get one shot.

If anyone could answer these questions I would really appreciate it.

Thanks
 
my neighbor has this kit on his XJ and daily drives it about 40 miles a day. it rides on the road great but obviously has more body roll. sway bar with discos or maybe an anti-rock are needed of course
 
I've yet to be held back by my leaf springs (though I added a traction bar). I actually enjoy the stability they provide. If I was going to 4-link the back, I'd go straight to coilovers which makes it significantly more expensive.

I agree. I've been toying with the idea of a 4-link rear for a while now but will need to make up my mind soon as I think this was the last season on my current setup. If I do a 4-link it will be custom and I will go with coilovers largely due to their adjustabilty. One downside, other than cost, is I'd probably want some sort of swaybar (Antirock) on there for stability as well and that also adds to the cost and more work...

As far as cutting into the floor, I'm not entirely opposed to it for the uppers, because I'd rather do that than hang the lowers off the frame rail. But how much separation do you need on that end, realistically speaking?

The other option was new leafs, wheelbase stretch, and traction bar.
 
I agree. I've been toying with the idea of a 4-link rear for a while now but will need to make up my mind soon as I think this was the last season on my current setup. If I do a 4-link it will be custom and I will go with coilovers largely due to their adjustabilty. One downside, other than cost, is I'd probably want some sort of swaybar (Antirock) on there for stability as well and that also adds to the cost and more work...

As far as cutting into the floor, I'm not entirely opposed to it for the uppers, because I'd rather do that than hang the lowers off the frame rail. But how much separation do you need on that end, realistically speaking?

The other option was new leafs, wheelbase stretch, and traction bar.

I don't know anyone personally that runs a swaybar in addition to coilovers for stability as the coilovers provide enough.

Not sure on the separation you'd need. I haven't done any research on it.

I'm at ~115" for wheelbase, with MJ leaves (obviously) and a traction bar from Ruffstuff. So far the wheelbase on 40" tires is perfect and the traction bar kills any wrap I had. Enough flex for me to be content (prob around 8-10").
 
Clayton products are hands down top notch. I would definitely recommend their products. He knows what he is doing.

Difference between links and leafs in a nutshell.
Leafs hold he axle in place and are used as a spring for the suspension so with that you never know exactly where your axle is going to be it can get pushed sideways or have axle wrap (winds up from axle torque) which can bind U-joints and bump stops are hard to get to last under the leafs.
But leafs are very staple it has pretty high roll center so you don't get much lean and the roll center doesn't move so very predictable. Leafs springs neutral position is not fully extended so you don't get the push off that coils have (coils neutral position is fully extended) That is why links sway more.
Leafs are also very easy to mount hard to mess up 4 points.

Leafs work very well for smaller wheeling rigs which you probably fall into that class no offense but once you start driving your rig like a buggy up and off every cliff and in very weird angles that's when you need a higher built rig.

Links are better but harder to setup and get the numbers right. setup right they can climb better have less wheel hop better approach depproach angles, and stronger, the axle stay where they were put so you can now have a good idea where the bump stops should go and you know things are going to clear.


You will probably be fine with leafs. I compete in RCrocs class 2 with a CJ leafs front and rear they work good for all the normal obstacles but when the get big like large drops and climbs that's where I fall short to the linked guys. I usually come in second to a guy running Clayton kit. I've done everything I can to limit my link travel I only have about 3" up travel in teh front and reversed the shackles and went to slider boxes got the heavy duty rubicon express spring over springs and still bend/break leaf springs on a regular basis I also need to use the high angle u-joints to prevent the axle wrap from binding my joints but I wheel the crap out of my rig driving on 1 tire to save rolls is normal I usually roll every time I'm out because I'm pushing the limits. I also snap D60 shafts on 35" tires.


I have tried to design a four link for the rear of this jeep but with all the calc's I can find are for a drag car. With our jeeps the center of gravity is much higher, which places the anti squat line at a much steeper angle. Additionally, I have NO IDEA where to put the instant center in relation to the anti squat line. I've debated just designing it two ways. First would be to put the frame mounts all in a line, so the suspension behaves like a ladder bar, but has the flex of 8 mounting places. The other was to place the instant center on the squat line at the center of gravity, but I can't get a definitive answer on whether this would work or not.
Thanks

You've just totally confused me.

Search pirate4x4 for 4link info racedezert has good info too.
Search for the 4link program excel program for calculating 4links anti squat roll center etc. the hard part is knowing what numbers you want.
Basically comes down to what you think is best and try it usually it will work some just work better.

So a Clayton 4 link kit will take a lot of guess work out of the picture. You know you will get something that will work great out of the box.

Good luck
~Justin
 
TNT cherokee doesn't have that much crazy flex Chad... rear 4 link is a waste of time on a cherokee unless you are planing on wheeling super hardcore and have more tube than cherokee.
 
You've just totally confused me.

Search pirate4x4 for 4link info racedezert has good info too.
Search for the 4link program excel program for calculating 4links anti squat roll center etc. the hard part is knowing what numbers you want.
Basically comes down to what you think is best and try it usually it will work some just work better.

Good luck
~Justin

What confused you?
 
My antisquat is around 70%. I have a few degrees of roll oversteer but it is decent on the street, single triangulated four link. My links are nearly flat and the axle end of the uppers are a few inches above the diff. Enjoy all the tail you will pull with your mad flex.
 
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