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  #1  
Old October 15th, 2010, 23:22
ribich12 ribich12 is offline
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"no bus" + Transmission light.?? 2000 Cherokee Classic help!!

tonight my Jeep left me on the side of the road.. I went to turn it on and it fired up and then died after about a second and a half. The needles on the gauges are not moving. The dash is getting power when I turn on the headlights but, the gauges do not respond--even when the engine is running for that second. I took out the instrument cluster and checked the mounted connections. They are not corroded and have no moisture on them. Is this a computer control module problem?? on the odometer it is showing "no bus" and the tranny light is on too. My tranny light is never on. The Jeep just got a new battery this August and is a 2000 Cherokee Classic. I am really pissed at this problem and hope you guys can help me out!!
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  #2  
Old October 15th, 2010, 23:40
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Tim_MN Tim_MN is offline
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Re: "no bus" + Transmission light.?? 2000 Cherokee Classic help!!

Does the starter make the engine turn ? Does the engine try to run ?

Do you mean the Check Engine Light symbol? There is no tranny light.

Does your Cherokee have the factory installed Anti-Theft system ? Do you have the thick gray plastic keys or normal thin black keys ?
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Last edited by Tim_MN; October 15th, 2010 at 23:45.
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  #3  
Old October 16th, 2010, 00:30
ribich12 ribich12 is offline
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Re: "no bus" + Transmission light.?? 2000 Cherokee Classic help!!

Hey tim! Thanks for the quick reply. Yes, the engine starts normally and idles for a second--then it just dies. While running the gauges don't respond at all. I have thick grey keys. Yeah, I guess that must be the check engine light. But it doesn't say "Check Engine" It has a little symbol--(I guess I miss took fora tranny symbol". As far as "anti-theft" I have no clue. I dont think so tho.
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Old October 16th, 2010, 00:38
joe_peters joe_peters is offline
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Re: "no bus" + Transmission light.?? 2000 Cherokee Classic help!!

Getting the "NO BUS", try unplugging the crank sensor--if the gauges will light up with the crank sensor unplugged then the sensor has shorted to ground and must be replaced.
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Old October 16th, 2010, 01:43
ribich12 ribich12 is offline
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Re: "no bus" + Transmission light.?? 2000 Cherokee Classic help!!

Where is the crank sensor located?
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Old October 16th, 2010, 04:09
soopergoober soopergoober is offline
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Re: "no bus" + Transmission light.?? 2000 Cherokee Classic help!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by joe_peters View Post
Getting the "NO BUS", try unplugging the crank sensor--if the gauges will light up with the crank sensor unplugged then the sensor has shorted to ground and must be replaced.
x2 I'm also thinking crank sensor

It's located on the transmission bellhousing - drivers side, toward the top. If you imagine the bellhousing when looked at from' the rear of the vehicle as a clock face it should be near 10 or 11 o'clock. It's just a magnetic sensor held in by two bolts.
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Old October 16th, 2010, 10:21
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Re: "no bus" + Transmission light.?? 2000 Cherokee Classic help!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by ribich12 View Post
...... went to turn it on and it fired up and then died after about a second and a half.
This is a common symptom when the factory anti-theft system (SKIM) is misbehaving. The SKIM indicator light is a key symbol inside a slashed circle in the upper left hand side of the cluster. Think No Parking, but with a key symbol instead. Thicker keys with a light gray color are a sign that your Cherokee has the SKIM.

Google or search for info on the SKIM.


Quote:
Originally Posted by ribich12 View Post
..... The needles on the gauges are not moving. .... on the odometer it is showing "no bus" and the tranny light is on too.
The No-Bus and gauge problems point to a a CPS problem. Test the CPS and inspect the wire harness.


The most likely cause of it cranks and cranks but won't start up is the Crankshaft Position Sensor (CPS) located on the transmission bell housing. Often this part is also referred to as the CranKshaft Position Sensor (CKP) CPS/CKP failure is very common. The CPS/CKP can stop working with no warning or symptoms and the engine will not run or the engine may randomly stall for no apparent reason.


Begin with basic trouble shooting of the start and charge systems. Remove, clean, and firmly reconnect all the wires and cables to the battery, starter, and alternator. Look for corroded or damaged cables or connectors and replace as needed. Do the same for the grounding wires from the starter to engine block, and from the battery and engine to the Jeep's frame/body. Jeeps do not tolerate low voltage or poor grounds and the ECM/ECU may behave oddly until you remedy this.


Symptoms –
- Starter cranks and cranks but engine won't start up and run.
- Fuel gauge and voltage gauge may not work or display properly.
- You sometimes will have No Bus on the odometer after 30-60 seconds.
- A failed CPS/CKP may or may not throw a CEL trouble code.
- No spark at the spark plugs.
- Fuel pump should run and prime for 3-5 seconds.

If the CPS/CKP is failed sometimes the OBD-II trouble code reader cannot make a connection to the ECU/computer or cannot read Check Engine Light/MIL codes because the CPS/CKP has failed. Disconnect the code reader, disconnect the CPS/CKP wire connector, and reconnect the code reader. If the code reader establishes contact with the ECU and scans, your CPS/CKP is failed and needs to be replaced.

Crank Position Sensors can have intermittent “thermal failure”. This means that the CPS/CKP fails when the engine gets hot, but works again (and will test as “good”) when it cools back down.



Diagnostic steps to confirm the CPS is the cause of your no-start


You should be able to verify a bad cps, by unplugging it, and turning the ignition key to on. If the voltage gauge and/or the fuel gauge now displays correctly and/or the No-Bus is gone, replace the CPS.

If the CEL does not come on when the key is turned to the RUN position... then the CPS/CKP is bad.


Unplugging and reconnecting the CPS sensor where it connect to the main harness near the back of the intake manifold usually resets the ECU and if the jeep fires right up after doing this you can bet that the CPS is faulty and needs to be replaced.

The 2000 and 2001 will have the CPS in the same location on the bell housing, but the wire connector is near the Transfer Case, not as shown in the diagram below. Simply follow the wire from the sensor to the connector.

Exchange the fuel pump relay and the ASD relay with one of the other similar ones in the PDC to eliminate the relays as the cause of the no-start. Check the ASD relay fuse.

Confirm that the fuel pump to runs for 3-5 seconds when you turn the ignition key to ON.

Eliminate the NSS as a cause of no start. Wiggle the shift lever at the same time you try to start. Put the transmission in Neutral and do the same. Do the reverse lights come on when the shifter is in Reverse?

Inspect the wires and wire connectors at the O2 sensors on the exhausts pipe. A short circuit from melted insulation or from broken O2 sensor wires can blow a fuse and the ECU/ECM will loose communication. Don’t get tunnel vision and assume the sensor is bad (unless it tests bad with a meter). Damaged wiring or a dirty connector can inhibit the signal from making it to the computer. Inspect/test/clean/repair wiring or connectors as necessary.


CPS Testing


Crankshaft Position Sensor Connector (CPS/CKP)



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TESTING PROCEDURE 1991 – 2001 4.0L H.O. engines

1. Near the rear of intake manifold, disconnect sensor pigtail harness connector from main wiring harness.
2. Place an ohmmeter across terminals B and C (See Image). Ohmmeter should be set to 1K-to-1OK scale for this test.
3. The meter reading should be open (infinite resistance). Replace sensor if a low resistance is indicated.

TESTING PROCECURE for 1987 – 1990 4.0 L engines

Test # 1 - Get a volt/ohm meter and set it to read 0 - 500 ohms. Unplug the CPS and measure across the CPS connector's A & B leads. Your meter should show a CPS resistance of between 125 – 275 Ohms. . If the CPS is out of that range by much, replace it.

Test # 2 - You'll need a helper for this one. Set the volt/ohm meter to read 0 - 5 AC volts or the closest AC Volts scale your meter has to this range. Measure across the CPS leads for voltage generated as your helper cranks the engine. (The engine can't fire up without the CPS connected but watch for moving parts just the same!) The meter should show .5 - .8 VAC when cranking. (That's between 1/2 and 1 volt AC.) If it's below .5vac, replace it.


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If this information has been helpful, please click on the "thumbs up" icon on the bottom right side of this section.

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Quote:
Originally Posted by bimmerjeeper


Go ahead and slam the liftgate down on a blanket, and see how long you are laughing.

Last edited by Tim_MN; October 16th, 2010 at 10:25.
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  #8  
Old November 2nd, 2010, 21:37
Scorpion8 Scorpion8 is offline
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Re: "no bus" + Transmission light.?? 2000 Cherokee Classic help!!

Ribich12....did you ever solve this on yours?
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  #9  
Old March 19th, 2011, 18:59
Chowderr Chowderr is offline
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Re: "no bus" + Transmission light.?? 2000 Cherokee Classic help!!

I have the same symptoms as original poster, but I disconnected the cps then there were still nothing on my gauges. I put some starter fluid in the intake and it tried to run but just kept cranking with out turning over. Right now I'm thinking it is the fuel pump. Is there any way I can isolate this problem and would this cause the gauge problem and the no bus problem? It isn't throwing any codes.
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  #10  
Old March 19th, 2011, 21:40
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Tim_MN Tim_MN is offline
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Re: "no bus" + Transmission light.?? 2000 Cherokee Classic help!!

Total instrument cluster failure is most often caused by corroded connections right behind the cluster. The Jeep will run and drive if the cluster is non-functional.

Test the CPS. It is faster, cheaper and easier to replace than the fuel pump.

If you hear the fuel pump run and prime for 3-5 seconds when you turn on the ignition, it is fine.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bimmerjeeper


Go ahead and slam the liftgate down on a blanket, and see how long you are laughing.

Last edited by Tim_MN; March 19th, 2011 at 21:43.
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  #11  
Old March 19th, 2011, 21:42
Chowderr Chowderr is offline
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Re: "no bus" + Transmission light.?? 2000 Cherokee Classic help!!

I tested it and it wasnt it. I replaced it anyways because i had one on hand. and I am not hearing the fuel pump run.
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  #12  
Old March 25th, 2011, 00:32
joe_peters joe_peters is offline
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Re: "no bus" + Transmission light.?? 2000 Cherokee Classic help!!

The most COMMON cause of the NO BUS and no gauges is the crank position sensor shorted to ground. In this situation unplugging the shorted crank sensor will usually allow the gauges to function.

However, ANY of the sensors that receive reference voltage from the PCM could also cause this same problem. Try disconnecting all of the sensors one at a time and checking the gauges.
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